Wow....plus SMAC mod reborn!

I wonder if it would be possible to include orbital stuff in the gamemap(s). What I mean is could the energy satellites, skyfarms and so on from SMAC be depicted on the global view if they will are to be included in the mod? Like the "dots" on the planetary view screen in SMAC?
Would be nice if a sort of "orbital war" concept was included and viewable.
 
GeoModder said:
I wonder if it would be possible to include orbital stuff in the gamemap(s). What I mean is could the energy satellites, skyfarms and so on from SMAC be depicted on the global view if they will are to be included in the mod? Like the "dots" on the planetary view screen in SMAC?
Would be nice if a sort of "orbital war" concept was included and viewable.
Click to expand...

The problem with the globe view is that it's not a real-time view of the world. It takes a "picture" of the world, makes it a texture, and then puts that texture onto a globe, and that's the world view. Thus, any changes made to the map screen (such as highlighting a plot or showing the path) doesn't change the globe view. You need to at least change the plot type (water->land, for example) before the globe view texture is updated.

Of course, it would be very possible to place stationary satellites over plots and just use a "Satellite view" (similar to a "military view") to show the little thumbnails on those plots. It just might not be as much as I would want it to.

I have another plan in mind, but want to test it out first and make sure it'll work before getting people all giddy with excitement, only to have it fail.

Edit: But, as snipperrabbit!! said, yes, that would be for a much later version.
 
Gerikes said:
The problem with the globe view is that it's not a real-time view of the world. It takes a "picture" of the world, makes it a texture, and then puts that texture onto a globe, and that's the world view. Thus, any changes made to the map screen (such as highlighting a plot or showing the path) doesn't change the globe view. You need to at least change the plot type (water->land, for example) before the globe view texture is updated.

Of course, it would be very possible to place stationary satellites over plots and just use a "Satellite view" (similar to a "military view") to show the little thumbnails on those plots. It just might not be as much as I would want it to.

I have another plan in mind, but want to test it out first and make sure it'll work before getting people all giddy with excitement, only to have it fail.

Edit: But, as snipperrabbit!! said, yes, that would be for a much later version.
Click to expand...

Globe view would be a great one to become available with sattelites :)
 
well, if you'll recall call to power, it had a second orbital layer with colonies and the like up on that. I do think that would be very difficult/impossible to impliment in civ4, however.

I think just sticking with the SMAC solution of having an "orbital" advisor/menu, showing all your various orbitals would be the way to go. Course, if someone could find out a way to impliment a more substantial space screen, that would be spectacular.

There are also some other ideas I've been mulling over, so I thought I'd share.

First off, I think we need to decide on how we want to impliment airpower and the like. SMAC used a much more civ2 solution with air units being able to travel everywhere, and having fuel constraints. Personally, I think this is not the greatest solution for conventional aircraft, as the scales the game operates on makes this unrealistic, and using the civ3/4 method of having them based from cities/bases is much more realistic, IMO.

However, I think that the same solution is not really as great for helicopters/hovertanks. I would think those two units could operate as normal units, but with certain restrictions/advantages. One of the ideas I really like is giving helicopters a higher movement(5+) with the ability to cross all terrain but ocean. Ths way they can cross costal/seas/mountains, but not do things that would normally be unrealistic. Hovertanks on the other hand could have a high movement (say, 3 or 4) and the ability to cost all terrain, but at the same time be late in the tech tree, and very expensive. Another alternative would be allowing helicopters to cross all terrain, but have them destroyed if they're somewhere they can't be at the end of the turn (water/mountains) this would also allow for actual range/fuel constraints on choppers, if they don't end the turn in your territory (where it can be assumed there would be readily accessible fueling facilities) or in a neutral/enemy square with the appropriate logistics unit (or any unit, I dunno) the would be destroyed. Perhaps have the "land anywhere in your territory" effect be tied to a tech so they start out almost as restricted as aircraft, but gradually gain more versatility as your infestructure grows.

Another idea I've had is that of how cities "harvest" terrain. I've written some thoughts about a more interesting solution in the past, here is a link to the ideas. I think something akin to that might be good to think over, and perhaps be modified to better fit as well.

In addition, I think we need to look at resources, and how we want them implimented. I've been considering needing more of one resourse, or having variable strength resources, or even better, having consumption so to make having rare resourses more relevant, not just needing to secure one, but as many as you can.

I'll talk more on this later, right now I've gotta go, got some Kuydo instruction to take in. For now, I would love it if the rest of you would weigh in with your thoughts and ideas on these topics and more, and I'll write some rebuttals/corroboration later.

S
 
Silver said:
well, if you'll recall call to power, it had a second orbital layer with colonies and the like up on that. I do think that would be very difficult/impossible to impliment in civ4, however.

I think just sticking with the SMAC solution of having an "orbital" advisor/menu, showing all your various orbitals would be the way to go. Course, if someone could find out a way to impliment a more substantial space screen, that would be spectacular.
Click to expand...

I'm hoping for it, but don't expect anything for awhile.

There are also some other ideas I've been mulling over, so I thought I'd share.

First off, I think we need to decide on how we want to impliment airpower and the like. SMAC used a much more civ2 solution with air units being able to travel everywhere, and having fuel constraints. Personally, I think this is not the greatest solution for conventional aircraft, as the scales the game operates on makes this unrealistic, and using the civ3/4 method of having them based from cities/bases is much more realistic, IMO.

Eventually, air power will have to be determined.

However, I think that the same solution is not really as great for helicopters/hovertanks. I would think those two units could operate as normal units, but with certain restrictions/advantages. One of the ideas I really like is giving helicopters a higher movement(5+) with the ability to cross all terrain but ocean. Ths way they can cross costal/seas/mountains, but not do things that would normally be unrealistic. Hovertanks on the other hand could have a high movement (say, 3 or 4) and the ability to cost all terrain, but at the same time be late in the tech tree, and very expensive. Another alternative would be allowing helicopters to cross all terrain, but have them destroyed if they're somewhere they can't be at the end of the turn (water/mountains) this would also allow for actual range/fuel constraints on choppers, if they don't end the turn in your territory (where it can be assumed there would be readily accessible fueling facilities) or in a neutral/enemy square with the appropriate logistics unit (or any unit, I dunno) the would be destroyed. Perhaps have the "land anywhere in your territory" effect be tied to a tech so they start out almost as restricted as aircraft, but gradually gain more versatility as your infestructure grows.
Click to expand...
I agree, and I think many would agree with you, that the SMAC air power was pretty overpowered. I also agree that we don't need to come up with anything definitive as of right now, just "eventually" :P

We'll have to wait awhile and see how the air units turn out. By then, the game could look so different...

Another idea I've had is that of how cities "harvest" terrain. I've written some thoughts about a more interesting solution in the past, here is a link to the ideas. I think something akin to that might be good to think over, and perhaps be modified to better fit as well.
Click to expand...

One of the things that worries me is the ability to allow cities to harvest from resources very far way from them. I think supply crawlers would do well in this scenario, if collecting resources from far away did allow for those things you mentioned in your post. Also, there seems to be a push for making getting resources from the ground less important, and having specialists in the city be under control of more of that. Just something to keep in mind.


In addition, I think we need to look at resources, and how we want them implimented. I've been considering needing more of one resourse, or having variable strength resources, or even better, having consumption so to make having rare resourses more relevant, not just needing to secure one, but as many as you can.
Click to expand...

Grabbing "as many resources" as you can is a neat idea, but I think you might have to worry that you're forcing the player into a mindset where they would "need" to get more resources. The last thing we want to do is force the player down one road. As Maniac put it, "Having only one option is having no options."

Still, very good ideas. I think smoothed out they could do some good.
 
I recognise this conversation from apolyton. There are loads of people chiming in.. and then when it comes to any action, its left to three people to do the work. I suggest you decide on a team and let the team go forward with it....
 
Well, as said air units were pretty overpowered in SMAC. But also alot of people nag on the requirement of a city nearby to base them. How about coding a sort of airbase improvement, allow it to be constructed/settled on every sort of land terrain, and let them 'refuel' planes and choppers? This avoids air units be overpowered, but keeps them near a battlefront if the player is smart enough to build a supply base in the area. Think of it as a fixed carrier vessel on land. Perhaps the code of the Mongol settler in one of the Warlords scenarios could be helpfull to create such a thing. In this case the 'airbase' could move every turn as well.

As on crawling resources. I think it should be kept in the mod, but some people on 'Poly suggested to let it use a citizen/crawler. So a player still has the ability to crawl around where he wishes, as long as he has enough citizens to 'man' them. Think of it as the personnel to man the crawler, plus support from the homebase to keep them in the field. So with this a player has to start making choices whether to crawl outside his borders, let his citizens work plots in the citycross, or go for a specialist route in the bases. Already 3 sorts of pure strategies, with the extra hybrids on top of that. :)
 
troyDoogle7 said:
I recognise this conversation from apolyton. There are loads of people chiming in.. and then when it comes to any action, its left to three people to do the work. I suggest you decide on a team and let the team go forward with it....
Click to expand...

A team is being put together. and as opposed to my earlier comments, and with some advice from Kael, I've come back from my original idea of a completely, public-community-driven development process. Although community ideas are welcome, the fine-grained and nitty-gritty are being handled by those that we feel are up to offering the most of their time and skills.
 
Just more rambling, and all respect to those capable of actually producing this possible marvel:

A thought on religion... could be included similar to the Civ4 model... at present I can think of at least two valid religions:

1 - Miriam's religion (needs a name)
2 - Cult of Planet

The question becomes, are these religions that could spread into other factions, or are they better done as factions on their own? I agree it would be weird to see miriam's religion in Z's faction.

Maybe some factions cannot receive some religions.
 
@Gnome - Religions can most likely be set up in civics. A column heading of Values could have Power, Religion, Knowledge, Wealth, ect. From another civic column you could then differentitate between Sister Miriam's vision of religion and Cha Dawn's.

Please feel free to ramble. Plenty of good ideas come out of it. ;)
 
woodelf said:
@Gnome - Religions can most likely be set up in civics. A column heading of Values could have Power, Religion, Knowledge, Wealth, ect. From another civic column you could then differentitate between Sister Miriam's vision of religion and Cha Dawn's.

Please feel free to ramble. Plenty of good ideas come out of it. ;)
Click to expand...

Maybe think of it more as a philosophy than a religion. Miriam's orthodox religion, Cha Dawn's extreme environmentalism, Morgan's materialism, Lal's secular humanism. Granted, this makes the religions more faction-specific....
 
jkp1187 said:
Maybe think of it more as a philosophy than a religion. Miriam's orthodox religion, Cha Dawn's extreme environmentalism, Morgan's materialism, Lal's secular humanism. Granted, this makes the religions more faction-specific....
Click to expand...

That's what I'm thinking with Civics. It's a WIP. :)

Keep up the brainstorming...
 
Since the game is so philosophically based, perhaps a victory condition based on ideologically assimilating the populations of other factions?

Here, I'm just throwing crazy stuff out....
 
please sign me up for smac!! i have now four projects going on right now, so i may be slow sometimes! but im sure i can get something out to you in an hour of so!
 
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