Are any civs or leaders by themselves weak? Are some too good?

[chazzycat]

Increased specialist limit alone gives them quite significant jumpstart. They are still very strong as specialist and city oriented civ.

I'm very skeptical but will have to give it a try. To focus on specialists, you kinda need towns. And they just lost so much culture from the 2 big nerfs combined, I have doubts. Certainly the Augustus-Majapahit synergy is totally dead.

 

[Navelgazer]

big time. any town heavy strategy with them got absolutely slammed

Oh wow, I found it in the patch thread:

• Majapahit:
  • Subak Tradition changed from "+1 Culture and Production on Marine Terrain" to "+1 Culture and Production on Marine Terrain in Cities."
  • Gamelan Civic changed from "+4 Culture on Quarters" to "+2 Culture on Quarters."
  • Nusantara Civic changed from "Culture Buildings receive a +1 Culture adjacency with Coast" to "Culture Buildings receive a +1 Happiness adjacency with Coast."

That is... that's a lot of nerf. Majapahit has been one of my favorite Explo civs until now. This is rough.

 

[DogeEnricoDandolo]

For my money both on power and fun it's the Friedrichs. Infantry are the weakest unit type. The radius commendation is ok but not revolutionary, and getting great works when you are already winning (conquering cities) is just a "win more" mechanic. I'd say Baroque is slightly better as you can speed rush modern culture even harder by conquering a few cities. But for me they're probably the weakest leaders.

I totally forgot about the 2 Friedrichs, their bonuses sound so bad that I have not even bothered to try them. Investing lots of production to get 1 infantry unit sounds really bad. The worst thing about increased command radius is that the experience radius stays the same.

 

[Leucarum]

Friedrich is a kinda "win more" leader, but I'll just throw out there that if you pair Friedrich with a civ that has a unique infantry unit (particularly with a ranged attack)...well now, that's a lot of fun. Persia -> Ming -> France is a very powerful trajectory with Friedrich.

Persia gets my vote for Friedrich. The CS buff tradition helps him compete with other millitary leaders that do get one...

But still in that case he feels a little bit like the "We have Xerxes at home" option.

 

[pjotroos]

big time. any town heavy strategy with them got absolutely slammed

What I find utterly absurd about the specific change to towns is that they are now disincetivised from settling islands. It's not where you want the cities, and the towns there will be useless. And if you arrived at a change that pushes Majapahit away from the islands, you really need to stop and think. The more I think about it, the more I'm annoyed by that nerf.

 

[Disgustipated]

Speaking of Freddy, does the command radius thing work correctly? I've been putting off playing him until that was fix. Like when you choose the promotion to increase the range, you don't get xp for battles outside of 1 tile. Or am I missing something here?

I never did get a chance to play Majapahit before the nerf. Oh well. I did get a chance to play one Hawai'i game, they aren't easy to unlock.

 

[Leucarum]

Oh well. I did get a chance to play one Hawai'i game, they aren't easy to unlock.

The disconnect of seeing a Dido avatar complaining about not settling enough island cities...

 

[The_goggles_do_nothing]

I was able to combine multiple focused attacks as Friedrich Oblique with multiple commanders. I bet in the hands of someone who knows unit movement well he would be considered one of the best leaders.

 

[Hellenism Salesman]

He seems interesting to me already thanks to the bonuses in the Maneuver tree. You can pack lots of Units at once, give them extra flanking bonuses, and let them ignore terrain!

Plus, starting with Merit greatly increases the strength of Order (+5 Combat Strength to all Units in command radius), which is probably still the first commendation you want to get

 

[Siptah]

I did get a chance to play one Hawai'i game, they aren't easy to unlock.

If you play archipelago, they are very easy to unlock. And, oh boy, does Archipelago feel good after the patch. Sadly, the AI isn't really good in settling the island efficiently.

 

[Giskler]

Interested why you have Ibn Battutta in the bottom tier, his two attribute points mean you can befriend IPs incredibly cheaply in antiquity - not saying he's S tier or anything but wouldn't have him so low.

The map trading thing is useless and the two attribute points aren't really that useful after Antiquity.

 

[Melkus]

The map trading thing is useless

Not if you're a lazy explorer...
Admittedly you have better options, but I like it - you just have to use it early, immediately after meeting someone. It can show trading options you wouldn't know about otherwise. And not everything has to be optimal.

and the two attribute points aren't really that useful after Antiquity

That's why you get more . They allow you to go wherever you want to go on the trees. He could use something more ... tangible ..., but he's allowing for interesting setups.

 

[Melkus]

I suspect that the narrative stuff gets a bit underrated here (it's hard to quantify, I know)?
When I played Hatty Egypt, it felt like I get non-stop bonuses and missions. Ended up with several points in the tree. Other combos are much quieter.

 

[Giskler]

Not if you're a lazy explorer...
Admittedly you have better options, but I like it - you just have to use it early, immediately after meeting someone. It can show trading options you wouldn't know about otherwise. And not everything has to be optimal.


That's why you get more . They allow you to go wherever you want to go on the trees. He could use something more ... tangible ..., but he's allowing for interesting setups.

2 points in Antiquity is powerful, in Exploration and Modern it's inconsequential.

 

[queenpea]

I suspect that the narrative stuff gets a bit underrated here (it's hard to quantify, I know)?
When I played Hatty Egypt, it felt like I get non-stop bonuses and missions. Ended up with several points in the tree. Other combos are much quieter.

Confucius Han to Ming to Qing is also very fleshed out. Even with leader specific graphic interface that you don’t get with other pairings. I figured this was just for the Chinese market.

 

[Leucarum]

2 points in Antiquity is powerful, in Exploration and Modern it's inconsequential.

None of these are powerful in the hands of the AI so he's definitely one of my picks for the weakest AI leader.

He also is I think the most dependant leader on pairing with the right mementos. But those 2 points with good memento choices enable some of the more explosive starts in the game. Despite the rubber banding, a good start still matters a lot for creating a snowball. And there are a lot of potent nodes on the attribute trees, getting more of them and more easily is solid. In the hands of a human Battuta's pretty good. There are definitely caveats though and you have to leverage your start for all its worth...

 

[Melkus]

I like that you can make very specific plans with him - you can reliably get to seven points in the expansionist tree by the first transition.

But I admit he's hard to pin down in terms of power rankings - there's nothing down in these trees that wins games on its own. The +1 sight is another thing that's fun to play with but tough to quantify. (And it's value rises if you ignore mementos.)

 

[Noble Zarkon]

He also is I think the most dependant leader on pairing with the right mementos. But those 2 points with good memento choices enable some of the more explosive starts in the game. Despite the rubber banding, a good start still matters a lot for creating a snowball. And there are a lot of potent nodes on the attribute trees, getting more of them and more easily is solid. In the hands of a human Battuta's pretty good.

I went Shisa Necklace with him (receive 100 influence back when suzeraining a CS), together with going down the diplo tree to the discount - it was costing me a net 75 influence to suzerain them lol, I then used the accumulated influence at the end of Antiquity to incorporate about 4 of them into my Empire I agree no chance the AI does something like that.

 

[Leucarum]

I went Shisa Necklace with him (receive 100 influence back when suzeraining a CS), together with going down the diplo tree to the discount - it was costing me a net 75 influence to suzerain them lol, I then used the accumulated influence at the end of Antiquity to incorporate about 4 of them into my Empire I agree no chance the AI does something like that.

I also like the capital growth from expansion points, i was able to send out settlers so early it was almost like starting as a deity AI on civ6. Definitely one memento to change to something more useful after the first age though!

 

[The_goggles_do_nothing]

Ibn Battutta - Is there a better choice then bonus production to settlers?