Yields

[Thalassicus]

Yields do nothing on their own, and exist simply to be converted into other yields.

Merchants turn food into gold, libraries turn gold into science, civil service turn science into food, and so on. The yields like gold or food don't "do" anything. Gold sitting around our treasury doesn't help us. It's just something for things to turn into other stuff.

 

[Stalker0]

Gold sitting around our treasury doesn't help us. It's just something for things to turn into other stuff.

My point wasn't that all yields aren't eventually equivalent, its simply that food takes longer to get there then other yields.

If I build a farm, it will take a certain amount of turns to get a citizen which can then be turned into a merchant to get gold.

If I build a village, I immediately start accumulating gold.

Early game, it takes only a few turns to turn that food into gold, by late game it takes much longer.

I don't think this is an "issue" at all, but it is a factor on the balance of yields.

 

[mystikx21]

Right, food becomes (much) more valuable later in the game because growth is slower. You can pretty rapidly turn a size 1 city to a size 10-12 in the late game by rushing aqueducts, granaries, hospitals, harbors, and having all the infrastructure laid out. But turning a size 10 to a size 20 takes a lot longer and is usually a lot more valuable because of higher multipliers on buildings, effects on trade, and so forth.

A player should also have plenty of happiness later on such that it's not a huge issue for growth or expansion as it is for the early-mid game. Even with many wars and conquests involved, I could commonly have 50-60 surplus happiness in the mid-industrial era because cities just couldn't grow fast enough to soak it in. Food is the slowest to yield as a result. Gold or culture or faith are effectively immediate. Science or Production are in between.

 

[Thalassicus]

@Stalker0
I'll rephrase your sentences to hopefully explain it.

If we build a farm, it will take a certain amount of turns to "spend" it on a merchant citizen (initial cost), which can then turn food into gold (conversion rate).

If we build a village, it will take a certain amount of turns to "spend" it on a granary (initial cost), which can then turn gold into food (conversion rate).​

We automatically spend food on citizens, while other yields get a choice of what to spend on. There are also differences in the initial cost and conversion efficiency. The basic process is the same for every yield, however.

I think you're trying to say the initial cost is higher for food than other yields, which is a perfectly reasonable concern. I'm just pointing out they all follow the same pattern. Does this make sense?

 

[skodkim]

I asked this question in another thread but since this seems like the right place to ask I'll do it here too:

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I have a question regarding GEM 1.13.1.

The release notes say "Scaled culture and faith income & costs so 1 point of culture or faith has approximately the same value as 1 point of other yields."

Sorry, but I'm having difficulty with formulating my question correctly but does this mean that all yields are now "equal"? So if I add a wonder that gave +2 culture before it should now only give +1 culture for it to have the same effect on city border growth, social policy earning, etc.?

In earlier versions cuture and science had been scaled by two I think.

\Skodkim

 

[Thalassicus]

Yes, you are correct. I scaled both income and costs. 2 culture wonders for 2000 culture policies is the same as 1 culture wonders for 1000 culture policies. This makes each individual point of culture twice as valuable.

 

[skodkim]

So is it intended that you actually raised the culture output from opportunities in the 1.13.1 version?

I looked in G&K Enhanced Mod (v1.13) (v 1)\GEM\Opportunities\GEO_Opportunities.xml and one example is the output from Commercial Farming trigger 1 which is raised from 3 to 4 culture.

\Skodkim

 

[Thalassicus]

Each choice for an opportunity should give the same value. Based on feedback, it seems culture was previously worth about half the value of other yields, so the op choices were not balanced. They should now be closer to an equal value.