Ank07 - Plain Deity

[Rik Meleet]

@Great Library. As long as we don't learn Education; the GL works. We can gamble to build many galleys with ansars, sail slowly to the American coast and capture Washington and hold it 1 IBT. If 2 civs know perhaps Computers even we'd fling in 1 turn from early middle Ages to Early Modern Age. "The jump of the century" !! (unplayable though).

@ China: I guess they are a bit stretched out at the moment. The main reason is: I can trade for Invention from Spain, and get many techs from Scandinavia for a MA Vs China. If we are at war with China, we perhaps can sign MA's with Egypt. China now has Pyramids and Sun Tzu and that means they will become unbeatable soon. We need Trondheim (or make sure the Vikings take Trondheim).

I think at the moment they are not as strong militarily anymore as before. We have to fight Defensive first, true. But I guess they'll continue to go after the Vikings first as they are weaker. And Egypt is perfectly located to do the hard work for us.
Another reason for war with China is: it will slow there research. And there is no reason why we shouldn't make peace with them quickly. Preferably by not-dealbreaking, but do we really want to pay gpt and further increase AI research speed ?

I know this is a bold, perhaps even idiotic suicidal move, and therefore I'd like the teams input on it. Don't just think: "China is too strong", think about it really. And then tell me what you think of it.

 

[pindicator]

@China
There are a couple snags to going to war with China, Rik... but I do think it is possible. I checked the save, and here is what I came up with:

1) Trade Egypt WM + 338g + 17gpt for Invention. -- didn't check to see if someone else would give it cheaper.
2) Vikings give us Gun Powder, Theology, & 1g for Peace, 15gpt & WM.

I agree that peace is necessary with the Vikings; WW alone is costing us probably 70-100gpt; didn't write the number down, but it's a lot. Lux can drop to 10% (probably even 0 if you want to put taxmen/entertainers in a few towns). Up to here I agree this is what we should do.

Here it gets a little sketchy:

3A) Get Chem and Ed from Vikings in exchange for MA against China + 42gpt

OR, if we want to keep the Great Library idea open:

3B) Get Chem, WM, 4gpt, & 17g for MA against China, or
3C) Get Chem, 6gpt, & 5g for MA against China

Afterwards we have enough gpt to buy Egypt and/or America into an MA against China.

Now the problems...

Our offensive military consists of 8 Ansars and a few MDIs. Many of those Ansars are healing. We have a ton of Pikes, but they won't be great against Cavs, so the MAs will be necessary. Even more against us is the fact that China's armies are probably mostly in the south, attacking Scandinavia.

Also, we currently have 6 turns left on a deal with China. We are getting Dyes for 11gpt, and since we're the one getting the commodity in exchange for gold, I believe that the rep hit won't be as bad. However, I might be wrong.

I was still able to sign people in MAs against China, but that might only be cause we slighted them in the game's eyes. I will leave this to others more knowledgeable in reputation to explain how damaging declaring on China would be right now.

So, after all this banter, I say we do #1 (if it is the best deal, not including China) & #2 that I listed above. In 6 turns we re-evaluate and decide whether or taking on China will be worth it. Or sooner if the Vikings lose another city. How about everyone else?

 

[Bede]

The thought of doing anything that affects, or might affect, our trading rep gives me the willies simply because that is the easiest way to get buried in a Diety game. I think #1 and #2. Wait for China deals to expire, then try #3.

 

[Ankka]

I would say let's make peace with the Vikings and get the most out of them. Galleys are hopeless if we are going to try and get the GL city captured... at least caravels would be needed.


Somehow we should try and cripple the AI tech pace. It's madness when they trade like that and research like mad...

 

[Rik Meleet]

It seems the team doesn't like the 180 degrees turn and sign on China. I will think about it some more. I hope to play today.

 

[Ankka]

We could do the China assault if we had a bigger army. But we don't. So try and get the game in peace for a while so we get some cash and can build a larger army.

 

[Ankka]

Rik? Are you playing?

 

[Rik Meleet]

yeah - playing now.

 

[Rik Meleet]

IHT. Sign this deal with Spain:

This deal with Vikings:

MM cities for peace. Stavanger to settler, there are some gaps close. Move all troops back into Stavanger, it won't flip since Trondheim is now Chinese. Mecca on Muskets. Sell Chivalry to Spain for 8 gpt + 42 gold. Trade Indian Furs + Chem for our Silks + WM + 63 gpt + 9 gold. We can now go 100% tax. Research on Mettalurgy.

IBT. Scandinavia signs peace with Ottomans. Copenhagen finishes its temple.
Stavanger riots because resistment ends. I hate this feature.

[1] 480 AD. Assembling troops in Stavanger.
Mettallurgy is purchasable form Egypt and China, but it'll cost us our whole gpt. No deal.

IBT: Scandinavia and Ottomans sign MA Vs India. Interesting. Chinese raze Viking city. they are down to 1 city.
Egypt Demands TM + 27 gold. I don't want war, please have it.
Karasjok ends resisting and falls to disorder.

[2] 490 AD. More cities switch to settlers. Rush settlers in Stavanger and Hareid. Sending Ansars in Stavanger to scout / block.

IBT. Americans destroyed the Vikings. Egypt signs peace with India and Spain.

[3] 500 AD. 2 settlers are on their way.

IBT: China and Otto's sign MA Vs India. Chinese want to talk. They want us to help them fight the Indians. No, rather not.

[4] 510 AD. Many Chinese troops leave the area. Settlers reach their positions. Rush 1 more settler.
IBT: India signs peace with Ottomans. Americans start Magellan

[5] 520 AD. Found Muscat, our Furs city. Found Mansura close to Trondheim. We've finished a settler in Hareid, plan to use him for an Ivory city.

IBT: Chinese ask our troops to leave. I apologise. Ottoman city of Antalya builds Magellan.

[6] 530 AD. Put our Ansara strategically to obstruct (not block) foreign forces. This turn 2 lux deals are going to end. I have to renegotiate now. China: Dyes for 11 gpt -> They want a lot more now. Egypt: Incense for 13 gpt. They also want a lot more now. Buy Incense + Ivory from Egypt for 32 gpt. I know we'll most likely have our own Ivory soon, but I can't afford upping the lux-slider. And a happy Egypt is good, since there will be a Egypt/Arab - Chinese war some day.

[7] 540 AD. We've got a 2nd Saltpeter online. Hold of buying Mettalurgy still. Chinese have turned Cautious, gift him our WM. Gift everyone our WM.

[8] 550 AD. Not much.

[9] 560 AD. Not Much. Hmm Chinese are Annoyed.

[10] 570 AD. 2 settlers reach their destination. Another settler comes online next turn.

 

[Ankka]

Nice job, Rik.



Bede - on deck
pindicator
conehead234
Rik Meleet - just played
Ankka - UP! - Playing today? or tomorrow.

REMEMBER: 24h to post a got it, 48 total to complete the turns.

 

[Ankka]

We should perhaps decide on what victory we'll be heading for.

My thoughts:

-Conquest is propably too late to start, no fun
-Domination would be maybe a good choice?
-Cultural victories are out of count.
-Diplomatic would be ok too
-Spaceship would be quite tough.

 

[Rik Meleet]

We can still win whatever way we choose. Just continue to build up ansars, strike at China with the help of Egypt sometime good and we'll be on top. After that we can conquest at will.

 

[Ankka]

Good point. Prhaps we should do this? Or domination? What do you guys think?

 

[pindicator]

Good job Rik! Excellent trading; far better than the scenerio I drew up. It would be really nice to take on the Chinese, but that probably won't happen til we have tons of cavs... and they'll probably have infantry by then.

 

[Ankka]

The great weapon against the AI is bombardment. Artillery. They never stand a chance against a big pile of artilleries.

 

[Ankka]

Playing now, I'm gonna do some peacetime building, infrastructure and stuff, I hope. Let's hope China doesn't sneak attack on us...

 

[Ankka]

Sorry, I noticed I have also Bugs1 PTW to be played, it's quite a monster so I won't have the time nor energy for this as I want to also do something elose today than just play civ...



Bede - UP!
pindicator - on deck
conehead234
Rik Meleet - just played
Ankka - UP! - needs a skip.

REMEMBER: 24h to post a got it, 48 total to complete the turns.

 

[Bede]

Got it.

Any projects?

 

[Rik Meleet]

Bede: We have confidence in you that you can find your own projects. I can tell you what my project was though. Settlers because there is open terrain, temples to close the open terrain, cats, ansara and muskets to prepare for the upcoming war with China.

 

[Ankka]

Bede?