Altered maps

[Thorbal]

Here you go.

http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-37310-3.html

Hehe, those maps are nice .

Although I would like to point out that a *lot* of these translations (even the ones for the English/American area) are plain wrong. They are more suited for entertainment, don´t take them too seriously. Most of the time the mapmaker just plainly translated without considering the meaning of the words.

Example: Brunswick, called Brown Village there. Today, it is called Braunschweig in German (Braun meaning brown in English). BUT:
the settlement was originally named Brunswik, which means something completely different. To quote Wiki:

The town's original name of Brunswik is a combination of the name Bruno and wik, a place where merchants rested and stored their goods. The town's name therefore indicates an ideal resting-place, as it lay by a ford across the Oker River. Documents from the St. Magni Church from 1031 give the city's name as Brunesguik. Another explanation of the city's name is that it comes from Brand, or burning, indicating a place which developed after the landscape was cleared through burning.

So it has nothing to do with "brown" at all!

Did not want to spoil the fun, as the maps are great, just wanted to point that out.

 

[Winner]

I've posted this map before, but...

Dialects in Czech Rep.:

 

[Winner]

Did not want to spoil the fun, as the maps are great, just wanted to point that out.

The same with Brno:

The etymology of the name Brno is disputed. It most likely comes from Old Czech brnen, brno 'muddy, swampy.'[2] Alternative explanations derive it from a Slavic verb brniti (to armor or to fortify) or a Celtic language spoken in the area before it was overrun by Slavic and Germanic peoples (this theory would make it cognate with other Celtic words for hill, such as the Welsh word bryn). Throughout its history, Brno's locals also used to refer to the town in other languages, including Brünn in German, ברנו in Hebrew, and Bruna in Latin.

 

[warpus]

What are the different dialects?

 

[Mirc]

You've got so many and so "weirdly shaped (on a map)" dialects in the Czech republic? I had no idea until now. What are they, how did they come around in such a small space?


In Romania we don't have dialects but you can group the accents in two big chunks (well actually IMO there should be 3, but whatever):

Spoiler :

 

[Winner]

What are the different dialects?

Yellow: Bohemian dialects
Magenta: Central Moravian group
Cyan: East Moravian group
Green: Silesian group (Silesian-Moravian and Silesian-Polish subgroup)
Grey: mixed dialects/common Czech (post-German areas settled by people from all around Czechoslovakia in the late 1940s and 1950s)

Moravia is more diverse with more distinct and recognizable dialects, Bohemia is... well, all of them sound gay Silesian dialects are very strong. In addition, there is Brno with its own words and phrases derived from German, Yiddish and Italian.

Anyway, the differences are pretty small, mostly in pronounciation with few grammatical differences. In fact, I would say that Slovak is just another dialect of Czech, but that wouldn't be very sensitive

 

[gangleri2001]

Dialectal maps? Here you got some of the iberian peninsula:

Spoiler :

Aragonese:

Asturian (aka. Bable):

Basque:

Catalan:

Galician (best dialectal map ever):

Llanito (aka. Yanito):

Portuguese:

Spanish:

 

[TheLastOne36]

I believe I did post maps like this before.

It comes from a couple of things:
1) Post-german lands are richer, and richer parts vote for liberals
2) In these parts of western territories, which were inhabited by Germans before ww2, there was collectivisation after the war; the local society structures were weaker, and links with tradition etc as well, while links with communist rule stronger. But it doesn't explain Kashubs, Silesians, Major Poles voting for liberals, does it. Kashubs and Silesians have distinct nature and that may account for it: they don't want to be fully swallowed by nationalists who treat them with suspicion. But Major Poles? Major Poland was the bastion of ultranationalism before ww2.

What is interesting is that it's not only about politics. In former German Empire, former Austrian Empire and former Russian Empire, there is different level of railroad density; different plants cultivated; different cattle. Poland is very much divided.

But it wasn't that visible until the de facto 2 party system PO (liberals) and PiS (nationalist conservatives) formed. Before, it looked a bit different.
for example, Zaglebie - an industrial region in former RE - voted left; next to it, industrial region in former GE voted liberal; next to it, agricultural region in former PE voted conservative; now all vote for liberals, mostly.

I recall Chelm region in the most extreme east voting for left, as well as Kielce region - but it may come from that Chelm region was also repopulated to some extent after ww2, because Ukrainians were expelled, and anyway, the left was the biggest party there, but the majority might have been right-winged.

anyway, here is ukraine with election results and polish-lithuanian border (since 1503 or so exactly, but also earlier since XIV century)until 1648, and polish border 1921-1939

Thanks, i was about to write an explanation but you did it for me!

 

[TheLastOne36]

In fact, I would say that Slovak is just another dialect of Czech, but that wouldn't be very sensitive

Interesting, cause imo Slovak is closer to Polish then Polish is to Czech. Also have you ever noticed that the Slovenians speak quite similarly to Polish? (don't know about czech) but when i've been to Slovenia, is was speaking in Polish and the local's were speaking in Slovenian, and we could understand enough of each other to fill in the remaining words we didn't understand in a sentence.

 

[Winner]

Interesting, cause imo Slovak is closer to Polish then Polish is to Czech.

Correct. It's recommended that if you want to understand Polish better, you should listen more Slovak. On the other hand, Slovak is much more similar to Czech.

Also have you ever noticed that the Slovenians speak quite similarly to Polish? (don't know about czech) but when i've been to Slovenia, is was speaking in Polish and the local's were speaking in Slovenian, and we could understand enough of each other to fill in the remaining words we didn't understand in a sentence.

I've never been long enough in Slovenia to actually speak more than few words with locals, so I can't tell. Croatian and Serbian (is it still one language?), however, are quite difficult to understand - I only catch a word here and there.

 

[RedRalph]

How different are Czechs and Slovaks? would the difference be comparable to Serbs and Croats, or only to Danes and Noweigeians? throw me a frickin bone here. Excuse my ignorance, but gimme a comparison.

Czechia is to Slovakia as Ireland is to ?

 

[Mirc]

I've never been long enough in Slovenia to actually speak more than few words with locals, so I can't tell.

Well I don't know about Czech or Polish but I've been to Slovenia 3 times and from what I seen, it's by far the most distant language of ex-Yugoslavia, even though people from other southwestern Slavic languages would be able to understand each other when talking to a Slovene... again from what I've seen.

Of course I couldn't understand a word but I learned a few as I always do when I go somewhere.

 

[philippe]

'land of the warriors'.

 

[Winner]

How different are Czechs and Slovaks? would the difference be comparable to Serbs and Croats, or only to Danes and Noweigeians? throw me a frickin bone here. Excuse my ignorance, but gimme a comparison.

Czechia is to Slovakia as Ireland is to ?

Sorry, no comparison with Ireland - you have never oppressed a smaller nation (/joke). Serbs and Croats? No, we don't like to kill each other Also, Serbs and Croats are quite different culturally - different letters, different religion.

The languages is mutually intelligible to a very, very large extent. That's why I said that Slovak could be considered a dialect of Czech (or the other way round). I'd compare it to French and the Walloons, Dutch and the Flemings or Finns and Estonians.

Most of the differences stem from a different historical experience (or more precisely the absence of independent Slovak state until 1993) and the differences in mindset and cultural traditions.

Personaly, I have a hard time thinking about Slovaks as foreigners. I regularly watch Slovak TV, read news on Slovak servers, listen to Slovak music and meet Slovaks in my daily life so it is quite hard to view them as a separate nation. They're our bratia after all.

 

[Winner]

Well I don't know about Czech or Polish but I've been to Slovenia 3 times and from what I seen, it's by far the most distant language of ex-Yugoslavia, even though people from other southwestern Slavic languages would be able to understand each other when talking to a Slovene... again from what I've seen.

When I was in Croatia, I communicated mostly in English, it was quite hard to try to understand what they were saying.

Funny part is that one or two words they use regularly are among the most vulgar swear words in Czech

 

[Mirc]

When I was in Croatia, I communicated mostly in English, it was quite hard to try to understand what they were saying.

Funny part is that one or two words they use regularly are among the most vulgar swear words in Czech

That happens for us with several languages. The French word for "chicken" or "court" and the Portuguese word for "jump" mean certain things in Romanian.

Anyway, what you said about communicating in English reminds me of when I was in Spain... I was understanding virtually everything but there was no way to find my words, so I was answering back in English. Or in Venice, before I realized how easy it was for me to speak Italian, there were these two Italian girls who didn't speak English, and we understood each other with me speaking in my language with a few Italian words there and there, and them speaking in their language. Language families are useful.

Also, Serbs and Croats are quite different culturally - different letters, different religion.

The Latin alphabet is used alongside the Cyrillic in Serbia. You can get by without knowing any Cyrillic at all. I can guarantee on that because I've been way too many times to Belgrade.

AFAIK there were propositions to switch to the Latin one but they weren't agreed upon (although I might be wrong) and both are official now.

 

[TheLastOne36]

I've never been long enough in Slovenia to actually speak more than few words with locals, so I can't tell. Croatian and Serbian (is it still one language?), however, are quite difficult to understand - I only catch a word here and there.

Slovenia i think can be considered part of Central Europe, i mean the are catholic, use latin alphabet, was for most of the time with Austria, and are pretty modernized.

 

[Winner]

That happens for us with several languages. The French word for "chicken" or "court" and the Portuguese word for "jump" mean certain things in Romanian.

I simply couldn't say it without blushing and feeling like an idiot, so I avoided it by speaking English

Language families are useful.

Exactly - especially if your language is a part of a very large one like the Slavic or Romance language families It sucks for the Basques though

The Latin alphabet is used alongside the Cyrillic in Serbia. You can get by without knowing any Cyrillic at all. I can guarantee on that because I've been way too many times to Belgrade.

I am probably too influenced by my experience with Serbian parts of Bosnia - no latin letters anywhere. When our car headed north, a car with a Dutch licence plate desperately followed us all the way, probably to avoid getting lost, which is quite easy when you don't know Cyrillic

AFAIK there were propositions to switch to the Latin one but they weren't agreed upon (although I might be wrong) and both are official now.

IMO Cyrillic can be an obstacle to investments and integration into the EU for some countries. I hate it every time I see something in Cyrillic and can't read it

 

[Mirc]

Slovenia i think can be considered part of Central Europe, i mean the are catholic

Just like Croatia.

use latin alphabet

Just like Croatia and Serbia.

was for most of the time with Austria

Just like Croatia.

and are pretty modernized.

Well Slovenia is definitely more well-developed, but how "modernized" a country is is a very subjective topic.

Just trying to show a different point of view here...

 

[Mirc]

I simply couldn't say it without blushing and feeling like an idiot, so I avoided it by speaking English

Yeah, I remember also my aunt who's living in Italy told me how she couldn't say the Italian word for "cleanliness" so for months she avoided it by turning the U into an O, the resulting word unfortunately literally meaning "police" in Italian (which caused confusion).

Exactly - especially if your language is a part of a very large one like the Slavic or Romance language families It sucks for the Basques though

Yeah, my first thought after typing that was about the Basques and Albanians.

I am probably too influenced by my experience with Serbian parts of Bosnia - no latin letters anywhere. When our car headed north, a car with a Dutch licence plate desperately followed us all the way, probably to avoid getting lost, which is quite easy when you don't know Cyrillic

IMO Cyrillic can be an obstacle to investments and integration into the EU for some countries. I hate it every time I see something in Cyrillic and can't read it

I completely agree. No point in keeping something that's only going to create you problems. And the more you keep something, the harder it will be to change if you're ever going to be hard-pressed to do so.

I learned to read both Cyrillic and Greek when I was 11 or 12, out of my own desire. Of course it didn't help me much (and when I was in Greece I realized I completely forgot Greek because I didn't practice it and it's got much weirder rules than the Cyrillic, like 5 different ways to write an "I" ). It wouldn't help much in a foreign country, since I don't speak the language anyway, but it helped when I wanted to be a smartass and I read for my friends texts from the walls of medieval churches in Romania (old Slavonian characters used to represent old Romanian, or occasionally Greek).