Ask a Pacifist

[Kozmos]

Where is RoboPig? He would feel right at home. Anyway here we go:

1.If I killed your family, would you kill me if you could?

2.Why do you follow the self-destructive path of pacifism and tolerance?

3.Why do you wish to take away the only thing(battle and conflict)that makes me trully feel alive?

 

[Pyrite]

3.Why do you wish to take away the only thing(battle and conflict)that makes me trully feel alive?

Really how many battles have you been in?

 

[El_Machinae]

Do you count Metal Gear Solid?

 

[Pyrite]

Only if you count pornography as lovemaking.

 

[Kozmos]

Okay I'm dramatasing a bit, but the adrenaline you get when you fight or run from a street gang is unable to be reproduced in any other way. (god knows I've tried)

 

[Lambert Simnel]

Okay I'm dramatasing a bit, but the adrenaline you get when you fight or run from a street gang is unable to be reproduced in any other way. (god knows I've tried)

Nice bit of macho posturing there.... (what's the chances you're just a geek like everyone else here.... )

 

[Kozmos]

Ugh I despise macho folk, look at me I beat women I'm so cool. I do not fight unless I am provoked. It's that I enjoy fighting. If that means I get called a macho so be it. I'll proceed to kick them
Pacifism is not prevalent where I live,and the pacifistic I know are complete dorks.(no offense Hawkeye)

 

[HawkeyeGS]

I forget who said this but: "Nations think twice before making aggression when there is mutual fear."

Irreconcileable differences don't exist said the hunter to the deer.

Mutual Misunderstanding: this is to be expected. Let me use ethnic groups in this case. No matter how much time one person from one ethnic group (A) spends with another (B), there will still be things that they (A) will never understand, and vice versa.

Don't jump to conclusions & use false info: Info sources are not always correct, and info is always subject to perception and interpretation.

Econ pressure: I've noticed that many times after wars are over, economic prosperity ensues. War brings about a need to become more technologically advanced than your enemy, and eventually this technology filters down to the civilian sector. Nearly all fields get technological advancements during times of war. And the economy responds to the massive government spending like the heart to epinephrine.

For your last statement, you must realize that some people are dead set in their ways. You may offer them the world and they could still tell you to well, do you know what to yourself. I grant you if people weren't so damned determined to keep their ways as they are, there would be less war.

I'm not trying to put a halo over my head, as I will never be a pacifist. Sure peace is great, but I like to mix it up.

A deterant may work 99% of the time but on the hundreth time it results in catastrophe. Mutual misundertsandings are not just there they have to start somewhere and even if they were they do not force a war.

I agree that technology advances due to war but think of how much we could have advanced if we hadn't spent trillions and trillions of dollars and billions of lives on futile wars. We could have done a lot with that.

People are set in their ways and no you may not convince everyone to become a pacifist but you certainly can remove all invasional pretence and see how far they get.

Follow up question - how do you feel about the protection you inherit from your own armed forces and the clear support you would have from the US in the event of any military conflict ?

And a further one - how much do you think living on an island (or single country continent) has made it easier for you to believe in pacifism ?

I must admit we are pretty lucky with our location and such. We have been involved in several wars of 'defence' and I think that has helped build by belief. Call me a traditionalist but I always felt you had the home ground advantage when defending?? We have been attacked by the Japs a few times during WW2 but have been involved in many other conflicts taking us to Turkey, France, Palestine, Korea, Vietnam, Afgan and Iraq. To me calling invasions such as Turkey a defencive messure is absurd and has formed by belief. As for the armed forces - I am glad they are there because given our current foreign policy we need them. If we could adopt a more controlled policy we would need less military and could limit their actions to more important matters.

Don't you ever just want to beat the crap out of someone?

Umm no.

Do you really believe that non-violence would bring down the regimes in North Korea, Zimbabwe, China, Burma, Vietnam, Laos, Iran, Cuba, and Venezuela?

No. Will violence - effectively - is it our business to be bringing down regimes we disagree with?

@Pyrite and Cleric - I am not a self-destructive person. If I was the type of person that could only feel alive when I was provoking a street gang to chase me then perhaps I could be labelled self-destructive but alas.

 

[HawkeyeGS]

I must say this, but that is very a naive thing to say. Imagine had we got rid of Hitler earlier, WW2 would not have been as bad as it was. Pacifism was rife during that period before the war started. There are times where it is better to intervene before a catastophe occurs. There has to be time when a nation has to see that Diplomacy isn't working and that getting rid of the trouble is a better alternative before things get out of hand.

Sorry i missed you in my last big post.
Hitler was hailed a hero by even the most militranistic people and it took them a long time to realise what was really going on.

If you are at the stage where diplomacy is no longer possible then I would argue that firstly you have failed somewhere along the line and that secondly you are about to get slaughtered because if there was any sign of strength in you the 'enemy' would choose diplomacy aswell.

 

[Narz]

If you see ants in your kitchen, do you kill them?

Do you eat meat?

If you could make changes to the judicial and penal systems what changes would you make?

If you could make a movie with a pacifist hero (not based on past events) what would the plot be?

 

[classical_hero]

Sorry i missed you in my last big post.
Hitler was hailed a hero by even the most militranistic people and it took them a long time to realise what was really going on.

If you are at the stage where diplomacy is no longer possible then I would argue that firstly you have failed somewhere along the line and that secondly you are about to get slaughtered because if there was any sign of strength in you the 'enemy' would choose diplomacy aswell.

The problem is that there are some people who are not willing to listen to diplomacy and then what happens after that?

 

[downwithgravity]

Do you drive a car, knowing there's a good chance you may accidentally kill some animal that wanders into the road?

Are you a vegan? If not, why?

Do you really honestly think that pacifism is a viable option for a species as generally barbaric as ours?


I'm a bit of a pacifist myself, but I'm having trouble reconciling some of the seeming hypocrisy inherent in trying to live a completely nonviolent life. Thanks.

 

[amadeus]

is it our business to be bringing down regimes we disagree with?

By that standard, there is no evil so terrible that it requires confrontation. If you had any position of power, there would still be the concentration camps, the gulags, and the killing fields. How could you sleep at night?

 

[HawkeyeGS]

If you see ants in your kitchen, do you kill them?

Do you eat meat?

If you could make changes to the judicial and penal systems what changes would you make?

If you could make a movie with a pacifist hero (not based on past events) what would the plot be?

I don't generally get ants and stuff but I would kill them if there were. I do eat meat. Does that make me a hypocritical? I dunno but I realise there is a difference between that and mass warfare.

I would not change a thing to do with the judicial system (on this level) other than remove capital punishment if it was in my country (it's not but if I were in the US i would remove it). I'll leave the movies up to the hollywood mob. Not my style.

Do you drive a car, knowing there's a good chance you may accidentally kill some animal that wanders into the road?

Are you a vegan? If not, why?

Do you really honestly think that pacifism is a viable option for a species as generally barbaric as ours?

I'm a bit of a pacifist myself, but I'm having trouble reconciling some of the seeming hypocrisy inherent in trying to live a completely nonviolent life. Thanks.

I don't drive a car but will when I am older. See above for eating habits. Considering the barbaric nature of humanity I find it difficult to see that pacifism is not the only viable option. It is after all the only way we can avoid war and the barbaric atrocoties that travel with it.

@rmsharpe
There is a difference between concentration camps and simply governments that the US does not like. If anyone should have the right to police the world as the US is trying to do is the UN. I am not a big UN supporter simply because they are pathetic but I am certainly not a big fan of the US who takes on the role of international cop on the selective basis of fulfilling its agenda. If people like in N. Korea want out of their government then that is up to them. You cannot force democracy or any other ideology on anyone as the war in Iraq has so clearly demonstrated.

 

[Kozmos]

@Pyrite and Cleric - I am not a self-destructive person. If I was the type of person that could only feel alive when I was provoking a street gang to chase me then perhaps I could be labelled self-destructive but alas.

Its genetic. I have seen some whack BBC documentary, they did some tests and apparently there are genes or whtever that determine adrenaline and stuff. IE some people get exicted enough by just looking over the cliff and other must jump to get the feeling.

 

[plarq]

By that standard, there is no evil so terrible that it requires confrontation. If you had any position of power, there would still be the concentration camps, the gulags, and the killing fields. How could you sleep at night?

You mean I should die trying to assassinate our officials?

 

[HawkeyeGS]

Its genetic. I have seen some whack BBC documentary, they did some tests and apparently there are genes or whtever that determine adrenaline and stuff. IE some people get exicted enough by just looking over the cliff and other must jump to get the feeling.

So you are going to go and get in a fight where many people including yourself could get hurt and then blame it all on your genes?

I also would doubt that there are many 'jump off cliff' genes. I think natural selection may have played a part in preventing people with those genes from reproducing.

 

[Kozmos]

So you are going to go and get in a fight where many people including yourself could get hurt and then blame it all on your genes?

I also would doubt that there are many 'jump off cliff' genes. I think natural selection may have played a part in preventing people with those genes from reproducing.

Urgh I said I do not fight unless provoked enough. And the jump off cliff was meant with a bungee or paraglider or something.

 

[amadeus]

You mean I should die trying to assassinate our officials?

I'm saying you should stand up for your rights instead of being a passive doormat.

 

[HawkeyeGS]

I'm saying you should stand up for your rights instead of being a passive doormat.

Read the first post. non-violence != passive.