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5 Good Emperors

Wasn't Hadrian the one that lost Mesopotamia? And if Trajan had taken to avoid the Dacian wars, what would have become of Dacia?
Mesopotamia as Traianus had seized it was unsustainable. Traianus essentially occupied all of the territory that didn't put up a fight, leaving several hostile fortresses in his rear, while completely ignoring the Iranian plateau, where the claimants to the Pahlavan throne fought amongst themselves. He reached the Gulf, then turned around to try to finish the job, but by then the civil war had been resolved, Roman armies were overstretched, the Jews started rebelling (as they were wont to do) and Traianus himself died attempting to capture Hatra, one of the major fortified cities that threatened Roman control in Mesopotamia.

Hadrianus' decision to pull back to the Euphrates was both intelligent from a military standpoint - abandoning terrain that he was likely to lose anyway - and statesmanlike. Rome didn't have the logistical infrastructure in place for a sustained Mesopotamian war until the second half of the second century, perhaps not even until the reign of Septimius Severus. (The "perhaps" arises both from my personal lack of knowledge and from my conviction that historians who do know about this stuff don't know precisely when these reforms occurred, either.) It might perhaps have been wiser for Hadrianus to demand a small buffer zone on the far side of the Euphrates - the sort of territory Rome held after Septimius' campaigns - but Roman control there was as tenuous as it was anywhere else, and the local populace had not been acclimatized to Rome as they would be later.
 
Hadrian, definitely; imho, probably the best ruler Rome had.

Traian - well, if you like the type that kicks stuff around; kicks in a rather pointless fashion. His conquests were mediocre at best; and hardly tenable. Was good on paper(and only on paper, I dare say - the game isn't about % of land controlled)

the other three - at least they weren't bad. Above average for sure. The whole period was good overall.
 
fine. You want five good emperors. here Trajan, Augustus, Caesar (he technically created the post), Hadrian, Antonius Pius, and Marcus Aurelius.
You're still not getting it. Also, there was never such a "post" as 'emperor.'
 
There's six in that quote and Caesar was only Dictator for life, never king, let alone emperor.
 
What does dictator for life sound like to you? Not hereditary rule but his adopted son became emperor.
 
What does dictator for life sound like to you?

So anybody that has a life-long control of the government is the same as an emperor?
 
Yes a person with complete control over a nation for life is a despot or emperor. A despot is only a spot below emperor as is hereditary rule with out a constitution.
 
Yes a person with complete control over a nation for life is a despot or emperor. A despot is only a spot below emperor as is hereditary rule with out a constitution.

K. So Josef Stalin and Adolf Hitler were also emperors?
 
Techincallly they did have complete control of the state. If they were despots without a set heir then yes.
 
Then your definition of "emperor" conforms to no standardized or commonly used definition ever used, ever.
 
What's yours?
 
It's a royal title, and the Latin word for it is "August," which was a title that Octavian first took, not Iulius Caesar. The English word comes from "imperator", which was one of the many titles that the emperors held (though it didn't originally mean that), whereas "Kaiser" and "Tsar" are both derived from "Caesar" which only became a title rather than a dynastic name after the Julio-Claudian dynasty ceased to rule.
 
Ye, the term emperor is derived Kaiser and Tsar are from the word Caesar or emperor. I meant the powers that came with the title. An emperor is the same as a despot. The title doesn't change anything. The tsars were despots in Russia due to their complete control of the serfs or vassals and the fact they didn't rule with a constitution. Kaiser Wilhelm the 2nd was also a despot. He ruled without limits as well. England pre Magna Carta was the same way. An emperor is a title. It is no different from a monarch or a king. If they wield absolute power the leaders can call themselves whatever they like. Hitler was Fuhrer and Chancellor. That did not mean he wasn't a dictator.
 
Ye, the term emperor is derived Kaiser and Tsar are from the word Caesar or emperor. I meant the powers that came with the title. An emperor is the same as a despot. The title doesn't change anything. The tsars were despots in Russia due to their complete control of the serfs or vassals and the fact they didn't rule with a constitution.
The Holy Roman Emperor wasn't a despot- in fact, he had not true monarchical power outside of his own territory. Even the Austrian Emperors, who reigned with a bit more force than that, were still far from absolute despots, particularly in the Hungarian half of their domain after the establishment of the dual monarchy in 1867.

Kaiser Wilhelm the 2nd was also a despot. He ruled without limits as well.
Actually, the Empire was a constitutional monarch, just one with what to Anglo-American eyes seems like a disproportionately powerful executive. As Dachs could tell you in more detail, the Kaiser's political role was very close to that of the Weimar President; the perception of one as a near-absolute monarch and the other as an American-style liberal executive is largely to the flavour of ceremony in which they were dressed, rather than any objective measure of their respective powers.

England pre Magna Carta was the same way.
Actually, the Magna Carta mostly just affirmed a rule of law that, at least theoretically, already existed. It was arguably inherited along with English common law from the Anglo-Saxons (who had what could roughly be described as a constitutional monarchy), and was formalised under Norman rule in 1100 by Henry I's Charter of Liberties. It didn't change much, and had only limited impact, serving more as a written formalisation of a new political order that the barons were forcing out of John I with or without a charter. It's mostly remembered because of the circumstances of its creation, having been forced out of a king rather than volunteered as with its predecessor in 1100 and successor in 1689, and even then was largely forgotten until late 16th century when it entered English folk-history as a cornerstone of constitutional law that, objectively, it never was, largely as a banner for the parliamentarian faction to rally around.

An emperor is a title. It is no different from a monarch or a king. If they wield absolute power the leaders can call themselves whatever they like. Hitler was Fuhrer and Chancellor. That did not mean he wasn't a dictator.
It did mean that his dictatorship was embedded in a certain legal state-form, however, which can't be entirely overlooked. Even Stalin had to work through the Communist Party apparatus, and not always as a mere formality.
 
no no traitorfish the leader of the Second Reich, Wilhelm the second. In fact, the HRE emperors wielded little power at all. I agree the magna carta was not even used until parliament was created. Still, the apparatus of the state rarely stops despots especially in Stalin's case.
 
no no traitorfish the leader of the Second Reich, Wilhelm the second. In fact, the HRE emperors wielded little power at all.
Well, yes, that was my point: that the title of "emperor" is, like all titles, ceremonial first and foremost, and so not necessarily indicative of very much at all. Just takes Park's example, in which the "Emperor of the Scots" ranged from a ruler with something approaching Irish hegemony like Brian Bóruma, to a Scottish king say "golly, I'd sure like to rule Ireland" like Roibert Briuis, and yet never indicating an absolute monarch. And I addressed the Second Reich elsewhere in the post.

I agree the magna carta was not even used until parliament was created.
Parliament pre-dates the Magna Carta. :huh:

Still, the apparatus of the state rarely stops despots especially in Stalin's case.
Perhaps not, but that doesn't mean it can be ignored. Stalin was only one man, no matter what hopes he invested in creating an army of bronze replicates strategically position in every town square in the Soviet Union.
 
So, why'd Wilhelm II have to deal with that pesky Reichstag if he was an absolute monarch?
 
to a Scottish king say "golly, I'd sure like to rule Ireland" like Roibert Briuis, and yet never indicating an absolute monarch.
It is a shame none of them realized they could have gotten away with being Imperator Scotorum by ruling Scotland.
 
parliament didn't have much power pre Magna Carta. Still yes I am wrong on Wilhelm the second. Titles are used to mask power I guess. In Uganda,Idi amin took the title of president, but was in fact a brutal dictator. Mubarak, President of Egypt ruled as a dictator for 30 yrs. the thing I'm trying to explain is no matter what "title" you have, it's the power you wield that counts
 
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