Beer For My Horses

[Takhisis]

You are not deterring anyone else from crime.

 

[JollyRoger]

The deterrence is not of other people, it is the deterrence of the one being executed. I guarantee you that after they are executed, there is no chance they will escape and commit another capital crime while on the loose, or while still in prison. Can you guarantee that it is absolutely impossible for them to escape?

So specific deterrence rather than general deterrence? Why wait for someone to commit a first capital crime? Be proactive about the deterrence.

 

[Takhisis]

We should have a precrime division, then.

 

[classical_hero]

100% deterrence? Then why do other people keep killing, raping, stealing, etc. etc.?

In practice these people get a double conviction, first a few decades' imprisonment and then a horrific execution, so scientific that Siemens would have adopted the methods in '41…

Why bother sending anyone to prison if jail was meant to be a deterrent?

 

[Takhisis]

Why execute people if the death penalty was supposed to be a deterrent?

 

[gay_Aleks]

If you kill 'em, you deter them form making further crimes.

 

[Takhisis]

Are Jolly and I the only ones on this thread who have read about deterrence theories?

 

[gay_Aleks]

Beyond the time when the USA and the Soviet Union pointed a whole bunch of nukes at each other, I'd guess not.

 

[Takhisis]

The D in 'MAD' didn't stand for 'deterrence'.

 

[bhavv]

Heres some better ideas than the death penalty:

Murderers get their arms broken so they cant kill again.
Rapists get their balls removed.

At least we aren't killing them!

 

[Takhisis]

People can't kill without their arms? I assume you've never heard of Deidara then.

 

[gay_Aleks]

Then we take out scammer's tongues, and we rip the roots of vineyards, 8th century style!

I like it.

 

[Takhisis]

Well, if we replaced wine with raki, I'm all for it. But i've never tried raki made from molasses or figs, so let's keep the vineyards.

 

[MobBoss]

Are Jolly and I the only ones on this thread who have read about deterrence theories?

I've read a bit on it...and found its one of those areas where you're going to find studies both pro and con on the issue with a lot of nuance that affects the numbers in ways one wouldn't expect.

For example, many studies cite New Jersey as a state with the death penalty that shows no deterrence what so ever, but in New Jerseys case, although the death penalty existed for many, many years, it was never ever used, thus not capable of any possible deterrence. You actually have to use it for it to have any deterrence value (if any at all).

The numbers are also going to vary more than a bit from state to state due to cultural differences.

Bottom line, its an area where you can find data to back up your stance on it, be it pro or con. Hard to find anything truly definitive. My gut feeling on it would be that it does provide a deterrence, but only minimally (and no where near as high as that generally stated by pro-death penalty fanatics).

 

[Borachio]

Well, that's my prejudices shot down, and no mistake. I'd have thought you'd have been very much pro-death penalty, Mr Boss.

 

[Darkflight]

What do you think a criminal who finds himself about to be arrested and be sentenced to capital punishment is more likely to do about the situation?

 

[MobBoss]

Well, that's my prejudices shot down, and no mistake. I'd have thought you'd have been very much pro-death penalty, Mr Boss.

Well, I am, but I'm not going to grouse about it if a state doesn't want capital punishment as part of its system.

And the reason I am pro-death penalty is that I've seen first hand more vile and evil things than most people see their entire lives.

 

[Takhisis]

I've read a bit on it...and found its one of those areas where you're going to find studies both pro and con on the issue with a lot of nuance that affects the numbers in ways one wouldn't expect.(…)

So, that makes three of us.

 

[bhsup]

Tak, are you actually arguing that I am wrong? Do you actually think there is less than a 100% chance that the executed have been deterred from ever committing another crime after their execution?

 

[Old Hippy]

Tak, are you actually arguing that I am wrong? Do you actually think there is less than a 100% chance that the executed have been deterred from ever committing another crime after their execution?

well in a lot of cases they will commit the same number of capital crimes that they committed before they were executed... none... so it could well be argued that it was not a deterrent in any way