Are you kididng me?

[Gogf]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdzeTq6YPg0

This ad is a disgusting attempt to impugn John McCain's character based on the testimony of one nut. It's nothing but a distraction from the issues, and it signals that the lunatic left is becoming increasingly desperate in reaction to McCain's recent rise in national and state polls.

Barack Obama should denounce this ad and demand that it be taken off the air.

 

[Gogf]

And please, nobody reply with "BUT MCCAIN IS RUNNING NEGATIVE ADDS TOO!!!" That's true, but irrelevant. McCain's ads are at least issue-oriented and aren't just some nutcase saying "I attended a number of mosques with Barack Obama where he had close relations with terrorist recruiters." I think condemning this kind of garbage is something we can all agree on.

 

[dwaxe]

All political ads sound like that, John McCain's and Barack Obama's.

Third parties are allowed to run political ads if they want, even if it's 100% negative bull politics.

 

[Cutlass]

There was nothing bad about that. That's just one man's opinion. No fact's were distorted, no lies told. It's not a swiftboat type attack.

 

[El_Machinae]

We have no idea who Brave New PAC is. Obama should condemn it, of course. Early on, he took the high road with the PACs, and so he should follow through.

Would denunciation help, though? Negative spin sticks, and the idea that Obama is behind it will stick too. And there's no way to prove who's behind it. The lunatic left is just as scary as any lunatic group.

And is this anywhere near an officially-endorsed "teaching sex ed to kindergardeners" in despicability? I'm not familiar enough with swiftboating to compare to that endeavour.

 

[Miles Teg]

First off, Phillip Butler isn't 'one nut'. His full attack is far more reasoned, praising his courage, and recognizing him as a ware hero (unlike the swift boating of Kerry last election cycle.) The PAC ran the worst bits, as one would expect of an attack ad. Besides, it's common knowledge that McCain has an incredible temper.

 

[Fifty]

This ad is a disgusting attempt to impugn John McCain's character based on the testimony of one nut. It's nothing but a distraction from the issues, and it signals that the lunatic left is becoming increasingly desperate in reaction to McCain's recent rise in national and state polls.

So the testimony of one nut doesn't have any relevance to what McCain is actually about, but the testimony of one nut is enough to draw meaningful conclusions about "the left"? Your partisan hackery is showing! I agree with you that the ad is silly and that one dude's testimony means nothing. It means nothing with regard to McCain, and it means nothing with regard to the left. It only means something for the specific people who authorized the ad.

Barack Obama should denounce this ad and demand that it be taken off the air.

He's already made it abundantly clear that he respects McCain's service. He should not, however, demand that it be taken off the air, because people ought to be allowed to say whatever the heck they want.

 

[Gogf]

There was nothing bad about that. That's just one man's opinion. No fact's were distorted, no lies told. It's not a swiftboat type attack.

How is this "not a swiftboat type attack"?

How is this remotely relevant to the election?

If I ran an add saying "[Cutlass's Real Name] cannot control himself, he should never be promoted to a job with real responsibility" would you think that's okay? I understand that there is a difference between politicians and private citizens, but this is certainly no better than the swiftboat ads.

 

[Red Door]

Why should Barack Obama denounce this ad and demand that it be taken off the air? It has nothing to do with Obama and shouldn't be attempted to be painted as his ad. In fact, it doesn't mention Obama at all. It even says at the end that it was not authorized by any candidate or any candidates committee. If this group wants to try and paint John McCain as this, it's their right to do so. They pay the money, they can get the ad time. If McCain wants to sue them for libel and slander, he can go ahead and we'll see what happens.

Although, by your logic, George W. Bush should have denounced the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth ad and demand that it be taken off the air, but that never happened either.

The ad doesn't say anything very derogatory either. It starts out by saying that being a P.O.W. does not make a good prerequisite for being president. True or untrue in itself?
And then it mentions McCain's temper, an issue which has presented itself before. Where's the impugning exactly?

Don't try and blame the "lunatic left," blame the people who made this ad and don't make a blanket statement about people. It's a disgusting attempt to impugn the left. On top of that, this ad was made before McCain's rise in the polls. Let's not try to paint this as anything other than a fringe group trying to denounce John McCain. It probably (more likely and most definitely) isn't something credible, but you can't restrict the free press because they're saying things against McCain.

 

[Cutlass]

How is this "not a swiftboat type attack"?

How is this remotely relevant to the election?

If I ran an add saying "[Cutlass's Real Name] cannot control himself, he should never be promoted to a job with real responsibility" would you think that's okay? I understand that there is a difference between politicians and private citizens, but this is certainly no better than the swiftboat ads.

John McCain is wall known an explosive temper. One man thinks it's too much so. Big friggin deal.

It's not a swiftboating, because no lies were told.

 

[Gogf]

So the testimony of one nut doesn't have any relevance to what McCain is actually about, but the testimony of one nut is enough to draw meaningful conclusions about "the left"? Your partisan hackery is showing! I agree with you that the ad is silly and that one dude's testimony means nothing. It means nothing with regard to McCain, and it means nothing with regard to the left. It only means something for the specific people who authorized the ad.

It says nothing about "the left." It says a lot about the "lunatic left," which is what I mentioned in my post. "One nut" did not produce, edit, and fund this ad... an organized political action group that as far as I can tell is on the far left did (check out their youtube profile if you're really in doubt). Now obviously there are far left groups that are reasonable, but I don't think they fall under the auspices of the "lunatic left."

He's already made it abundantly clear that he respects McCain's service. He should not, however, demand that it be taken off the air, because people ought to be allowed to say whatever the heck they want.

It's not about free speech. Sure, they're allowed to say whatever the want. The point is that it's crass, irrelevant to the election, and does nothing but ****** the political process. As such, Obama, should live up to his rhetoric and call for it to stop airing.

If there was a similar ad running against Obama, I'd say the same thing about McCain despite the fact that McCain hasn't made "a new kind of politics" a cornerstone of his campaign.

 

[Miles Teg]

How is this "not a swiftboat type attack"?

How is this remotely relevant to the election?

If I ran an add saying "[Cutlass's Real Name] cannot control himself, he should never be promoted to a job with real responsibility" would you think that's okay? I understand that there is a difference between politicians and private citizens, but this is certainly no better than the swiftboat ads.

There's a difference between stating an opinion, however idiotic that might be, and distorting fact and outright lying to back up that opinion.

 

[Cutlass]

There is nothing "lunatic" about that ad except the response to it

 

[Smidlee]

To be honest I don't want any president's finger be near "the red button".

 

[Gogf]

Why should Barack Obama denounce this ad and demand that it be taken off the air? It has nothing to do with Obama and shouldn't be attempted to be painted as his ad. In fact, it doesn't mention Obama at all. It even says at the end that it was not authorized by any candidate or any candidates committee. If this group wants to try and paint John McCain as this, it's their right to do so. They pay the money, they can get the ad time. If McCain wants to sue them for libel and slander, he can go ahead and we'll see what happens.

...

The ad doesn't say anything very derogatory either. It starts out by saying that being a P.O.W. does not make a good prerequisite for being president. True or untrue in itself?
And then it mentions McCain's temper, an issue which has presented itself before. Where's the impugning exactly?

Don't try and blame the "lunatic left," blame the people who made this ad and don't make a blanket statement about people. It's a disgusting attempt to impugn the left. On top of that, this ad was made before McCain's rise in the polls. Let's not try to paint this as anything other than a fringe group trying to denounce John McCain. It probably (more likely and most definitely) isn't something credible, but you can't restrict the free press because they're saying things against McCain.

Oh please. Read my post again, and don't try to spin this as some sort of free speech issue. Nobody is trying to have the government take this off the air, and nobody is trying to impugn the entire left.

Obama should repudiate this ad. It's very easy to run a campaign based on a "new style of politics" when you have 527s running all your attack ads for you.

Although, by your logic, George W. Bush should have denounced the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth ad and demand that it be taken off the air, but that never happened either.

He should have. Is Obama taking cues from George Bush now?

 

[Masquerouge]

Hey I kinda remember that when SWIFTboats hit the air people said that it was Kerry's fault because he brought attention to his military service.
This time it's different because...?

 

[Gogf]

John McCain is wall known an explosive temper. One man thinks it's too much so. Big friggin deal.

It's not a swiftboating, because no lies were told.

"Swiftboating" is an irrelevant attack on a candidate's character. It's certainly worse if lies are told, but they don't have to be there.

But arguing about definitions is stupid. You and I both know what the ad is. What we call it doesn't really matter.

 

[Fifty]

It says nothing about "the left." It says a lot about the "lunatic left," which is what I mentioned in my post. "One nut" did not produce, edit, and fund this ad... an organized political action group that as far as I can tell is on the far left did (check out their youtube profile if you're really in doubt). Now obviously there are far left groups that are reasonable, but I don't think they fall under the auspices of the "lunatic left."

Oh, so "lunatic left" is a co-referential term with "exactly who created this ad, no one more, and no one less"? That's a nice post-hoc justification for the rampant double standard in your OP!!! If "lunatic left" is really co-referential with "exactly who created this ad, no more, and no less", then it certainly is a deceptive term to use!

It's not about free speech. Sure, they're allowed to say whatever the want. The point is that it's crass, irrelevant to the election, and does nothing but ****** the political process. As such, Obama, should live up to his rhetoric and call for it to stop airing.

If the ad gains enough momentum to be a big deal, then fine, denounce it or whatever. But if candidates were supposed to spend all day denouncing stupid people who are completely unaffiliated with them, then they'd have no more time in the day for anything else! This seems to be an issue where ignoring it would be a much more prudent choice.

 

[Taras Bulba]

frankly... I'm glad someone said it....

all the stories I've heard (McCain's aside) of POWs that came out of Nam all were crazy/scared for life....

don't get me wrong, I'm 100% glad he served the nation (along w/ all other men/women in the armed forces), but I don't think being a POW is a good quality in a President, if you ask me

 

[Trajan12]

I don't really care anymore. I've decided to stop pretending this race will be anything above the usual . .. .. .. . chucking that politics usually is.