A New Dawn Beta Builds

[Afforess]

Can you please mod that python file that deals with Barbarian spawning "dangerous numbers" to be more appropriate for RoM? I will remind Zappara accordingly but I request that you fix that for now as well.

Just had dangerous numbers of SWORDSMEN (not LIGHT_SWORDSMEN) attack my city. Light swordsmen would still had defeated me but at least it was fair because it was appropriate to tech progress of my AI opponents (was researching furiously Iron Working but it appears another AI already got there first).

Sure.

 

[os79]

Sure.

That is Vandals, incidentally.

And, also look at Huns as well. Seem weird to pump out Horse Archers with just techs Horse Riding. It should be Horse Archery tech.

Wait...

What about changing Techs themselves in the pythons, not units? I will do that myself and test it out...Maybe it is better that way because at the early stages of the games, players are not ready for tough barbarians yet .

 

[os79]

Here is the file that I modified to have Huns and Vandals be more appropriate to RoM.

Huns' horse archers are moved to requiring mounted archery tech.

Vandals' swordsmen are moved to requiring smithing tech.

 

[Afforess]

Thanks, I just merged it in.

 

[Hydromancerx]

@strategyonly

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=9016699&postcount=1755

I noticed a lot of other stuff in your tech tree. What other mods do you have installed besides AND?

 

[strategyonly]

@strategyonly

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=9016699&postcount=1755

I noticed a lot of other stuff in your tech tree. What other mods do you have installed besides AND?

Well i try to run as much as i can so i can test everything all at once(i now own a computer that can handle almost anything), so i am testing 2.9/AND beta (of course), all of Dancing H's stuff, and some of my stuff, plus very very little changes here and there, ie changed Archery Range from Feudalism to Hunting(to me Feud is waaay to late).

Plus i am remaking some extra civs, but that darn WoC is making it really hard, i keep getting alot of units that "leak" over into other civs see pic

btw, thx for asking, i do about 4-5 hours a day, just testing Civ IV stuff.


EDIT: Afforess: Yeppers you were right (As for the tech tree, did you already research that tech? i already had researched the tech (as Homer would say "D'oh", and thx for fixing that BUG thing

 

[scribbler]

I just tried this, and it works fine for me. I tested on a game I am already running, so I have a ton of units. Not sure why it would crash. Can you turn on python error logging, and upload your logs next time it crashes?

Thanks, tried it again and everything works when I waited long enough. My bad, I've been using computers so long that I've developed a bad habit of assuming the worst when things freeze up.

 

[Afforess]

StrategyOnly,

I looked at the pic, but I'm not sure what I should (or shouldn't be) seeing. What's wrong?

 

[civ_king]

Thanks, tried it again and everything works when I waited long enough. My bad, I've been using computers so long that I've developed a bad habit of assuming the worst when things freeze up.

Dude, you need a Mac, that stuff doesn't happen on them, with Windows SNAFU is common (Situation Normal, All F***ed Up

 

[scribbler]

Yeah. There were 3 types of promotions it seems to have been giving incorrectly. Kamikaze promotions, Religion promotions, and Leader promotions. I've already changed it so it won't do this anymore in the future.

Does that include the Fanatic promotion as well? It gives +20% Strength, +10% City Attack, -25% Defense, so giving it for "free" would hurt a primarily defensive unit.

It's a bit more complex than that. It's handled in the SDK, in CvGameTextMgr.

The way the text is drawn is 1 promotion at a time, so I *could* make one units promotion text line up on one line, but the next promotion would still be on another line. It's a good idea though. I can talk to EmperorFool (The god of all things Civ Interface) and see how it's run. It might not be very hard to make a new function that runs for all promotions instead of just one; then I could make the text line up really nicely.

Ah, now that you mention it I remember reading somewhere someone saying the same thing about _a_ civ. Might have been 4, but it might have been 3. I suppose it makes it easier given that the devs needed to deal with the locale. In fact, I imagine that locale issues are the primary thing that have kept anyone from doing anything about it.

I'll have a look at the file anyway. Doubt that I'll be able to figure anything out - my C++ is rusty as heck - but it'll be interesting to find something specific like that.

They do cost XP (in a way); you don't get any experience for that battle if you get a free promotion.

Well, yes and no. While it will certainly be better to get the XP when your Warlord+Noble led unit is level 5 and you can get 4+9 XP for an attack, it's "free" when that same unit is level 30 and can get 2+4 XP. And if you're like me and KNOW you'll have level 20+ units, you take every non-XP promotion you can get (particularly since they later seem to get rarer, although this may be just an impression I'm getting but not what's happening).

Wait, did I just let the house know how a player can game the system? D'oh!

 

[os79]

Wait, did I just let the house know how a player can game the system? D'oh!

Game . How hilarious because we are playing a game already!

 

[Afforess]

Dude, you need a Mac, that stuff doesn't happen on them, with Windows SNAFU is common (Situation Normal, All F***ed Up

This coming from the guy who refused to stop playing AND 1.55, when AND 1.60 was out.

Does that include the Fanatic promotion as well? It gives +20% Strength, +10% City Attack, -25% Defense, so giving it for "free" would hurt a primarily defensive unit.

It won't stop them from getting the promotion if you have the correct state religion that the promotion requires. It will just stop those who fail to meet the correct requirements.

Ah, now that you mention it I remember reading somewhere someone saying the same thing about _a_ civ. Might have been 4, but it might have been 3. I suppose it makes it easier given that the devs needed to deal with the locale. In fact, I imagine that locale issues are the primary thing that have kept anyone from doing anything about it.

I'll have a look at the file anyway. Doubt that I'll be able to figure anything out - my C++ is rusty as heck - but it'll be interesting to find something specific like that.

Break out the compilers! Coding Civ is pretty easy, IMHO. I figured out most of the code in Civ w/o programming classes. Just grab some of the source files, I have them all on a SVN.

Well, yes and no. While it will certainly be better to get the XP when your Warlord+Noble led unit is level 5 and you can get 4+9 XP for an attack, it's "free" when that same unit is level 30 and can get 2+4 XP. And if you're like me and KNOW you'll have level 20+ units, you take every non-XP promotion you can get (particularly since they later seem to get rarer, although this may be just an impression I'm getting but not what's happening).

Wait, did I just let the house know how a player can game the system? D'oh!

I'm not too worried about people gaming them, the AI seems to get them quite a lot too.

The system works like this:
Units receive promotions depending on well they do in battle. The less damage they receive & the odds they faced (Winning a battle you had a 98% chance of is not likely to get you a promotion, but winning one with 30% odds will); along with the type of defender they faced and terrain they were on all affect the promotions.

 

[strategyonly]

StrategyOnly,

I looked at the pic, but I'm not sure what I should (or shouldn't be) seeing. What's wrong?

I have been racking my brains now for a week trying to get certain civs to work correctly in RoM, ie in the one pic above (Pirate Civ) i have a different "HorseArcher (its a three unit, boarding party) and what i have right now its bleeding over into ALL civs, just like the Apache Civ, some of the "extra units" Mangas for instance, bleeds into ALL civs cause it is not the normal unit ingame, its an extra unit.

I have been sick for about three weeks now and, its just making me really lazy, and i am taking some "Prescription Drugs" to make me forget about stuff. Dont worry i am fine, just lazy


Thx for asking

 

[Munger]

The system works like this:
Units receive promotions depending on well they do in battle. The less damage they receive & the odds they faced (Winning a battle you had a 98% chance of is not likely to get you a promotion, but winning one with 30% odds will); along with the type of defender they faced and terrain they were on all affect the promotions.

LOL, I was literally just about to ask how exactly the promotion code works, and there it was waiting for me. Cool.

BTW - is the interception mod turned on by default as I didn't see it anywhere in the installation options or the in-game settings.

Is it worth me starting a Beta 3 game now or is Beta 4 imminent?

 

[Afforess]

I have been racking my brains now for a week trying to get certain civs to work correctly in RoM, ie in the one pic above (Pirate Civ) i have a different "HorseArcher (its a three unit, boarding party) and what i have right now its bleeding over into ALL civs, just like the Apache Civ, some of the "extra units" Mangas for instance, bleeds into ALL civs cause it is not the normal unit ingame, its an extra unit.

Are you playing with Assimilation? Have some of the Pirate Cities been captured? If so, then other civilizations can build those UU's. Worth checking anyhow.

I have been sick for about three weeks now and, its just making me really lazy, and i am taking some "Prescription Drugs" to make me forget about stuff. Dont worry i am fine, just lazy

Jeez, that sucks. Just a really bad case of the flu, or something else?

LOL, I was literally just about to ask how exactly the promotion code works, and there it was waiting for me. Cool.

BTW - is the interception mod turned on by default as I didn't see it anywhere in the installation options or the in-game settings.

Is it worth me starting a Beta 3 game now or is Beta 4 imminent?

Better Air Interception is on by default. See the globalAltDefines to turn it off.

Beta4 still has a bit of testing to go through, there is a diplomacy bug I want to fix.

 

[scribbler]

Dude, you need a Mac, that stuff doesn't happen on them, with Windows SNAFU is common (Situation Normal, All F***ed Up)

Pfft. Please. I've crashed Macs in less time than it takes me to boot Windows...heh.

Full reply behind the spoiler tag.

Spoiler :

Both systems have their pluses and minuses. Yes, Windows does have problems that it shouldn't -- but that's mostly because the entire system has historically been far more laissez-faire, with programs often using hacks to accomplish something instead of running through the normal API (although to be fair, sometimes there just was no API available). Redmond did often fail when it came to enforcing standards because they wanted to get more programs on their platform, so they've always tried to give the app developers as free a hand as possible. Unfortunately, most app developers took that as a license to make things that will not play well with others (not to mention driver developers who should be lined up against a wall and forced to stand there while all the systems they've crippled booted up -- sequentially).

Most of the problems that I've seen on Windows have nothing to do with Windows itself but poorly written applications and drivers. Don't get me started on some of the early ASUS software, or better yet, some of the third-party wireless driver apps. Not to mention, although I will, all the programs poorly educated users put on their computers to "improve" them, only to destabilize their systems (and sometimes networks).

With Macs, because the user base is so much smaller, standards have been easier to maintain. In some ways, because Macs haven't had the population pressure that Redmond has (poorly, very poorly) dealt with, they've been able to grow at a rate that matures alongside their user-base. This has resulted in a very nice system with some of the most standard compliant software in the entire consumer and prosumer markets.

But to a large extent now that there is competition on the front of actual stability, Microsoft came out with Windows 7. Not to make myself into a fan-boy, but they have cleaned up their act a lot, with the requisite baying and howling and gnashing of teeth in the driver developer community (because they need to get everything signed off on by Microsoft). Now Windows 7 runs far more stable than my Amiga did back in the day (which, sad to say, wasn't the case of any Windows OS until now -- but how much more you could do in even Windows 98 than in Amiga OS 3.1).

And with Apple moving more and more into the appliance marketplace (iPod, iPhone, iPad), it's not altogether clear whether they'll stay on track on their OS development.

Were things simpler, I'd be able to either dismiss you out of hand, or agree with you. But that's not how the world works, even though all of us want to simplify things into black and white (often enough those who say there is no black and white, only gray, are the worst at this -- see, there I go making things black and white).

In short, your blind Mac-boy-fan-ism isn't going to cut it with me. I cut my teeth on DOS 3.x, played with Windows 3.1 (including Photoshop 1.x -- ah, the days when I didn't think about the legality or morality of a little piracy) and hated it, turned over to an Amiga 1200, and truly fell in love with computers on that machine (although I did miss Wing Commander and Privateer since I had to give the 386 to my brother - Frontier Elite II just wasn't enough. Never could get the Amiga version). It goes without saying that I spent way too much time and money on her, of course. And like most early loves, she didn't age well.

In my time I've used Mac OS 6-X, Linux, Unix, and everything in between. When my high school needed someone to keep their Amigas running, it was me until I graduated, not some IT department (we didn't have one). When I sit in front of a Mac, I leave the poor slobs who use it regularly in the dust -- and I've used OS X maybe a total of six hours in my entire life.

I live and breath computers. So please, please leave the fanboyism at the door. Just about every commenter in this thread is better than that and doesn't deserve it.

[EOR]
[EOF]

PS> Fanboyism is a sore point with me, you may have noticed.

 

[civ_king]

Pfft. Please. I've crashed Macs in less time than it takes me to boot Windows...heh.

Full reply behind the spoiler tag.

Spoiler :

Both systems have their pluses and minuses. Yes, Windows does have problems that it shouldn't -- but that's mostly because the entire system has historically been far more laissez-faire, with programs often using hacks to accomplish something instead of running through the normal API (although to be fair, sometimes there just was no API available). Redmond did often fail when it came to enforcing standards because they wanted to get more programs on their platform, so they've always tried to give the app developers as free a hand as possible. Unfortunately, most app developers took that as a license to make things that will not play well with others (not to mention driver developers who should be lined up against a wall and forced to stand there while all the systems they've crippled booted up -- sequentially).

Most of the problems that I've seen on Windows have nothing to do with Windows itself but poorly written applications and drivers. Don't get me started on some of the early ASUS software, or better yet, some of the third-party wireless driver apps. Not to mention, although I will, all the programs poorly educated users put on their computers to "improve" them, only to destabilize their systems (and sometimes networks).

With Macs, because the user base is so much smaller, standards have been easier to maintain. In some ways, because Macs haven't had the population pressure that Redmond has (poorly, very poorly) dealt with, they've been able to grow at a rate that matures alongside their user-base. This has resulted in a very nice system with some of the most standard compliant software in the entire consumer and prosumer markets.

But to a large extent now that there is competition on the front of actual stability, Microsoft came out with Windows 7. Not to make myself into a fan-boy, but they have cleaned up their act a lot, with the requisite baying and howling and gnashing of teeth in the driver developer community (because they need to get everything signed off on by Microsoft). Now Windows 7 runs far more stable than my Amiga did back in the day (which, sad to say, wasn't the case of any Windows OS until now -- but how much more you could do in even Windows 98 than in Amiga OS 3.1).

And with Apple moving more and more into the appliance marketplace (iPod, iPhone, iPad), it's not altogether clear whether they'll stay on track on their OS development.

Were things simpler, I'd be able to either dismiss you out of hand, or agree with you. But that's not how the world works, even though all of us want to simplify things into black and white (often enough those who say there is no black and white, only gray, are the worst at this -- see, there I go making things black and white).

In short, your blind Mac-boy-fan-ism isn't going to cut it with me. I cut my teeth on DOS 3.x, played with Windows 3.1 (including Photoshop 1.x -- ah, the days when I didn't think about the legality or morality of a little piracy) and hated it, turned over to an Amiga 1200, and truly fell in love with computers on that machine (although I did miss Wing Commander and Privateer since I had to give the 386 to my brother - Frontier Elite II just wasn't enough. Never could get the Amiga version). It goes without saying that I spent way too much time and money on her, of course. And like most early loves, she didn't age well.

In my time I've used Mac OS 6-X, Linux, Unix, and everything in between. When my high school needed someone to keep their Amigas running, it was me until I graduated, not some IT department (we didn't have one). When I sit in front of a Mac, I leave the poor slobs who use it regularly in the dust -- and I've used OS X maybe a total of six hours in my entire life.

I live and breath computers. So please, please leave the fanboyism at the door. Just about every commenter in this thread is better than that and doesn't deserve it.

[EOR]
[EOF]

PS> Fanboyism is a sore point with me, you may have noticed.

Wow, how did you manage to crash OS X?

@Afforess, I'm at 1900/3000 on my game, when I finish I'll switch to 1.60

 

[scribbler]

Wow, how did you manage to crash OS X?

Hmm, I was being glib with that. That's why I said the full response was in the tag.

Haven't crashed a Mac in a long time -- but then I don't work on them except for setting things up for clients, and it would look a mite bad if I crashed a client's computer. Mac users are even bigger hoverers than most -- makes me feel bad when I go ahead and do everything so fast that they're left wondering what I did. Or maybe it's an ego-trip, always mix those up.

I have however heard about the vaunted stability of Macs for the last 16 years or so, and I did crash them in the past. Even got them to give me the legendary, "An error occurred because an error occurred" error window. Fun times.

 

[civ_king]

Hmm, I was being glib with that. That's why I said the full response was in the tag.

Haven't crashed a Mac in a long time -- but then I don't work on them except for setting things up for clients, and it would look a mite bad if I crashed a client's computer. Mac users are even bigger hoverers than most -- makes me feel bad when I go ahead and do everything so fast that they're left wondering what I did. Or maybe it's an ego-trip, always mix those up.

I have however heard about the vaunted stability of Macs for the last 16 years or so, and I did crash them in the past. Even got them to give me the legendary, "An error occurred because an error occurred" error window. Fun times.

ah, I got something almost as awesome in WIndows, it basically said you don't have enough space to delete this file

always gives me chuckle

 

[scribbler]

ah, I got something almost as awesome in WIndows, it basically said you don't have enough space to delete this file

always gives me chuckle

Ah, isn't that something to do with recycle bin? Or is it file allocation?

Most operating systems do way more on the disk than just read/write when performing file operations. Updating the file index, for one thing. Still, that does look counter-intuitive.

My own low disk space story is more prosaic (or is it?). Roommate asks me to check his computer -- it's slow and won't let him save anything. I go on the computer and notice right off the bat that his 10GB (this was about 8 years ago and the comp was a few years old) HDD was full. So I ask him what could be taking up all that space.

He tells me he has no idea. I start a basic search for large folders. Find it pretty quick, too. Right on the desktop.

He had 5+ GB of pr0n. Of course, he swore at first that he had no idea how that got there. Then, when he realized just how unlikely I was to believe that, he swore that he didn't know it took up so much space.

Well, the unlimited dial-up connection we had sure got a workout (among other things).

I didn't let him live that down for a while.

(Suffice it to say, when we got cable internet, he had me install a larger hard drive in his computer )

We've taken things off topic a bit far here, and so as to return to topic...I got nothing. Maybe later.