Best Expansive Leader

[IdiotsOpposite]

I wanted to be with the majority, so I voted for Pacal, because I thought he was the financial one, and I knew that everyone would automatically go for financial.

Turned out I was wrong. Mehmed must be the financial one, because he's in the lead.

And I find that just sad. Are you all that addicted to financial that you need to have it, like heroin or something? Try a non-financial leader sometime. Even Saladin is good if you play him right.

 

[plasmacannon]

I wanted to be with the majority, so I voted for Pacal, because I thought he was the financial one, and I knew that everyone would automatically go for financial.

Turned out I was wrong. Mehmed must be the financial one, because he's in the lead.

And I find that just sad. Are you all that addicted to financial that you need to have it, like heroin or something? Try a non-financial leader sometime. Even Saladin is good if you play him right.

Mehmed is EXP/ORG, Not, FIN.
He can build workers, Granaries, Lighhouses, Courthouses, Harbors, and Factories for fewer hammers than normal.
He starts with +2 Health, and halves Civic costs.
His UB grants +2 happiness, which meshes well with his EXP trait, and his UU is a musketman (so, he ignores walls) with +25% bonuses vs Melee, Archer, and Mounted units, great for mopping up Longbows, Macemen and Knights.

That's why I voted for him.

 

[rugbyLEAGUEfan]

Im` keen to hear from the 3 people who voted for Mao ? please explain

 

[IdiotsOpposite]

Mehmed is EXP/ORG, Not, FIN.
He can build workers, Granaries, Lighhouses, Courthouses, Harbors, and Factories for fewer hammers than normal.
He starts with +2 Health, and halves Civic costs.
His UB grants +2 happiness, which meshes well with his EXP trait, and his UU is a musketman (so, he ignores walls) with +25% bonuses vs Melee, Archer, and Mounted units, great for mopping up Longbows, Macemen and Knights.

That's why I voted for him.

Yes, he is the leader I would have picked if I didn't think "just pick the financial one anyway, that's what everyone else is going for".

I noticed that in all of the other polls I had read, the financial leader was in the lead by a wide margin (except for the Financial poll). So I assumed that Pacal (who I assume IS the fin leader, then?) would be the same here.

 

[Spectrite]

Turned out I was wrong. Mehmed must be the financial one, because he's in the lead.

Even if Mehmed were Financial (which he isn't), I don't see how you can draw the conclusion that he is Financial just because he is in the lead, and then say it's sad that he is in the lead just because he's Financial.

And I find that just sad. Are you all that addicted to financial that you need to have it, like heroin or something? Try a non-financial leader sometime.

The poll is about which leader you think is the best, not which leader you play the most. Just because someone thinks Financial leaders are the best doesn't mean he always plays them.

Even Saladin is good if you play him right.

Obviously. The question is whether he is as good as another leader, played with the same level of skill.

I noticed that in all of the other polls I had read, the financial leader was in the lead by a wide margin (except for the Financial poll).

But not only because of FIN. Often because of other factors.

For example, in the IND poll, Huayna Capac won by a landslide, not just because he is FIN, but also because of his very good UU and UB. In fact, he is regarded as one of the best leaders overall.

And there were quite a few in which FIN didn't win.

So I assumed that Pacal (who I assume IS the fin leader, then?) would be the same here.

A fair assumption, but then why do you accuse people of being "addicted" to FIN in a poll where the FIN leader isn't even winning?

 

[Jerrymander]

And I find that just sad. Are you all that addicted to financial that you need to have it, like heroin or something? Try a non-financial leader sometime. Even Saladin is good if you play him right.

This is a bad post. Nice try to be edgy.

I voted Shaka. I don't play Expansive leaders much.

 

[IdiotsOpposite]

Even if Mehmed were Financial (which he isn't), I don't see how you can draw the conclusion that he is Financial just because he is in the lead, and then say it's sad that he is in the lead just because he's Financial.


The poll is about which leader you think is the best, not which leader you play the most. Just because someone thinks Financial leaders are the best doesn't mean he always plays them.


Obviously. The question is whether he is as good as another leader, played with the same level of skill.


But not only because of FIN. Often because of other factors.

For example, in the IND poll, Huayna Capac won by a landslide, not just because he is FIN, but also because of his very good UU and UB. In fact, he is regarded as one of the best leaders overall.

And there were quite a few in which FIN didn't win.


A fair assumption, but then why do you accuse people of being "addicted" to FIN in a poll where the FIN leader isn't even winning?

Because in all previous polls I had seen, FIN was winning. Note that I had seen about half of the polls at the time. Now, as I visited the rest of them, it turns out that a total of 2/3 of the winners were FIN. Most of the others were ORG, and that seems to be the case here.

This is a bad post. Nice try to be edgy.

I voted Shaka. I don't play Expansive leaders much.

Edgy? How do you get that conclusion? I'm the least edgy person I know. I've gone out of my way before NOT to be edgy. I really don't see how you draw that conclusion.

 

[Iranon]

I'm not sure FIN is still regarded as the unquestioned top trait, quite a few people seem to prefer ORG these days.
I did the maths behind it some time ago and found them very close in power, with ORG being a better match for most of my preferred playstyles.

 

[The Almighty dF]

I'm not sure FIN is still regarded as the unquestioned top trait, quite a few people seem to prefer ORG these days.
I did the maths behind it some time ago and found them very close in power, with ORG being a better match for most of my preferred playstyles.

Depends on difficulty too. Org on noble and under is pretty much just useful for the free buildings. As difficulty increases, so do civic costs.

 

[azzaman333]

I seem to have really good games with Bismark, so I voted him.

 

[Jerrymander]

Edgy? How do you get that conclusion? I'm the least edgy person I know. I've gone out of my way before NOT to be edgy. I really don't see how you draw that conclusion.

It kinda goes like this: you read something somewhere (or came to the conclusion independently) that Financial is possibly the best trait. You want to pick a non-Financial leader (no problem there, I agree with you). Then, you badmouth the current winner of the poll, assuming him to be Financial (Mehmed's not), coupling this with slandering of Financial, claiming it to be akin to heroin. It makes your post look edgy.

I spoke poorly of people's voting habits in a topic I created myself, but I didn't do it like an asshat.

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

I voted for Shaka. His unique unit, the impi, can capture weakly defended cities via his free combat I and mobility promotions. His unique building, the ikhanda which provides -20% city maintenance, is immediately available half priced via his aggressive trait. His starting technology of hunting allows production of the impi with bronze working and copper.

I also considered choosing Pacal II for holkans and ball courts, Mehmed II for janissarries and hammams, Isabella for conquistadors and citadels. Joao II was considered for his imperialistic trait and carracks. However, Shaka beat them all in the final analysis.

Sun Tzu Wu

 

[Fippy]

Okay..hmm..should i..guess so!
Newbie award of this and all past years for this poll result, ridiculous :b

 

[Gumbolt]

Mehmed is a great choice. Expansive allows cheap workers. Plus org allows cheap expansion. Wheel and agriculture too??? So fast cottages/granaries as pottery is reachable from T1. With the right start Mehmed can steam roll a map. One of my easiest immortal wins was with him. My first worker was 10 turns and 1-2 corn. Cheap granaries too.

Of course he is not too shabby on chariot rushes on the right start. Great UB too.

 

[Izuul]

Good, but not fantastic leaders here despite EXP being a pretty strong trait. I think it's the lack of a really powerful UU in this group. Conqs are good, but regular Cuirs are good enough on their own so they aren't game breaking. Cho-ko-nus are fun as are Impis and Holkans are nice, reliable barb defense.

Still, there's no WC, Immortal, Praet, etc in this group.

 

[LincolnOfRome]

I voted Mehmed. The UB is great. The UU is very dominating to all other units with an early gunpowder.

 

[Gumbolt]

Okay..hmm..should i..guess so!
Newbie award of this and all past years for this poll result, ridiculous :b

I am guessing Fippy is voting for Isabella. Spiritual is one of the best traits in the game.

 

[Macksideshow]

I voted Pacal because I like the synergy between EXP and the ball court and the holken is very useful early against barbs. Also, I am newbie who thinks FIN is a really strong trait lol, one might say I am addicted to it I'll be honest, I do automatically pick the FIN leader in these polls.

But this thread has made a really strong case for Mehmed who I have never really noticed as being a strong leader so I will give him another go. Jannisary breakout?

I really like these threads, they've taught me a lot of things I hadn't considered.

 

[cseanny]

Sury is my 1st choice (maybe not really 1st but he's my personal favorite in this bunch), followed by Mehmed, Pacal, Shaka, and Peter. 90% of all my games Immortal and below are effectively over before or at Rifling so Leaders with UU/UB that come late are pretty worthless to me. Besides, I don't often find myself building/whipping grocers, banks, factories, or any such late items. Game way way over before that point.

 

[enKage]

I used to beat each higher diff level (1 of 3 first wins) with Joao. His settler and workers abilities are soooo powerful! Together with effective warring (imperialistic generals).Even though his uniques are weak, situational or simply useless, trait combination is amazing. I would vote for him, but last weeks I played more with a leader I omitted before - Pacal. He is simply fabulous! Nice 2nd trait + extremely good early uniques, especially for higher difficulties! Pacal rules!

3rd leader worth to mention is Sury. Traits give direct benefits to 2 essential early buildings. UB is so so, but UU is very nice and is extremely powerful in defensive wars.


Mehmed? His UU is nice, but I definitely am not used to war with early gunpowder units... He is out of my top3