9 Dead in Munich Shooting

[ls612]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36870874

Germany has remarkably until now escaped the mass violence epidemic this summer. Who knows what affiliations this attacker has, but 2016 just keeps getting worse.

 

[luiz]

It was pretty lucky that I drove to work today instead of taking the metro as I normally do. All public transit shut down. The city is completely crazy, and the fact that the gunmen have escaped is not making anyone feel better. There are reports of shootings in other places, such as Stachus.

Who knows what affiliations this attacker has

Well I have a wild guess on that one.

 

[Cheetah]

Stachus was confirmed by police to not have happened, iirc.

So far it seems that at least one attacker shot someone in a mcdonalds, went outside and shot at some other people, and then disappeared. Video in a Twitter post (can't see anyone getting hit, but still, viewer discretion, etc.).

So far that pretty much sums up everything. I hope it stays that way.

 

[ls612]

It was pretty lucky that I drove to work today instead of taking the metro as I normally do. All public transit shut down. The city is completely crazy, and the fact that the gunmen have escaped is not making anyone feel better. There are reports of shootings in other places, such as Stachus.



Well I have a wild guess on that one.

Glad to hear you are safe. Where in the city is this? Is it in downtown or more peripheral?

 

[luiz]

It's in the north, not central but inside the city proper and not that far from downtown either. Maybe 4 KM away from Marienplatz?

And it's a pretty popular shopping mall.

Edit: reports about casualties are all over the place, from 3 to 15 or more. 6 is the latest police estimate, with more wounded. What is certain is that no shooter (maybe there was more than one) was killed or detained so far, which is why people are so nervous. There is a major manhunt underway all over the city, with helicopters and all. All public transit shut down.

 

[Cheetah]

Yeah. Stay inside and stay safe.

Hopefully this is only one guy, and hopefully it will be over soon. There are some videos on Twitter et al., and report from RTL, that this is a German who doesn't like foreigners. Apparently shouted Scheiß Ausländer (Damn foreigners) at one point.

 

[kronic]

Yeah. Stay inside and stay safe.

Hopefully this is only one guy, and hopefully it will be over soon. There are some videos on Twitter et al., and report from RTL, that this is a German who doesn't like foreigners. Apparently shouted Scheiß Ausländer (Damn foreigners) at one point.

Police currently believes there are at least three gunmen. And all of them are still on the run. They suspect a terror attack. But it could be committed by neonazis.

 

[luiz]

The guy looked tanned and definitely had very black hair. Could be German, but I doubt it.

Also, apparently his all black shirt had some white logo in it, which is more ISIS than Nazi. But who knows at this point.

 

[kronic]

The guy looked tanned and definitely had very black hair. Could be German, but I doubt it.

Also, apparently his all black shirt had some white logo in it, which is more ISIS than Nazi. But who knows at this point.

Yes, I saw that, too. But there is conflicting information. Because some eye witnesses say something different.

 

[luiz]

The police's working hypothesis right now, from what I gather, are:

-It was terrorism;
-There were 3 shooters;
-At least 6 dead.

 

[GAGA Extrem]

Here is what I heard from the police conference (as a German speaker):
- 6 people killed, multiple severely wounded
- Police looking for up to 3 (actual number is unconfirmed) attackers
- It's assumed they are still within the city area
- Shooting started in (or in front of) a McDonalds restaurant
- So far nothing pointing towards an islamic attack
- Otherwise no further details at the moment

My impression (nothing more!) from watching the SkyNews stream (including the two videos of the attackers) is that this seems to be a right-wing attack.
Maybe a response to the recent axe attack in Würzburg. But obviously nothing is certain at this point.

 

[luiz]

There are reports that one (the only?) shooter might have died.

In this type of attack the shooters don't really expect to get out alive. Is there any historic of this sort of "kamikaze" attack by neonazis or nutters of the far-right sort? The pattern seems entirely Islamic to me, but let's wait and see.

 

[GAGA Extrem]

There are (unconfirmed) reports that one of the attackers was killed / shot himself. The police did, however, not give any info about that during the press conference.

As for right-wing violence, the general number of attacks (including those that resulted in fatalities) has grown over the past years, but they are mostly directed against refugee asylums (arson, shooting at windows or throwing moltovs) or foreigners. All-out gunfire on the street is rather rare (usually more a thing that happens between biker gangs like the Hells Angels).

The last large-scale (presumably right wing) terror attack in Munich was the Oktoberfest bombing in 1980, although the actual circumstances have never been fully verified. Recent investigations have shown that the Verfassungsschutz apparently had infiltrated the group, so it is quite possible that higher-ups ordered a cover-up and hampered the investigations.

 

[Gigaz]

There are reports that one (the only?) shooter might have died.

In this type of attack the shooters don't really expect to get out alive. Is there any historic of this sort of "kamikaze" attack by neonazis or nutters of the far-right sort? The pattern seems entirely Islamic to me, but let's wait and see.

Neonazis regularily commited suicide when otherwise capture was the only alternative.

 

[luiz]

8 people confirmed dead now

 

[luiz]

Neonazis regularily commited suicide when otherwise capture was the only alternative.

Sure. My point is that in this kind of attack the terrorists know from the beginning that they will die. It's a kamikaze attack. Far-right terrorists aren't known for that (of course, if their plan fails and capture is the only option they might kill themselves or fight to death. But that is not the plan. In this case it was the plan). Also, the target doesn't really make any sense as a neonazi target, but makes perfect sense as a Islamist target, as they just target large and concentrated crowds with no great regard for the place. If the point was to kill foreigners they could just shoot one of the countless buildings that are housing refugees in Munich, that would be quite easy...

 

[Gigaz]

Sure. My point is that in this kind of attack the terrorists know from the beginning that they will die. It's a kamikaze attack. Far-right terrorists aren't known for that (of course, if their plan fails and capture is the only option they might kill themselves or fight to death. But that is not the plan. In this case it was the plan).

The Islamist attackers (at least some of them) in Paris and Belgium have been trying to flee after the attack iirc, and at the moment the reports indicate that one attacker committed suicide and at least two are on the run. From that pattern I can not deduce anything.

 

[luiz]

The Islamist attackers (at least some of them) in Paris and Belgium have been trying to flee after the attack iirc, and at the moment the reports indicate that one attacker committed suicide and at least two are on the run. From that pattern I can not deduce anything.

Only the planners tried to flee (and IIRC one who got scared). For the soldiers the plan was death. I don't know of neonazis deliberately plotting to die as a result of their attacks. They don't believe in a paradise with a bunch of virgins waiting for them afterwards, so they try to stay safe.

And again, that place doesn't make any sense as a neonazi target. There are plenty of buildings in Munich completely crowded with refugees.

But again, at this point who knows? Maybe it was just one crazy person.

 

[abradley]

FNC

Police report more shootings in city.

As usual all news is suspect at first.

 

[Gigaz]

Only the planners tried to flee (and IIRC one who got scared). For the soldiers the plan was death. I don't know of neonazis deliberately plotting to die as a result of their attacks. They don't believe in a paradise with a bunch of virgins waiting for them afterwards, so they try to stay safe.

And again, that place doesn't make any sense as a neonazi target. There are plenty of buildings in Munich completely crowded with refugees.

I don't want to speculate at this point but it's not exactly difficult to find good victims for a Neonazi attack in a Munich shopping mall.
Refugee homes are often guarded, making a direct attack difficult. Usually people try arson.
Also, it's the fifth anniversary of Breiviks attack. Did his attack victims make any sense?