Crazy Eddie
Genial drunkard
- Joined
- Sep 22, 2001
- Messages
- 880
I've heard the Germans were pretty peeved with the Japanese - at least a third of all US aid to Russia was sent to Vladivostok, travelling past the Japanese home islands in US built ships.
World War II
- Thread starter willemvanoranje
- Start date
joespaniel
Unescorted Settler
True fact; the Germans we're developing a guided missle!
It was a glider bomb that had a window in the front with a compartment behind it. Inside the compartment was a hungry pidgeon trained to peck at a picture of a ship with its beak (by rewarding it with food). The glass of the window was actualy a steering wheel, mechanicaly connected to the rudders of the glider-bomb so the pushing of the bird would literaly steer the bomb, right into a ship! A big improvement over the non-guided glider bombs which were very inaccurate, but still sometimes our feathered friends just were'nt up to the job. Maybe they were allied sympathizers. Anyway it was never used in combat.
It was a glider bomb that had a window in the front with a compartment behind it. Inside the compartment was a hungry pidgeon trained to peck at a picture of a ship with its beak (by rewarding it with food). The glass of the window was actualy a steering wheel, mechanicaly connected to the rudders of the glider-bomb so the pushing of the bird would literaly steer the bomb, right into a ship! A big improvement over the non-guided glider bombs which were very inaccurate, but still sometimes our feathered friends just were'nt up to the job. Maybe they were allied sympathizers. Anyway it was never used in combat.
Case
The horror, the horror
Originally posted by joespaniel
True fact; the Germans we're developing a guided missle!
It was a glider bomb that had a window in the front with a compartment behind it. Inside the compartment was a hungry pidgeon trained to peck at a picture of a ship with its beak (by rewarding it with food). The glass of the window was actualy a steering wheel, mechanicaly connected to the rudders of the glider-bomb so the pushing of the bird would literaly steer the bomb, right into a ship! A big improvement over the non-guided glider bombs which were very inaccurate, but still sometimes our feathered friends just were'nt up to the job. Maybe they were allied sympathizers. Anyway it was never used in combat.
The Germans also designed a coal powered orbital bomber
Siggy
Where's the Guinness?
You're mixing up things, pall. The first winter the Germans were freezing to death. They wore everything to keep warm. Stalingrad was cut off before the real Russian winter began. They flew in supply. Simply said: they could surrender comfy and warm but without bullets or fight to keep warm with ammo. Apparently they choose the last option.
BTW there were almost no german tanks who couldn't knock out a t-34 late in the war, so far your post is rubbish too. Tip: read more books. (and don't forget Band of brothers, got it yesterday and it is superb)
Siggy
Where's the Guinness?
PZ IV was dangerous when in hands of an experienced crew. Even an early version pz IV could knock out a t-34. Espessialy at short ranges. The big problem for the Panther and Tiger was that they were pressed in service too early. The later versions were as reliable as the pz IV
Don't you generalize things like hell? That is true that Germans didnt have adequate supplies of fuel at the end of the war but yes there were counterattacks: should I mention operation Waldteufel, op. Konrad, or the Battle of the Bulge?
History is not that simple!
It's OK to watch movies (=German troops at Stalingrad) but don't take every detail granted there. There is a movie (in Hungarian ) titled 'The Real Mao' which is a fake documentary movie about Mao Ze Dong. It is a kind of test how much you believe - there were people that believed it all because it uses the techniques of documentary movies.
However I guess the evaluation of historical sources and the movies created from them could be another thread, so I dont want to be offtopic.
History is not that simple!
It's OK to watch movies (=German troops at Stalingrad) but don't take every detail granted there. There is a movie (in Hungarian
) titled 'The Real Mao' which is a fake documentary movie about Mao Ze Dong. It is a kind of test how much you believe - there were people that believed it all because it uses the techniques of documentary movies. However I guess the evaluation of historical sources and the movies created from them could be another thread, so I dont want to be offtopic.
VanOranje
God-Emperor
Wasnt this because he had a shortage of fuel and oil??? He went further south because of the oil fields in the south of russia. Or iam I wrong. ?
Greetz.,
Le Petit Prince
Communist Comrade
we where talking about the end of the war no? I read THE book to read which is the Battle of Stalingrad...It is said numerous times that It was worst than people think due to German and russian propaganda...I'm sure german didnt make some counter attack because of the lack of fuel...If not why German didnt continue their advance during winters... but they didnt need in the first winter cause russian didnt have the tanks to attack...but in the second winter...russian had the tanks to conduct attack in winter...they were also much more but...
what is Band of Brothers??? movie or book
sorry here to have some difficulties to defend my points of view in english...I'm french
what is Band of Brothers??? movie or book
sorry here to have some difficulties to defend my points of view in english...I'm french
Whiskey Priest
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2001
- Messages
- 297
A good book to read about the American-British relations between 1939-41 is A Man called Intrepid (I think that is what it was called) very interesting stuff about Enigma (the "unbeatable" german code) Lend-Lease and Allied Special Ops during war (Including the "failed" invasion at Dieppe in 1942, not very much is known about this op outside Canada)
Did you know there was an actual Commander James Bond, who was a British Agent during the war. Pretty cool huh!
Did you know there was an actual Commander James Bond, who was a British Agent during the war. Pretty cool huh!
joespaniel
Unescorted Settler
To Van Oranje -
The drive on the caucassus in 1942 (and Stalingrad) was a drive for oil as well as a flanking maneuver against Moscow. Truth is, Hitler was afraid to attack Moscow directly after getting his @$$ kicked at the gates of the Capitol in 1941.
In 1941, the drive south to Kiev was to entrap a pesky Soviet army that wouldn't die. It infuriated Hitler, but it really could have been easily contained and dealt with after Moscow was captured. This was pointed out to Hitler by Guderian, who could have lost his command (maybe his life!) for contradicting Hitler. It was no good.
Hitler ordered a massive wheeling movement of Guderians armor south to Kiev and smashed the Soviets. It took months to organize, execute and then redeploy the armor towards Moscow.
By that time, the Reds dug in and fortified.
The going got tougher and tougher. The autumn rains turned the dirt roads and fields to slop. Then the cold came. The worst Russian winter since records were kept. The whole attack faltered.
By December, the tank oil was frozen in the engines. Frostbite was claiming German soldiers by the thousands every night. Russian resistance became fanatical. Workers with no training were organized as battalions to fight off the closing Germans. Everything they had was being thrown into the defense of Moscow.
And some Germans were so close they could see they Kremlin! Hitler ordered attack after attack, but it was impossible. The German armies were bled white. Fresh Soviet divisions from Siberia were arriving and going into the line.
Then, just days before the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor half the world away, Stalin unleashed his counteroffensive. Over 100 divisions strong, including armor, cavalry, ski troops, paratroopers and partisans to name a few. The Germans reeled back, never to see Moscow again, except as POWs.
The argument is that if Guderian had been allowed to take Moscow when it was weaker, they would have had months to fortify and even drive to the Urals! Whatever may have been, its a tragedy and testiment to the stupidity of Hitler.
He wouldn't listen to his generals. He underestimated the Soviets over and over. He bullied everyone until he met a bigger bully. Stalin.
Fortunately for us, Hitler was his own worst enemy.
The drive on the caucassus in 1942 (and Stalingrad) was a drive for oil as well as a flanking maneuver against Moscow. Truth is, Hitler was afraid to attack Moscow directly after getting his @$$ kicked at the gates of the Capitol in 1941.
In 1941, the drive south to Kiev was to entrap a pesky Soviet army that wouldn't die. It infuriated Hitler, but it really could have been easily contained and dealt with after Moscow was captured. This was pointed out to Hitler by Guderian, who could have lost his command (maybe his life!) for contradicting Hitler. It was no good.
Hitler ordered a massive wheeling movement of Guderians armor south to Kiev and smashed the Soviets. It took months to organize, execute and then redeploy the armor towards Moscow.
By that time, the Reds dug in and fortified.
The going got tougher and tougher. The autumn rains turned the dirt roads and fields to slop. Then the cold came. The worst Russian winter since records were kept. The whole attack faltered.
By December, the tank oil was frozen in the engines. Frostbite was claiming German soldiers by the thousands every night. Russian resistance became fanatical. Workers with no training were organized as battalions to fight off the closing Germans. Everything they had was being thrown into the defense of Moscow.
And some Germans were so close they could see they Kremlin! Hitler ordered attack after attack, but it was impossible. The German armies were bled white. Fresh Soviet divisions from Siberia were arriving and going into the line.
Then, just days before the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor half the world away, Stalin unleashed his counteroffensive. Over 100 divisions strong, including armor, cavalry, ski troops, paratroopers and partisans to name a few. The Germans reeled back, never to see Moscow again, except as POWs.
The argument is that if Guderian had been allowed to take Moscow when it was weaker, they would have had months to fortify and even drive to the Urals! Whatever may have been, its a tragedy and testiment to the stupidity of Hitler.
He wouldn't listen to his generals. He underestimated the Soviets over and over. He bullied everyone until he met a bigger bully. Stalin.
Fortunately for us, Hitler was his own worst enemy.
Yes, the Soviets traded men and space for time. They knew that time was on their side and as the war dragged on, the odds for the Soviets would only get better. The Germans couldn't replace their battle losses (men) but the Soviets could (several times over). So as the war in the East dragged on, the initiative eventually returned to the Soviets and they counter-attked like hell.
Hitler was blinded by his own successes. Against the professional opinions of his generals, he pushed them to take back the Rhineland and take over Sudetenland and Austria, then invaded Poland, France and the Low Countries successfully. So as his successes mounted, he believed himself to be the greatest strategist of all times and so kept overriding his generals in the conduct of the war.
Hitler was blinded by his own successes. Against the professional opinions of his generals, he pushed them to take back the Rhineland and take over Sudetenland and Austria, then invaded Poland, France and the Low Countries successfully. So as his successes mounted, he believed himself to be the greatest strategist of all times and so kept overriding his generals in the conduct of the war.
Siggy
Where's the Guinness?
It is a book. I heard it is produced as a tv-series also. It is on US TV I believe. Read some comments on it on another forum. The book is from a author called Ambrose. It is about some paratroopers from 506th airborne regiment (or was it battalion?) serving with the 101 airborne division.
I hope the tv-serie will reach the european channels soon!
time
Chieftain
Band of Brothers is on HBO every sunday night at 9:00, great show.
Le Petit Prince
Communist Comrade
HEy! I'm french but I live in quebec (we speak french) so I live in america...but I dont have HBO
so everybody agree with me now...few posts away everybody was against me...
So I ask my question again: Why did Hilter didnt believe that if he had take the capital he wouldnt not have won the war against USSR ??? Ok for Kiev but why did he have not went directly for Moskva?
willemvanoranje
Curitibano
Errr....after a long time of decoding....
Hitler just thought that the conquest of Moscow wouldn't result in a strategic advance. He thought Leningrad was more important, because it was a big city with a lot of troops. Besides, Murmansk could be cut of more easy from there. And he went for the Kaukasus (Stalingrad) for the oil that can be found there. As we all know, oil is something Germany really needed.
Hitler just thought that the conquest of Moscow wouldn't result in a strategic advance. He thought Leningrad was more important, because it was a big city with a lot of troops. Besides, Murmansk could be cut of more easy from there. And he went for the Kaukasus (Stalingrad) for the oil that can be found there. As we all know, oil is something Germany really needed.
"And he went for the Kaukasus (Stalingrad) for the oil that can be found there."
Stalingrad is not located in the Caucasus which is a region somewhat south of that. It is a city on the Volga which guards the way to the Caucasus. The Wehrmacht units that did reach the Caucasus had to pull back after the 6th Army (I think) surrendered in Stalingrad after being surrounded by the Soviets during the Battle of Stalingrad.
Stalingrad is not located in the Caucasus which is a region somewhat south of that. It is a city on the Volga which guards the way to the Caucasus. The Wehrmacht units that did reach the Caucasus had to pull back after the 6th Army (I think) surrendered in Stalingrad after being surrounded by the Soviets during the Battle of Stalingrad.
willemvanoranje
Curitibano
I know, I know. But on the way to the Kaukasus, he was stopped at Stalingrad.
joespaniel
Unescorted Settler
... by a good Russian @$$ kicking!
Stalingrad was another turning point for an already faltering German campaign in Russia. I don't have time to spin tales today, though. I have to go to work, maybe this weekend.
The Sovs lost over 800,000 people at Stalingrad. The city was reduced to a rubble heap. It was also the grave site of the German Sixth Army...
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