Ara - civ and leaders discussion/prediction

[Rac]

Moderator Action: Attention, this thread was cut from another one, so posts might randomly be missing. The_J

So I didn't saw a proper list done online yet, but these are all the factions and leaders publicly shown/teased from the devepoler diaries as of now for Ara's launch, quite some choices here, some uncertainties too but mostly everything confirmed from the UI shown (if readable of course)

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Interesting. Some very familiar names on that list from the Civ games, but also a mixed group: quite a number of 'leaders' that never led their country at all either officially or unofficially, so they are apparently going for the Symbolic Leader rather than any actual political leader. That means the full list with all the details is liable to have some real surprises on it!

 

[SeelingCat]

So I didn't saw a proper list done online yet, but these are all the factions and leaders publicly shown/teased from the devepoler diaries as of now for Ara's launch, quite some choices here, some uncertainties too but mostly everything confirmed from the UI shown (if readable of course)

I believe Byzantium's leader is Irene, not Theodora, as they've mentioned her in some promotional materials.

Also, Ghana's leader is Yaa Asantewaa (this video at 6:25)

Cherokee's leader is Wilma Mankiller (this video at 5:50)

Meroë is a capital, Nubia as a potential faction?

 

[Rac]

I believe Byzantium's leader is Irene, not Theodora, as they've mentioned her in some promotional materials.

Also, Ghana's leader is Yaa Asantewaa (this video at 6:25)

Cherokee's leader is Wilma Mankiller (this video at 5:50)

Meroë is a capital, Nubia as a potential faction?

Good call, I somehow forgot to check the first 3 dev diaries, also on Meröe, we indeed have Kush as faction lead by Amaniremas, she was shown in this dev video (at 1:00) from the time of the second alpha I think, also Howard Florey is leading Australia too (same video), wellp now the corrected list

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Weird they're going for the Abbasids instead of Arabia

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Weird they're going for the Abbasids instead of Arabia

Not so much. As soon as the early Moslem armies left Arabia they began to take on cultural and other traits from the much larger populations they conquered, so that a 'pure' Arabia would be almost impossible to separate from the earliest Caliphates, which were really the early 'Arabian' power blocs.
Besides, using Harun as a leader gives them a chance to go for a Science/Knowledge-based Arabian Abbasids, which would be a nice change from the eternal Religion/Militant Arabia.

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Not so much. As soon as the early Moslem armies left Arabia they began to take on cultural and other traits from the much larger populations they conquered, so that a 'pure' Arabia would be almost impossible to separate from the earliest Caliphates, which were really the early 'Arabian' power blocs.
Besides, using Harun as a leader gives them a chance to go for a Science/Knowledge-based Arabian Abbasids, which would be a nice change from the eternal Religion/Militant Arabia.

No, I mean it's weird in the sense that they could be Arabia. It would be like having the Ming or Qing instead of China. And China is in the game.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

No, I mean it's weird in the sense that they could be Arabia. It would be like having the Ming or Qing instead of China. And China is in the game.

I would not read too much into it: the list has a number of inconsistencies at the moment, which I suspect, if they are paying attention, will be addressed before Release.

After all, they include 'India' under Ashoka, put China under a non-Dynastic Leader (Kon Fu Tse) and Greece and France under 'iconic people' who technically had no leadership positions in either faction. Harun at least was a political/dynastic leader of the Abassids, and probably has as much Name Recognition as any 'Arab'-derived leader before the modern era.

I suspect it's all very much a work in progress, with a lot of the details still to be ironed out.

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Besides, using Harun as a leader gives them a chance to go for a Science/Knowledge-based Arabian Abbasids, which would be a nice change from the eternal Religion/Militant Arabia.

I haven't played a lot of the older games, and I certainly don't have a playing experience as vast as your own, but we did get a Religion+Science Arabia in Civ 6, and a Religion+Mercantile Arabia in Civ 5. And the Umayyads were a pleasant surprise in Humankind.

I am rather disappointed that Arabian leader representation in most video games just boils down to a choice between Saladin and Harun al-Rashid.

Similarly how India is just represented by Ashoka or the Mughals in most depictions. Age of Empires II's splitting of the Indian faction was also a welcome surprise.

Not expecting much from ARA, but I really hope they (or someone else) go for another Mongolian leader besides Genghis Khan. Someone like Sorghaghtani or Dayan Khan/ Mandukhai.

I also find Beccaria's choice as Italian leader interesting. I would have gone for someone like Leonardo da Vinci or Matilda of Tuscany or Garibaldi myself

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

I also find Beccaria's choice as Italian leader interesting. I would have gone for someone like Leonardo da Vinci or Matilda of Tuscany or Garibaldi myself

Especially since, given the examples of Jeanne d'Arc and Sappho, they are not limiting themselves to actual political leaders - they could have used any of the iconic Italian artists of the Renaissance, for instance, most of whom are far more recognizable to the general gaming public than Beccaria.

And, agreed, a lot of the choices look like warmed-over Civ choices: Tamar, Genghis, Boudacia, etc. Again, given the rather bland leader portraits (at least that I saw some time ago) I am hopeful that some of these are 'place holders' to be swapped for better choices before Release.

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Especially since, given the examples of Jeanne d'Arc and Sappho, they are not limiting themselves to actual political leaders - they could have used any of the iconic Italian artists of the Renaissance, for instance, most of whom are far more recognizable to the general gaming public than Beccaria.

Back when Sappho was the only non-political leader confirmed in the game I made a list of potential non-political leaders for other nations

Sappho as a choice for leading Greece is weird, considering she never held any political power, and it's not as if Greece has a dearth of leader options similar to Nefertiti or George Washington. Even if the developers are going for 'important cultural figures as leaders' (which is fine by me) there are more obvious choices for Greece such as Archimedes, Plato, Homer etc. The cynical part of me (which is admittedly the greater part of me) sees it as a marketing ploy influenced by the ideological trend on the Internet...

But that isn't the point. What's the point is that Sappho's inclusion can become a precedence for similar figures to lead civilizations, something that we might not see in the Civilization series considering how the ideas of 'leader' and 'political figure' are inextricably linked in the series. So we can expect – and should expect – more unconventional leader choices in 'Ara'. I've drawn up a list of possible candidates that probably wouldn't make it into Civ but wouldn't be out of place in Ara:

Ferdowsi - Persia
Leonardo da Vinci - Italy
Voltaire - France
Juana Inés de la Cruz - Mexico
Richard Wagner - Germany
Edgar Allan Poe - America
Rabindranath Tagore - India/Bengal
Fernando Pessoa - Portugal
Rembrandt - Netherlands

 

[Rac]

Alright, with this last Dev Diary video, Argentina got confirmed in, considering other photage Ara it's seems to be launching with 40 factions at least (38 are already confirmed and Celts, if it's them, still kinda uncertain and one fully unknow yet).
However from that trailer that showed an mural with leader faces, there still 6 ones that I didn't manage to identify, probaly they are from the factions whitout leaders showned yet, but who knows, maybe there more then 40 at the vanilla version? Here's a image with everyone that already appeared and who is missing their leader

PS: Not sure if it will be Persia or Achaemenid Empire the name of the Persian faction, and yes there's a faction called the "The Holly Roman Empire" and not Germany, also the Crow people are indeed using their endonym as "Apsàalooke" on the game's UI

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

yes there's a faction called the "The Holly Roman Empire" and not Germany

Germany getting the 'Arabia Abbasids' treatment too

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God that Elizabeth I is so terrible

Isn't the model for Cesare Beccaria the exact duplicate of George Washington's?

Glad to see my girl Amanirenas in the lineup

I would rather have Hatshepsut than Nefertiti, for what it's worth

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Germany getting the 'Arabia Abbasids' treatment too

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God that Elizabeth I is so terrible

Isn't the model for Cesare Beccaria the exact duplicate of George Washington's?

Glad to see my girl Amanirenas in the lineup

I would rather have Hatshepsut than Nefertiti, for what it's worth

As said, the Leader portraits look pretty bland to me, which is why I am hopeful that the Leaders themselves are not yet finalized and can/will be improvced before Release.

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Screengrab from Jumbo Pixel's video on Ara:

What I find interesting is that only the 'House of Wisdom' seems tied to the nation, while the rest of the 'traits' may be linked to the leader. Which implies the same nation could have multiple leaders.

Also no mention of a Faith-like resource. Maybe Religion is not featured in Ara?

And no unique units. Maybe they will be added later?

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

I remember, and I cannot for the life of me remember in what context, seeing a set of still pictures of ARA units - well over 6 months ago, so could be utterly out of date by now, but I remember them because the majority of them were very Generic: Spearman, Swordsman, War Elephant, War Chariot, Mounted Scout, Mounted Archer, Light Bowman, Crossbow, Catapult, etc. The only two I remember that might be more 'unique' were Landsknecht and Knight, but without context I cannot say for sure.

 

[Rac]

Ara will gain news on the Developer_Direct on January 18 together with other games from Xbox

PS: Another new leader shown here, I think... But who is she?

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Ara will gain news on the Developer_Direct on January 18 together with other games from Xbox

View attachment 682209

PS: Another new leader shown here, I think... But who is she?

Wu Zetian? The only other notable Chinese Empress I know of is Cixi

 

[SeelingCat]

We've seen Confucius as a leader for China already, so I think she might be a leader for a different faction (unless this is the first confirmation of multiple leaders per culture).

Could be Mongolia perhaps? Someone like Sorghaghtani or Mandukhai (as I think was suggested earlier in this thread)?

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Someone like Sorghaghtani or Mandukhai (as I think was suggested earlier in this thread)?

Not expecting much from ARA, but I really hope they (or someone else) go for another Mongolian leader besides Genghis Khan. Someone like Sorghaghtani or Dayan Khan/ Mandukhai.

If you're referring to this, I was only expressing my preferences.

And I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure that's a Chinese headdress. In which case, if it does turn out to be Sorghaghtani or Mandukhai, ARA should be taken to task for not going for this Mongolian one: