2018 spring patch - AI domination combat test

[V. Soma]

Here I come with the usual test:

Game setting (no mods):

deity
standard speed
pangea
duel size
high sea water
information era start

no barbs
no villages
no CSs

domination only

I am Egypt

PLAY: meet Aztec and declare war - no own units, no builds - only capital city


I have to say, things HAVE IMPROVED!
- AI does constant range attack
- AI nukes (!)
- AI attacks city with no hesitation
- AI uses naval force

t417 my city founded on coast
t418 meet Monty (ca. 12 tiles away) - DoW - units deleted - Aztec military is 585, has m.gun corp
t423 new Aztec city
t426 new Aztec city
t427 A. spec op is arund
t431 new Aztec city - these were starting settlers
t438 new Aztec city
t440 A. military: 654
t444 new Aztec city - close
t448 A. gun corp is here on water
t450 spec op is entering my land, military: 669
spec opp attacks!
t455 2 pec ops form a corp, gun corp appears in water again
spec op corp attacks repeatedly
t460 military: 614, my wall is at 60%
t470 military: 711, spec op corp destroyed my wall
t475 spec op is bombing city I am at 50%
t480 My city is at almost zero, military: 776
t483 Monty nukes my city!
t485 infantry appears on land
t486 Monty captures my city from the sea with naval force…

 

[tedhebert]

Very interesting... thx

 

[RohirrimElf]

Still takes about 10-15 turns to long but i’ve seen greatly worse reports at launch (also couple months ago). Looking good.

On my war against persia the ai destroyed me with good warrior/slinger surround. Only couple of turns after surprice war. Need much more experience with last patch but ai seems to be better at focus firing on single city. Ignoring its surroundings.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

I'd be curious to know how much these tests were impacted by the following from the latest patch notes:

"Fix round off problem that was giving low threat values in duel maps (or with only 2 Civs left)."

I don't know what issue this is exactly, but in the absence of knowing, it makes me cautious about drawing any conclusions from comparing duel map tests before the patch versus duel map tests after the patch. It may not be the AI's aggressiveness overall that has been changed.

If this is true, its a shame, considering the work you've put into running these tests.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I'd be curious to know how much these tests were impacted by the following from the latest patch notes:

"Fix round off problem that was giving low threat values in duel maps (or with only 2 Civs left)."

I don't know what issue this is exactly, but in the absence of knowing, it makes me cautious about drawing any conclusions from comparing duel map tests before the patch versus duel map tests after the patch. It may not be the AI's aggressiveness overall that has been changed.

If this is true, its a shame, considering the work you've put into running these tests.

I think the change that improved it the most is the one that makes the AI focus more on a city if it can be taken or almost taken in one turn.

• AI will prioritize a city over units if it can capture or nearly capture the city

 

[RDomico]

Airforce used?

 

[Krajzen]

It still took deity aztec(!) AI 70 turns to take one undefended city

 

[V. Soma]

It still took deity aztec(!) AI 70 turns to take one undefended city

yes, 70 turns is too long - AI took time with putting down many cities, a bit lazy on making the attack on my city.

but... when finally Monty cam, then now he did it rather quick and sharp...

prevoiusly AI did lots of infamous "unit dance" - get next to city, no attack, move out, then reat...

 

[V. Soma]

I did another test - this time I put an arty unit in my city and do some active defending...

Aztecs took some time with preparations but then came and swept me away with combined forces...
(land and naval)

t416 I have city on coast

t423 meet Aztecs they are far away (25-30 tiles)
DoW - delete all my units but one machine gun

t425 A. spec op unit is around my area

t430 Aztec military: 585

t438 I have arty in my city

t440 Aztec military: 577

t450 Aztec military: 577

t460 Aztec military: 594

t467 Aztec settle city near me

t470 Aztec military: 696

Aztec settle more cities

t480 Aztec military: 681

t490 Aztec military: 641

t500 Aztec military: 578 (?)

Aztec build aerodrome near me

t507 Aztec infantry army with supply unit is near my land

…and waiting

t510 Aztec military: 845 (!)

t514 Aztec machine gun arm joins tha waiting army

t515: anothe infantry corp and a rocket artillery army joins…

first infantry army enters my land!

I do defending fire with my arty and the city

t516 Aztec attack my city - I defend

Aztec move next to my city with both infantry and guns army

Aztec missile cruiser army appears and bombards my city to almost zero

t519 Aztec has 2 missile cruiser armies, and 3 armies surround my city on land…

t520 my city is captured…

 

[bbbt]

It still took deity aztec(!) AI 70 turns to take one undefended city

That's from the start of the game though (i.e. it's advanced start). So it took 70 turns to finish his economic priorities, build military, possibly find the city (not clear if embassy we're exchanged) and take the city. And AI was declared on, so first step might be to build up defense in that instance.

A test counting from AI declaration of war (when it's ready to go) to taking a city would presumably be a smaller gap.

 

[agonistes]

Here I come with the usual test:

Game setting (no mods):

deity
standard speed
pangea
duel size
high sea water
information era start

no barbs
no villages
no CSs

domination only

I am Egypt

PLAY: meet Aztec and declare war - no own units, no builds - only capital city


I have to say, things HAVE IMPROVED!
- AI does constant range attack
- AI nukes (!)
- AI attacks city with no hesitation
- AI uses naval force

t417 my city founded on coast
t418 meet Monty (ca. 12 tiles away) - DoW - units deleted - Aztec military is 585, has m.gun corp
t423 new Aztec city
t426 new Aztec city
t427 A. spec op is arund
t431 new Aztec city - these were starting settlers
t438 new Aztec city
t440 A. military: 654
t444 new Aztec city - close
t448 A. gun corp is here on water
t450 spec op is entering my land, military: 669
spec opp attacks!
t455 2 pec ops form a corp, gun corp appears in water again
spec op corp attacks repeatedly
t460 military: 614, my wall is at 60%
t470 military: 711, spec op corp destroyed my wall
t475 spec op is bombing city I am at 50%
t480 My city is at almost zero, military: 776
t483 Monty nukes my city!
t485 infantry appears on land
t486 Monty captures my city from the sea with naval force…

Promising! Run some more! At once! Make some videos too! I love these reports.

@Eagle Pursuit I agree, I think that change is the reason. We could be seeing much more focused attacks.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

I did another test - this time I put an arty unit in my city and do some active defending...

As I mentioned in another thread, the AI is still an Austrian general. Tentative and slow moving, waits until conditions are perfect to press forward, is unwilling to take risks even in the face of favourable odds.

Hopefully the change noted by Eagle Pursuit at least means they won't also still pull back when faced with the prospect of possible success.

 

[Leathaface]

Promising tests!

 

[kb27787]

...did a test of my own... thanks Firaxis... you've just turned deity difficulty into "reroll until you start somewhat far away from AI" mode...
AI warriors don't care about your fortified warrior trap on a forest hill now... nor about your slingers/archers in the back on a hill either. They just zerg their warriors into your starting capital until there is simply no HP left.

Seriously... is it that hard to buff palace guard a bit... deity is still easy once you survive the initial phase, but man, I'm getting sick of the rerolls.

 

[Mr Jon of Cheam]

Sounds like some people are never happy!

 

[Karmah]

As I mentioned in another thread, the AI is still an Austrian general. Tentative and slow moving, waits until conditions are perfect to press forward, is unwilling to take risks even in the face of favourable odds.

Hopefully the change noted by Eagle Pursuit at least means they won't also still pull back when faced with the prospect of possible success.

I don't think it is THAT stupid to try to have an economy able to support war before declaring. Especially since the IA is not aware he is casting in a test
My point being in a real situation , that means he can withstand its first wave being countered without going straight to game over. Considering it can't rage quit I think that's fair

 

[Disgustipated]

Still takes about 10-15 turns to long

Spec ops are a terrible unit to be attacking city walls. The AI uses these all wrong.

As for the 70 turns, the AI prioritizes expanding in the initial phase of the game regardless of the DOW it seems. Running the test while the AI is more established and built up a military would be more interesting.

Glad to see them using naval units.

question: Does the AI have to build manhattan project with this late of a start or do they automatically get it? That would have taken some time as well.

 

[Archon_Wing]

...did a test of my own... thanks Firaxis... you've just turned deity difficulty into "reroll until you start somewhat far away from AI" mode...
AI warriors don't care about your fortified warrior trap on a forest hill now... nor about your slingers/archers in the back on a hill either. They just zerg their warriors into your starting capital until there is simply no HP left.

Seriously... is it that hard to buff palace guard a bit... deity is still easy once you survive the initial phase, but man, I'm getting sick of the rerolls.

Well, maybe they can knock the training wheels off the AI now and reduce its starting units.

It's not a bad thing, and I'd argue it's necessary for development.

 

[sonicmyst]

Did the AI retreat his units before he dropped the nuke?

 

[bbufa]

AI try to capture capital while they cannot hold it due to loyalty.
In one of my games, Scythia went around and attacked Pericles from behind. Athens was conquered but revolted just few turns later (there are 5 frontline Greek cities!)