cubsfan6506
Got u
An adult reaction. Pretty much everybody else is (possibly was) having fun. Couldn't you of at least sticken it out for the sake of others. (Crosspost.)
-
We created a new subforum for the Civ7 reviews, please check them here!
Babes resignation
- Thread starter Whomp
- Start date
- Status
sirdanilot
BBcode owns in sigs!
If this is because they were losing, yes team Babe you're acting like spoiled children. But I don't think that's the real reason.
You're also acting like spoiled children if you don't think the game is 'fun' anymore.
It can't be lack of participation, can it? You have many active members, more than some other teams...let the white dove sing...
If it's because one member not having enough time, even if it's your turnplayer you can simply switch turnplayers.
So the only option left in my head is that not even one team Babe member has enough time for this, which is in fact ridiculously unlikely, but if it'd be true then it could be the only worthwile reason to resign from the game.
Or of course the other option, that this is a joke, but then it would be such a bad and non-funny joke that I wouldn't even call it a joke.
I'd like team babe to state the real reason why they want to resign from the game. If it's anything ingame, then it would involve that you don't think it's fun or that you are going to lose or are invaded or something, which is already unlikely, but even if it'd be true you would be acting like spoiled children.
So the only real reasons should be those that don't involve revealing ingame secrets, but rather things that happened in RL. Please enlighten us with the reason you want to resign from the game!
You're also acting like spoiled children if you don't think the game is 'fun' anymore.
It can't be lack of participation, can it? You have many active members, more than some other teams...let the white dove sing...
If it's because one member not having enough time, even if it's your turnplayer you can simply switch turnplayers.
So the only option left in my head is that not even one team Babe member has enough time for this, which is in fact ridiculously unlikely, but if it'd be true then it could be the only worthwile reason to resign from the game.
Or of course the other option, that this is a joke, but then it would be such a bad and non-funny joke that I wouldn't even call it a joke.
I'd like team babe to state the real reason why they want to resign from the game. If it's anything ingame, then it would involve that you don't think it's fun or that you are going to lose or are invaded or something, which is already unlikely, but even if it'd be true you would be acting like spoiled children.
So the only real reasons should be those that don't involve revealing ingame secrets, but rather things that happened in RL. Please enlighten us with the reason you want to resign from the game!
MTDG 90210! (or maybe you guys are too young to get the reference)
After being hinted to what the real reason for this is, I can only strongly restate my initial reaction. You are nothing but childish and spoilsports. This is a great game for all the rest of us, and you are ruining it.
After being hinted to what the real reason for this is, I can only strongly restate my initial reaction. You are nothing but childish and spoilsports. This is a great game for all the rest of us, and you are ruining it.
Incredible. This is no single player game that you just don't submit because you were getting bored. 
This is a multi player game, you do have some responsibility for the game and the other players and to take part in such a game is a commitment.![[pissed]](/images/smilies/pissed.gif "Pissed [pissed]")
This is a multi player game, you do have some responsibility for the game and the other players and to take part in such a game is a commitment.
A comment from Ginger Ale why he too believe the game is broken might help the situation and get people to understand we are not trying to "ruin the fun" for everyone...
I guess the responisbility should extend to every aspect of the game not only to force players to stay in a sinking ship just because they happened to sign on. Sometimes it is better to cut your losses and move on, this is such a time. Sitting around until marines hitting return is not something anyone could percieve as fun unless you have a very mediocre life...
I guess the responisbility should extend to every aspect of the game not only to force players to stay in a sinking ship just because they happened to sign on. Sometimes it is better to cut your losses and move on, this is such a time. Sitting around until marines hitting return is not something anyone could percieve as fun unless you have a very mediocre life...
Okay, to give some context, I will post the situation, let people judge for themselves, and perhaps discuss if there is a way to amend the rules to avoid BABE's retirement. I'll try not to be too specific.
An archipelago game usually means you own your entire island that others must reach by sea. Unless an opponent owns a city/tiles on your island, they must use some form of naval transport to drop units off. By taking a unit and placing it on a tile on your island where it meets the sea, you prevent the enemy from landing units there. If you place units, (even old, obsolete ones like warriors), on every tile, you effectively create a situation that will not be solved until Marines; no units can land on your island. It is a small investment with long-term benefits for whoever builds this "fortress" - they no longer need to defend their cities, produce units, or worry until late Industrial Age, and can proceed to just build improvements and infrastructure, safe from any type of unwanted military action.
Simply, BABE felt like this created an unfair situation and was not worth essentially "waiting" until Amphibious Warfare while all the teams stayed "turtled up" on their home islands.
An archipelago game usually means you own your entire island that others must reach by sea. Unless an opponent owns a city/tiles on your island, they must use some form of naval transport to drop units off. By taking a unit and placing it on a tile on your island where it meets the sea, you prevent the enemy from landing units there. If you place units, (even old, obsolete ones like warriors), on every tile, you effectively create a situation that will not be solved until Marines; no units can land on your island. It is a small investment with long-term benefits for whoever builds this "fortress" - they no longer need to defend their cities, produce units, or worry until late Industrial Age, and can proceed to just build improvements and infrastructure, safe from any type of unwanted military action.
Simply, BABE felt like this created an unfair situation and was not worth essentially "waiting" until Amphibious Warfare while all the teams stayed "turtled up" on their home islands.
I've read the comment from Ginger Ale, and honestly I'm quite baffled that a mod would say such a thing. This is not a broken situation - it could be seen coming from miles away, and it's a definite part of the game. If it was us, we would have done the same thing as SABER and not think twice about it. Exploit? No way. Force a way to land? Hell no. This is a very real strategic part of the game, and I can't sympathize with the Babes one bit. There would have been plenty of ways for them to avoid this situation, and if they couldn't expect this to happen then that's their fault.
EDIT: Crosspost with GA. I didn't refer to the comment in the previous post, I refer to the one that Wotan PMed me. About the above, blocking every single tile of your shoreline is a huge investment - in unit building, and unit upkeep not the least. If you manage to pull that off, then being safe until marines is the return on your investment, but you will be behind in many other areas. I don't see how that's a problem at all. This is no exploit with no cost attached - quite the opposite.
I don't understand what you just said. What other aspects of the game are you refering to that responsibility should extend to? Sinking ship? Only in your imagination. And by "cutting your losses", which are very much your losses, you are imposing plenty more losses on everyone else.
If sitting around until marines hitting return is the only way you can see to play this game, then you are a much more mediocre player than I thought.Sitting around until marines hitting return is not something anyone could percieve as fun unless you have a very mediocre life...
Flaming is really not called for, I made a "wink" comment in general about content in life and got this reply. This is so getting so out of proportions now I fear I regret ever joining the MTDG. The derogatives flying form all and sundry about our betrayal is not something I find amusing in a community supposed to attact people interested in spending their precious free time playing a game we all enjoy.
I have no objection to the way SABER built their defenses, we too talked about closing off part of our coastline to channel any attackers to where we wanted them to land but never considered turtling up as it is not really in the spirit of the game (as we percieve it and no intention to make any judgement on other teams values in this, so please don't flame me about it now.). But had I known beforehand that the game would have this probable outcome I would have stayed clear of it. We are currently looking at a possible date for any offensive action on land sometime around this time next year at the current progress of the game. With that in mind and no ancient, medieval or early industrial land action the game is just not possible to enjoy for a warmonger like myself.
I'm sorry, which comment exactly was this?
Just so you know, in team forums when I post I tend to be posting more as "individual Ginger_Ale whose comments do not reflect my official duties" rather than "administrator Ginger_Ale". If you are referring to where I said "disappointed", that was my own personal thought about the situation, but that doesn't mean I'm going to stop BABE from leaving nor the other teams' wishes to play the game as is.
gmaharriet
Ancient Crone
And therein lies the crux of the dilemna. Every team has this option and, if each team uses it, nothing can happen until marines. We aren't looking for sympathy, but we don't want to just waste our time until technology makes "turtling" a non-factor.
donsig
Low level intermediary
There are other ways to win besides attacking, aren't there?
This is quite funny. I totally understand BABE's point of view. They played poorly and now want out. TNT did the same thing last game (played poorly) and when I said I was through with the game I got blasted. At least the TNTers played on. The really funny part is that some of the ones who want to quit now where the same ones that blasted me when I wanted to do it.
RFHolloway
Analyst in the UK
I do see where you are coming from. Having a big army that will be obsolete by the time you get to use it (probably even if you upgrade it) must put a serious damper on things. I am surprised that you didn't see it coming, given the calibre of your players, but perhaps not soon enough to make a switch to plan B worthwhile. I'm sure that you understand other people's frustrations, and tried to rescue this as best as you could.
Thinking outside the box - If they modded the game to give privateers lethal bombard on land units - that could make things interesting. (but I don't even know if that could be done!)
Thinking outside the box - If they modded the game to give privateers lethal bombard on land units - that could make things interesting. (but I don't even know if that could be done!)
Can't you win by spaceship or culture? I asked my team to win by spaceship before we even saw the start save. Of course, I'm no "star" player like Wotan.
This reminds me very much of his attitude in the SGOTM 11, one of his team made a really bad go of their turns and he quit. And please, I'm just restating the fact wotan, I don't have a tenth of the awards you've won, so I know you play to win, unfortunately you don't want to risk losing by keeping up with a game where winning isn't assured. Either stick with the AI or play with kindergarteners. And again, I apologize if my comments here insulted you or anyone on Babe or any mod or any other player.
My last comment is rather silly but: Since Chamnix is the one that foiled your easy victory plans, he should get to inherit your land and units.
I appologize. My comment was phrased in a way that was flame-ish in nature, and I understand that you were upset by it. My only defense is that I am really upset and disappointed at this whole situation, and sometimes say things that I later regret. As I now do. I know you are not a mediocre player, which makes this situation even harder to accept.
Flaming aside, what I was trying to say was that I think you have too narrow a perspective. Why would sitting around until marines be the only way to play the game? We are not planning to invade anyone even after marines come, but that doesn't mean that we just sit around pressing enter.
Ginger_Ale in a PM sent to me from Wotan said:
Maybe you should have made this clear when you posted it then. It's very hard to keep your moderatorship out of any issues that regard game play, and the above comment sounds very much like you are planning to make an official ruling. How is that not the "administrator Ginger_Ale" speaking?
If every team uses this, it would mean a huge toll on the resources for every team, which means that the team that doesn't use it (which would be you in this hypothetical case) would have a large edge since you could divert your resources to other things. That said, it's rather unbelievable that every team would do such a thing, specifically for the huge drains on economy that comes with it. The thing is that you have very much put yourselves in this situation. SABER has felt as if they would be your target for the past I dunno, 50 turns? They have turtled up, which has taken them quite a lot of time and effort, because they knew you were coming! It's not as if it's a surprise attack. And it's not like it won't cost them to do so, they are falling behind by quite a bit. You still have plenty of options (just don't take this as an invitation to attack us
).
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
Or let everyone build Berserks.
Game Mod
To be clear, BABE is not asking for a game mod. It was an idea mentioned by RFHolloway, as quoted above. It is a good idea but it needs further discussion.
I don't like the idea of modding the game to suit one team's preferred playing style. We all jumped into this blindly, taking our chances with a customized map. Do we now also mod the game to make space ship parts cheaper, lower the cost on the UN and increase the cultural points per turn of temples and libraries?
Uh, er, I don't think so. I have to give you a 
Marsden, I know I am competitive. And probably a bit undiplomatic at times. But it is not really Wotan against the world here, the overwhelming majority on BABE voted to drop the game I think 3 players could think about continuing but with certain conditions for a later revaluation. I guess this is another issue with Civ3 and why it is percieved as the weakest installment of the Civ franchise. To many things are not really good in Civ3, but I can still enjoy it though I tend to percieve Civ4 as a better game. I am however still learning in Civ4 so have nowhere near the skills of the best players there.I think I underestimated the time aspect of a MTDG, if warmongering it could be played in a year or so but if you start thinking of going to Space I guess an end date is basically set somewhere at the end of this decade. I appologise to everyone I might have offended by putting my own value on time so much higher than many of you think I should, but just building infrastructure and researching until Modern times or just prior to it seems such a waste of what I could possibly do with my time, like really getting down to learn Civ4.
I hope I did not force the rest of BABe into voting to retire, if so I apologise for this too. They did not know what they did and hopefully the rest of the community can bring them back on the straight and narrow now. and once again, SABER did nothing wrong but maybe having iven some mods to a few units would have been a good idea. Like amphib to Archers and Longbowmen and Lethal Bombard to Privateers as suggested by others previously. They say hindsight is 20/20 and this sure is a situation where this rings very true. ANd it should have been done prior to starting the game not in midgame.Disclaimer: Everything in this post is written with a bit of flippant flair and I hope it can be read with this in mind.
@Niklas: I too have a tendecy to speak before I have connected the brain at times, many edited posts come to mind.
No offense taken just wanted to try to calm down the discussion.
Thanks for that post. I'm sorry I singled you out, but you are the turn player and I think it's safe to assume a dominant player on the team, not just along for the ride IOW. I also regret if you felt attacked, as that was not my intention. I also post without thinking it through at times.
Except for the last bit about SABER inheriting BABE lands and territories, I'm serious about that 
Actually, on fourth thought I can actually sympathise and see how this could be terribly disappointing to you. Having a well defined and undoubtedly well tuned plan of action and then not being able to implement it is frustrating. However, I strongly urge you or any of the rest of BABE to continue. You certainly don't have to be worried about being attacked yourselves if everyone else is just trying to survive your potential assault.
Except for the last bit about SABER inheriting BABE lands and territories, I'm serious about that Actually, on fourth thought I can actually sympathise and see how this could be terribly disappointing to you. Having a well defined and undoubtedly well tuned plan of action and then not being able to implement it is frustrating. However, I strongly urge you or any of the rest of BABE to continue. You certainly don't have to be worried about being attacked yourselves if everyone else is just trying to survive your potential assault.
RFHolloway
Analyst in the UK
Just to be clear - I was looking for a change that was relatively small, would open up the strategy again (i.e. make some conflict profitable before Marines) but was in the future, so that people had time to react to the new strategy aspects. But again not a request, but trying to explore options.
I oppose any mods done to the game at this point. What CB says rings very true - we all signed up blindly, and the situation is the same for everyone.
It seems clear that Wotan is a lost cause. I think his actions are egoistic and narrow-minded, and I'm quite disappointed, but there seems no point in trying to persuade him to continue. But I very much hope that there will be others on the BABE team who will step out from the shadow of Wotan and continue to spread their Babely goodness to the rest of the world.
Please, Babes, don't give this up. Please, pretty please!
It seems clear that Wotan is a lost cause. I think his actions are egoistic and narrow-minded, and I'm quite disappointed, but there seems no point in trying to persuade him to continue. But I very much hope that there will be others on the BABE team who will step out from the shadow of Wotan and continue to spread their Babely goodness to the rest of the world.
Please, Babes, don't give this up. Please, pretty please!
- Status
Similar threads
