Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
That's it, go with the guy who couldn't even get his own Senate to give him supply. He may have been the most left-wing Australian leader, and accomplished the most, but the guy made numerous errors in judgement.
Best World Leader.
- Thread starter TheDominatorDom
- Start date
And Camikaze's false impressions get shattered before his eyes.
I suppose that's true. The NSW Board of Studies probably glorifies him a little. But, it wasn't exactly his Senate, and I'm really having to restrain myself to not mention his sacking. It was just so wro...oh damn, I have no self-control.
Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
His sacking was actually the best thing for the country, but not for the commonly known reasons. Did you know that Whitlam had ordered the closing down of every US base in Australia, and had declared that he would publicly reveal the names of every CIA agent currently active in Australia (that he knew about)? Such as action would have shattered our relations with the US, which is something we could never afford to do. We don't have to be their lackey, but nor do we have to be antagonistic. Funnily enough, there is more than a little evidence that the CIA helped instigate his downfall, but the evidence is limited.And Camikaze's false impressions get shattered before his eyes.
I suppose that's true. The NSW Board of Studies probably glorifies him a little. But, it wasn't exactly his Senate, and I'm really having to restrain myself to not mention his sacking. It was just so wro...oh damn, I have no self-control.
He was a fantastic PM who believed his own ideology to the extent that he made stupid mistakes, costing him the opportunity to actually develop that ideology. That makes him somewhat admirable, but not a great leader. He was also despised by most of our allies. Japan hated that "Communist" Whitlam, for example, and even China thought he was too "Russian" for them. And this was one of only a select handful of our PMs with foreign affairs experience. If anyone should have known better, it was him.
You want glorification, what suburb of Sydney do you think houses the Gough Whitlam library? I'll give you one guess, it's all you'll need. How honestly do you think his legacy gets treated where I'm at?
Sorry, but I can't agree that the best thing for Australia was to instal a Liberal government. Not that I'm partial. I didn't actually know that he was going to do that either. Could you please direct me to a source? And I assume you're referring to the Whitlam Institute in Parramatta.
But I admire him for things such as Medicare, the complete abolition of the White Australia Policy, ending conscription, and giving more funding to the arts.
Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
The best thing for Australia wasn't to install a Liberal government, and that's not what I said. The best thing for Australia is never a Liberal government. The best thing was to remove Whitlam. Putting another member of the Labor party in charge would have been best, or simply giving Whitlam a swift boot up the arse, per Australian custom, to make him see sense.Sorry, but I can't agree that the best thing for Australia was to instal a Liberal government. Not that I'm partial. I didn't actually know that he was going to do that either. Could you please direct me to a source? And I assume you're referring to the Whitlam Institute in Parramatta.
But I admire him for things such as Medicare, the complete abolition of the White Australia Policy, ending conscription, and giving more funding to the arts.
And how did you not successfully guess the location of the library? I all-but said it was where I lived. Penrith, specifically Werrington.
I too admire him for those things, though White Australia was gonna go regardless of who won that election.
Sorry, I haven't heard of this library. I just assumed you were talking about the one I had heard of. I also apologise for suggesting that you thought a Liberal government was the best thing for Australia. No-one in their right mind could think that, and I'm pretty sure you're in your right mind.
Who would've taken his place? Cairns was disgraced. Crean perhaps?
Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
Probably Crean. I'd have to have a read through Wiki to remind myself exactly who was in a position to take over at the time.
As did I. But from what I know, Whitlam was more of a one-man government than any other leader in Australian history, so replacing him would've been hard.
Ayo now that Cheezy is doing it do I get to use old school-y names too? 
Yes, Phil II of the Maks got all of the mad skillz assigned to the name Phil for the next 2300 years. Phil Augustus, Phil II of Spain, Phil V of Macedon, and even Phil II of the Seleucids (hahaha philoromaeus) generally either sucked or were mediocre. Then they got Punxsutawny Phil and it's been gravy from then on.
Yes, Phil II of the Maks got all of the mad skillz assigned to the name Phil for the next 2300 years. Phil Augustus, Phil II of Spain, Phil V of Macedon, and even Phil II of the Seleucids (hahaha philoromaeus) generally either sucked or were mediocre. Then they got Punxsutawny Phil and it's been gravy from then on.
Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
Damn, it's contagious. Dachs, you are a plague.
Is Groundhog Day celebrated in Macedonia?
Is Groundhog Day celebrated in Macedonia?
It will be when I take back our patrimony.
Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
Will every day be exactly the same as the one preceding it? You know, like the movie, and Russia?It will be when I take back our patrimony.
I'm a god. I'm not the God...I don't think.
Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
It was talk like that that got Alexandros - dear God, now I'm doing it - damn near murdered. And may I have Wrestlemania tickets? And, for that matter, Andie MacDowell?
It's Andie, so no you can't.
On-topic, I have recently come to believe that Carl XI was quite awesome. Thoughts?
Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
What are you talking about, look at my post, I totally didn't make that typo.It's Andie, so no you can't.
On-topic, I have recently come to believe that Carl XI was quite awesome. Thoughts?
Carl XI of where? Spain? Wouldn't it be Carlos?
Spain didn't have that many Carloses. I was thinking Sweden. You know, the dude who preceded that dude who went all the hell way off into the Ukraine for God knows why reason.
Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
Ah, I didn't think Spain had that many. Don't know much about XI. XII was an awesome historical figure, but more along The Man Who Would Be King rise and fall lines than a talented leader. He went to the Ukraine because he got whooped and had to flee, if my mind doesn't deceive me.
It doesn't. He also did some other cool stuff like intriguing against the Sultan of the Ottoman Empire as a captive, an epic journey across Europe with a single servant (the horror!), winning a truly awesome victory outnumbered more than 3 to 1 against the Russians at Narva, and utterly smashing the armies of Poland-Lithuania and Denmark-Norway in an impressive war-opening blitzkrieg. Conclusion: erratic.
But Carl XI set the foundation for that in many ways. He closed the Scanian War with several face-saving and material victories that allowed Sweden to escape with all the lands it had lost under the previous monarch, then ably established a precursor to the Gustavian absolutism, rectified corruption, put Sweden on a strong fiscal standing, encouraged cool arts and literature, and strengthened Swedish diplomatic ties. Cool dude, I like him.
Sharwood
Rich, doctor nephew
If I remember correctly Carl XII ended up losing most of those gains, though it wasn't entirely his fault, as he was at war with pretty much everyone at the time. Still, he didn't do bad for a guy who was 16 when he became king (I think).
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