"your Stealth Bomber was destroyed by an enemy Pikeman"

Just pretend that the pilot zoomed in on his target, the pikeman. By some random fluke of nature, the sun shone just perfect on the spear tip, causing it to blind the pilot and crash the plane.
 
When you think about what a bird strike can do to a jet, I really have no problem with a low tech unit getting lucky, especially against first generation aircraft that really do have to get close to do real damage. I do have a problem with high-tech units taking a hit every time they attack, especially when they are attacking units with no AAA.
 
Krikkitone said:
Actually I disagree, Modern units shouldn't do damage to the Air units unless they have interception. Interception/AA should be the Only way air units take damage.
Click to expand...

considering that Surface to Air missiles are fairly 'standard' kit for modern units, I'd say let them fight back. It's not like they do much damage anyways; unless they have interception.

This would also cover earlier air units, such as fighters who really do have to get low to the ground to shoot.

Think of it more like 'close air support' when air units attack units and 'bombing' when they attack cities.
 
Everything in this game is a representation. When I see Pikemen in 2000AD, I don't see it as an actual Pikemen army typical of Charles Martel's men at Poitiers but rather, a severely under funded rag tag military typical of 2000AD. In short, they may have technologically diffused but severely out-dated anti-air equipment.

It is a game after all, every single thing is a representation of something.
 
Stone vs nukes.
No David killed Goliath or?:lol:
 
jdp29 said:
Just pretend that the pilot zoomed in on his target, the pikeman. By some random fluke of nature, the sun shone just perfect on the spear tip, causing it to blind the pilot and crash the plane.
Click to expand...
The targeting sensors on modern aircraft are incredibly complex- so much so, that it is impossible to blind someone through targeting cameras-- it just washes out the image, in which case the sensor can typically be toggled between Infrared, Day-TV, and/or Radar imagery.

At the altitude that modern aircraft operate, this becomes literally impossible.

MadDjinn said:
considering that Surface to Air missiles are fairly 'standard' kit for modern units, I'd say let them fight back. It's not like they do much damage anyways; unless they have interception.

This would also cover earlier air units, such as fighters who really do have to get low to the ground to shoot.

Think of it more like 'close air support' when air units attack units and 'bombing' when they attack cities.
Click to expand...
They aren't as "standard" as you would think. MANPADs can be integrated into a fighting unit, but in the case of Stealth aircraft, there are such an absurd amount of countermeasures that most shoulder-fired SAMs become almost no-factor. The biggest IRL threats to aircraft are a combination of AAA sites, 1-3 types of tactical SAMs, and 2-4 different types of strategic SAMs.

Even then, modern technology can effectively evade Infrared SAMs, jam radar-guided SAMs, suppress early-warning systems, and then destroy a target with minimal risk from all but the most modern anti-aircraft systems. Civ has never done justice to the incredible complexity of modern aerial warfare.
 
OMG, I was playing chess and my Queen got killed by a lousy pawn!!!

Surely that cant be right cos the queen is like 100x more powerful.
 
bhavv said:
OMG, I was playing chess and my Queen got killed by a lousy pawn!!!

Surely that cant be right cos the queen is like 100x more powerful.
Click to expand...


Actually that is serious unrealism in chess... a Queen more powerful than a Pawn in Combat... Seriously I don't think a Queen could deal any type of damage versus some peasant.

The fact is Strength wise it should be
Castle (way above the rest)
..
..
King (since he is likely a Knight himself)
Knight
Bishop (possibly a Knight, but not as likely)
..
..
Pawn
Queen
 
Krikkitone said:
Actually that is serious unrealism in chess... a Queen more powerful than a Pawn in Combat... Seriously I don't think a Queen could deal any type of damage versus some peasant.

The fact is Strength wise it should be
Castle (way above the rest)
..
..
King (since he is likely a Knight himself)
Knight
Bishop (possibly a Knight, but not as likely)
..
..
Pawn
Queen
Click to expand...

Bishop should be right down there with "Queen", as a Bishop is really just a priest.
 
bhavv said:
OMG, I was playing chess and my Queen got killed by a lousy pawn!!!

Surely that cant be right cos the queen is like 100x more powerful.
Click to expand...

I don't agree with the comparison. A queen isn't worth 100 pawns. A queen is worth roughly 9 pawns and it's not a stretch to say a pawn can take down a queen since they both have access to each other. Whereas a stealth bomber operates miles above the earth and there's no possible way a pike can be thrown that far even if the guy could see it.

I don't think it's a huge deal but there should be some sort of rule that after so many technological advances a unit is unable to counterattack another unit. Or at least unable to counterattack flying units unless you have researched rifling.
 
markulous said:
I don't agree with the comparison. A queen isn't worth 100 pawns. A queen is worth roughly 9 pawns and it's not a stretch to say a pawn can take down a queen since they both have access to each other. Whereas a stealth bomber operates miles above the earth and there's no possible way a pike can be thrown that far even if the guy could see it.

I don't think it's a huge deal but there should be some sort of rule that after so many technological advances a unit is unable to counterattack another unit. Or at least unable to counterattack flying units unless you have researched rifling.
Click to expand...

Given how these aircraft operate... a man would have to hurl a stick miles into the sky, at night, at a fast-moving target, that was colored black, without hearing the bomber, before getting blown up... and still cause enough damage to require maintenance for months. Weapons that are designed for this kind of thing have trouble inflicting that kind of damage.
 
esemjay said:
Bishop should be right down there with "Queen", as a Bishop is really just a priest.
Click to expand...

A Bishop could be a "knight" as well (Remember certain popes of the time were warriors)

although probably a bit below
 
esemjay said:
Given how these aircraft operate... a man would have to hurl a stick miles into the sky, at night, at a fast-moving target, that was colored black, without hearing the bomber, before getting blown up... and still cause enough damage to require maintenance for months. Weapons that are designed for this kind of thing have trouble inflicting that kind of damage.
Click to expand...

Exactly. I wouldn't mind if when attacking the city that the bombers are located, they take damage. Since them being in a hangar is the only possible way a pike can get to it.
 
On the subject of Bishops...in the middle ages a Prince of the Church also had quite a bit of temporal power and authority, so in no way is a Bishop "just a priest."

And taking out a piece in chess is all about access. How hard is it to poison, stab, strangle, smother anyone? The model is about political power/intrigue as much as it is about combat. If you can get close enough, you can kill them. Pretty much end of story.
 
Krikkitone said:
A Bishop could be a "knight" as well (Remember certain popes of the time were warriors)

although probably a bit below
Click to expand...

Yes, this is probably from the Crusades, when they joined and led men in battle, although as a concession to religious sensibillities they carried battle axes rather than swords, because axes were considered less lethal. I guess it gave them time to save a guy's soul after chopping off a limb or something... as opposed to thrusting at the heart or neck with a sword:crazyeye:



As for a defending pikeman doing any damage to a stealth bomber -

Even I consider this one immersion-breaking :eek:
 
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