AM6- 5CC Always War (Dare to try??)
- Thread starter amirsan
- Start date
Got the game.
I will play my 20 turns tonight and post the save straight away (if don't fall asleep in the process...
).
A few comments.
1. Is the Spearman meant to stay in Rome as defence + MP? Otherwise I would rather build another Archer and explore the area to the W (then go back to Spearman).
2. Granary. I really don't know if it is necessary, having to found "only" 5 cities. If so, I would pop-rush it before building the first settler. Or...
3. ...Should we rather build a few more units and then Barracks, in Rome? The decision on the Granary would then be taken when we know the neighbourhood a little better.
On first looking at the map, I would see a city placed next to the game to the SE as better suited for Settler building, but that may take a while to set up properly...
More later on. Now there's a meeting
I will play my 20 turns tonight and post the save straight away (if don't fall asleep in the process...
).A few comments.
1. Is the Spearman meant to stay in Rome as defence + MP? Otherwise I would rather build another Archer and explore the area to the W (then go back to Spearman).
2. Granary. I really don't know if it is necessary, having to found "only" 5 cities. If so, I would pop-rush it before building the first settler. Or...
3. ...Should we rather build a few more units and then Barracks, in Rome? The decision on the Granary would then be taken when we know the neighbourhood a little better.
On first looking at the map, I would see a city placed next to the game to the SE as better suited for Settler building, but that may take a while to set up properly...
More later on. Now there's a meeting
amirsan
King of all Kings
Noooooo, change the Spear to anything you want. Yes, I dont think we need a Granary. I would just change to archer.
Uuuuuummm, about the 4000BC pic, I didn't take one, sorry
. I just settled Rome NE on a regular grassland. I think we will get tons of production from this city, 2 mountains is alot.
Uuuuuummm, about the 4000BC pic, I didn't take one, sorry
. I just settled Rome NE on a regular grassland. I think we will get tons of production from this city, 2 mountains is alot.
cgannon64
BOB DYLAN'S ROCKIN OUT!
I'm getting confused on Tark1 (my other SG) so I'll ask here also:
This is PTW 1.21, correct?
This is PTW 1.21, correct?
Originally posted by amirsan
Uuuuuummm, about the 4000BC pic, I didn't take one, sorry
@Amirsan: Hmm, yes, that's exactly the problem.
You moved the settler to the coast, this is the first mistake (we haven't even 12 productive tiles).
The second one: 3 regular military units? We discussed that we need barracks for vets ASAP!
A warrior for limited scouting near the capitol would have been enough. The AI has no starting-units on Regent.
Next thing: About your future city-site:
As cgcannon already stated, we need 5 productive cities, a city surrounded by mountains will not help
us at all. I'm also wondering about: "Do we need a Granary??"
Without a single food-bonus, a granary isn't optional, it is mandatory!
You refered to your turns as "boring", well, there may be only a small amount
of work to do, but the BC turns are VERY important in a 5CC-AW. Every small mistake
is going to be a major headache later in the game, in particular in this difficult variant.
Maybe your AW-experience is limited, two other team-members stated this already.
I have no problem with that, as long as we discuss the important things like
city placement (I posted this point before), we will be fine and hopefully win as a team.
Everyone should benefit from the experience of the other players where he has limited
skills and provide help on topics he is good at. (This teamwork is the main reason I decided to join SGs).
I'm certainly not the best player around, but I have played numerous AW games
on every difficult level up to emperor. Also playing styles differ and you are free
to disagree with me, but then your strategies have to work well.
And making 4! mistakes during a "boring" turn is already major
And finally, I had a look at the save. I doubt that this is a small world,
the sector defined by the white frame on the minimap is just too small.
We agreed on a small map, this was one of the important preconditions,
so can you please confirm this?
Belisar
cgannon64
BOB DYLAN'S ROCKIN OUT!
@ Belisar: If this is a bigger map then small, I suggest we restart. I would continue playing even though there were a couple mistakes on amirisan's part (hey we all make them) but the map being Standard or larger is a big thing.
(BTW, its cgannon, not cgcannon. I guess people always assume I have a thing for cannons.)
(BTW, its cgannon, not cgcannon. I guess people always assume I have a thing for cannons.
)@cgannon: Sorry for the typo.
And yes, we all are making mistakes. It would have helped if he discussed things, we don't need to play the fastest SG ever.
I just think he underestimates the difficult-level of this variant.
Let's wait for Amirsans confirmation about the map-size.
And yes, we all are making mistakes. It would have helped if he discussed things, we don't need to play the fastest SG ever.
I just think he underestimates the difficult-level of this variant.
Let's wait for Amirsans confirmation about the map-size.
amirsan
King of all Kings
Do you want to restart??
@Belisar, I dont see how moveing to the coast is soo bad. The extra commerce and the ability to build ships, whats so bad?? I didnt even move thier for the coast, I moved there for the extra mountain,. Did you say something about production???
About settling all the way over there, if we have horses and iron in our vecinity, then whats soo bad about settling over there?? What if the Horses were all the way over there?? We would take it right, or no??
About the build order, I only got to build the warrior, I put the Spear for protection, but it is vetoable so what ever Karasu want to do, he can do.
@Belisar, I dont see how moveing to the coast is soo bad. The extra commerce and the ability to build ships, whats so bad?? I didnt even move thier for the coast, I moved there for the extra mountain,
. Did you say something about production???About settling all the way over there, if we have horses and iron in our vecinity, then whats soo bad about settling over there?? What if the Horses were all the way over there?? We would take it right, or no??
About the build order, I only got to build the warrior, I put the Spear for protection, but it is vetoable so what ever Karasu want to do, he can do.
Coffee
Cdn Expat
@amirsan. I feel like this double variant is just too confusing to take on right now. LKendter was right. If you restart, perhaps just pick one.
Hey, it's good that we make some mistakes, so we have a better chance to improve -and, most of all, you won't kill me if I make some on my own!!
About restarting or not, I believe it's Amirsan's choiche. I will have no problems either way.
Just let me know asap, as I will be moving around tomorrow (Friday) and I will have trouble checking the forum during the day (Central European Time).
'Later.
P.S.: cgannon, I think it's the "c" before the "g" that misleads people. Our brain always tries to give a meaning to everything we read, and the similarity to "cannon" is just too tempting... But then, what's wrong with having something for cannons? I like them
About restarting or not, I believe it's Amirsan's choiche. I will have no problems either way.
Just let me know asap, as I will be moving around tomorrow (Friday) and I will have trouble checking the forum during the day (Central European Time).
'Later.
P.S.: cgannon, I think it's the "c" before the "g" that misleads people. Our brain always tries to give a meaning to everything we read, and the similarity to "cannon" is just too tempting... But then, what's wrong with having something for cannons? I like them
Bacon King
Emperor
@Carasu- why have a cannon when you could have artillery?
Originally posted by amirsan
@Belisar, I dont see how moveing to the coast is soo bad. The extra commerce and the ability to build ships, whats so bad?? I didnt even move thier for the coast, I moved there for the extra mountain,
Ok, I try to explain: With moving to the coast, we have LOST production (count the tiles, the plains....) AND less land-tiles to work on. Also we don't need many ships on a pangea, perhaps our last city can be settled on the coast.
This is simply not a very good place for a city that should reach size 12 quickly and be productive. And we want all of our limited cities on good places, not just 3 or 4.
Again, check the tiles around this spot.
You were going to build the THIRD REGULAR unit, we want veterans (we are militaristic, so barracks are cheap). Also we want new productive cities as soon as possible. The last thing we want is producing a lot of useless regular archers that cann't be upgraded to legions, costing us gpt because we haven't enough cities for the troop-support.
If all this basic principles are new to you, then you don't qualify for such a difficult variant, I'm sorry.
And you haven't answered my question about the map size....
EDIT: @Karasu: And again, its Ok to make mistakes (we all do) and learn by playing. But its also honest to admit
moves and don't insist on them.Bacon King
Emperor
I vote for a restart.
or i could vote half each
seriously, a restart would be best, so we'd all decide what to do.
And if we really need to be coordinated, we could have someone playing it while in a chat with the rest of us, like the demogame. but dont think thats necisary.
or i could vote half each
seriously, a restart would be best, so we'd all decide what to do.
And if we really need to be coordinated, we could have someone playing it while in a chat with the rest of us, like the demogame. but dont think thats necisary.
amirsan
King of all Kings
I dont mind that but I dont know how to get in the chat.
@Belisar- Did you just disregard what I just said?? I told you that I moved NE becuase of the mountains, below was nothing but plains, I think 2 commerce coast tiles are better. I didnt even know what was north (which we all found out was the sea) so I moved there to get the mountain. I certainly think that 3 shield mountians are better that one shield grasslands, which we wont be using all of our tiles untill the modern age for our pop. to get all the way to 24. Now, if you know about playing on higher levels, then you know that extra lux. are a key in the Middle Age and Early Industrial for $$$ and techs. I didin't specifay you guys to settle in that excact spot but to settle so we get all of those gems without some other civ takeing it and using it for themselves. Just as I said, if the iron was way over there, wouldn't you take it regardless of haveing only 4 productive cities. Quote/unquote.
Shall I make the new game now??
@Belisar- Did you just disregard what I just said?? I told you that I moved NE becuase of the mountains, below was nothing but plains, I think 2 commerce coast tiles are better
. I didnt even know what was north (which we all found out was the sea) so I moved there to get the mountain. I certainly think that 3 shield mountians are better that one shield grasslands, which we wont be using all of our tiles untill the modern age for our pop. to get all the way to 24. Now, if you know about playing on higher levels, then you know that extra lux. are a key in the Middle Age and Early Industrial for $$$ and techs. I didin't specifay you guys to settle in that excact spot but to settle so we get all of those gems without some other civ takeing it and using it for themselves. Just as I said, if the iron was way over there, wouldn't you take it regardless of haveing only 4 productive cities. Quote/unquote. Shall I make the new game now??
This is my last attempt to find out the map size. Please, Amirsan, tell us the settings so we can decide how to move on.
@Amirsan: My point is: you moved to the coast, this is not appropriate for a pangea 5CC-AW game. If you count the tiles, you gained 3 shields by loosing 6-7 or so, will have to check. I know you didn't see all the tiles at your first turn, but that's why I asked for the save or a screenshot.
As for your proposed city-spot. I can only repeat myself (severe growth-problem).
We will get the lux, by boarder-expansions (perhaps a site near the hills is appropriate, will have to see after scouting) or with a colony. Also if one of the other civs settles thus near and we cann't take them out in an AW game, we have much bigger problems, this isn't a builder-game were we have to tolerate aggressive settlemet.
@Amirsan: My point is: you moved to the coast, this is not appropriate for a pangea 5CC-AW game. If you count the tiles, you gained 3 shields by loosing 6-7 or so, will have to check. I know you didn't see all the tiles at your first turn, but that's why I asked for the save or a screenshot.
As for your proposed city-spot. I can only repeat myself (severe growth-problem).
We will get the lux, by boarder-expansions (perhaps a site near the hills is appropriate, will have to see after scouting) or with a colony. Also if one of the other civs settles thus near and we cann't take them out in an AW game, we have much bigger problems, this isn't a builder-game were we have to tolerate aggressive settlemet.
amirsan
King of all Kings
The map settings is supposed to be Standard BTW, but I will restart. I will start right now.
AIIGHT, DONT WORRY, NO MORE PROBLEMS HERE. AND YES I HAVE PLENTY AW EXPERIENCE
AIIGHT, DONT WORRY, NO MORE PROBLEMS HERE. AND YES I HAVE PLENTY AW EXPERIENCE
amirsan
King of all Kings
BTW, what is the size needed?? Standard or Small. Last time I checked, it was Standard. Please tell me so I could continue.
amirsan
King of all Kings
Nevermind, here's the start pic.
amirsan
King of all Kings
Looks like a Settler factory and a half! BTW, the settler is on a river tile. I will start as soon as you guys reply. I'm thinking about settling right where it stands.
cgannon64
BOB DYLAN'S ROCKIN OUT!
OK, this is small, but is it Pangea? I find (from reading at least) that Pangea is the only way to go with an AW, or else you don't really get the full effect.
