[Beta-test] v.45 beta 4

[Achille44]

playing USA
difficulty: Deity
not alternate history
defensive lines on
scripted events on

Game until 1942

Spoiler :

november 10, 1939: Poland has fallen
february 20, 1940: German, English and French fleets are in front of each other, without fighting, except 2 ships...
march 10, 1940: in Finland, Finnish sent everything to fight, and russians sent only 3 divisions...
april 1, 1940: BF109F researched
april 10, 1940: Operation Weserubung launched. The Luftwaffe doesn't seem to take an advantage on both allied air forces
may 1, 1940: Renault R-40 researched.
may 10, 1940: Fall Gelb launched, Germans already occupy 2/3 of belgian territory
june 1, 1940: hurricane mkII researched, Belgium and Netherlanbds invaded, German approaching Dunkerque.
july 1, 1940: English are sending 5 divisions to help Norway, 3/4 invaded. Spitfire mk V researched. Fleets finally fighting
july 10, 1940: frontlines stabilized in France (aproximately peace borders). Brussel is constantly liberated and then retaken.
july 20, 1940: Panzer IV G researched. no allied air forces in South of France
august 1, 1940: 2 French tanks doing some sightseeing near Tripoli, but 7 Italian divisions are coming from Italy
august 20, 1940: 6 English camping units in Norway, and Germans are approaching Oslo with paratroopers.
september 1, 1940: 4 Italian divisions attack in Egypt, where 2 English and 1 French divisions are defending.
september 10, 1940: sightseeing is finished near Tripoli -> a French infantry came to attack.
september 20, 1940: English in Norway finally saw the German paratroopers and decided to fight them.
october 1, 1940: allies are getting overwhelmed in Egypt, but French are still attacking Tripoli.
october 10, 1940: French are getting surrounded near Tripoli
november 1, 1940: M13/40 researched
november 10, 1940: Oslo taken, 6 English divisions surrounded in Norway.
november 20, 1940: English divisions in Norway disappeared
december 20, 1940: French offensive in Libya annihilated by 6 or 7 Italian divisions, now moving to Egypt. Sidi Barrani taken, only 1 English divisions remains against 12
february 1, 1941: for the first time, a French heavy tank fought ! 20 Italian divisions in Libya!
february 20, 1941: 6 English units disembarking in Egypt
may 1, 1941: SM.84 researched
may 20, 1941: just saw that Germans don't have tank units on the front anymore ! only 6 tank units remaining in East and in Denmark (Copenhagen still not taken)
june 1, 1941: Tirana taken by Greeks
june 20, 1941: new wave of English reinforcement coming to Egypt, where Alamein is just taken. French troops doing some sightseeing near Alger
septeber 1, 1941: italians start an offensive in Tunisia, where some french are defending. Zagreb is taken
october 1, 1941: Sofia taken by Greeks. German paratroopers from Norway came to help Finnish
october 10, 1941: thanks to English reinforcements, frontlines in Egypt are stabilized near Alamein
october 20, 1941: no German planes deployed on the OstFront, and they have less and less fighters in the West, and the allies too, but stil have more planes than Germans. Italians transfered all their planes to Libya
November 20, 1941: Bucarest taken by Greeks
December 10, 1941: M14/41 researched. Krakow taken by russians
december 20, 1941: English are pushing back Italians in Egypt, liberating Alamein


COMMENTS:

French keep their best heavy tank units to protect cities in south of France ??
with the armistice between finland and USSR, a russian unit got cut off reinforcement because it was surrounded before the end of the war...
submarine war ended too fast (destroyer too powerful / too fast ?)
Germans keep many units near Vienna, Krakow and Warsaw (only land units), before 1941
there are some problems appearing with the fact there are less cities: English divisions sent to help in Norway are cut off reinforcement because Oslo is the only city near, and it's surrounded...
didn't see any upgrade to new version for any unit (spitfire, BF109, R-40...)
didn't see any bomber being built, and the existing one were apparently all destroyed (except for Italians) in january 20, 1941 (certainly before). Apparently, some fighters were built only at the beginning, and then no planes were built to replace the loss

 

[Gedemon]

Thanks for the detailled report.

Can you check the materiel/oil reserve of all nations (in the diplolist using the icon at the top right) ?

I've added some check to prevent construction of units using resources that the AI doesn't have left.

I think I need to scale the resources bonus for AI with the level, but we first need to tweak the number of units on the map.

Which means finding what difficulty level give the better "feeling" on a all AI game.

We do not need to find a fine balance, as it will be partially broken in the reloaded version.

I also want to add ASAP the code to allow AI to move then range attack with an unit in the same turn (there are already mods which does that IIRC ?)

 

[ZeroZeroSix]

no seelowe in both tests ?

No seelowe yet. And alternate was off.

 

[Achille44]

Can you check the materiel/oil reserve of all nations (in the diplolist using the icon at the top right) ?

Here is the list (see the screenshot)

 

[Gedemon]

Here is the list (see the screenshot)

Thanks, should be enough for upgrades and new tanks/aircraft for Germany, I'll check that

 

[ZeroZeroSix]

Observer mode diety level
Alternate history off
defence line off
script on

10 dec 1939 Poland fall
1 may 1940 Denmark fall
10 may 1940 operation weserünbung
20 may 1940 Brussel taken
20 june 1940 Amsterdam taken
1 marsh 1940 France fall
10 marsh 1941 operation seelowe

 

[Treys1]

Besides taking out the small Soviet Cities, is there anything else you changed for them?

 

[Gedemon]

Besides taking out the small Soviet Cities, is there anything else you changed for them?

added a few manufactories to compensate the loss of production.

tweaked the "motherland call" operation flavors and cost so it's called more often.

 

[Treys1]

Aye, some initial observations as the Soviet Union. (At turn 33 currently)

-Turn 33, Hitler Has done operation Fall Gelb, France is near collapse. Avoided Denmark, and hasn't done operation Weserubung. Poland fell rather quickly, as did Finland (I ignore Poland and just try to knock out Finland, I'm such a scamp)

Everyone's stocks and personnel are doing fine, except the USSR. I don't know if it was intentional, as I know the USSR was not economically (in some sense) powerful for the War, but I am currently taking a -120 Gold Per turn, compared to the next highest which is Greece, at 53 Gold Per turn. This negative is after I built banks in nearly every city as well. It's says the tile maintenance is the large consumer. I don't know how this Gold Loss will affect the later game.

(Turn 55 now, -214 per turn compared to Britain who is nearly finished being conquered, they have 2 gold a turn. It seems like the AI works very efficiently against the UK now.

Also, it seems field guns are entirely absent from my buildable options.)

 

[kogre]

So, after letting the game run all night and all day while i was at work, only 2 crash's, and that was when i woke up this morning and touched the mouse the game immediately crashed; was able to load from the auto save. The same when i came home from work. So there is a huge improvement in stability.

american observer mode
deity level
no alternative history
scripted events turned on
defensive lines both on

seems the Maginot line still > Germany
when i got home from work it was turn 302, when i did the save game that turned out to be... 1962 or there abouts

Germany had only been able to take and then loose Paris. Germany had been able to stall out the Russians on the eastern front right about the German/Poland inital border.

Germany still had Norway.

Italy still had all of Italy but nothing in Africa.

Greece was all the way to Vienna.

I will set up another all night run again with the same paramaters except turn off the defensive lines, and do just a normal playthrough as Germany.

 

[ZeroZeroSix]

Couldnt help it so I started a game as Soviet! The gold is bad but it can be dealt with, anyway the supply limit is quickly reached so you have to produce gold or the research will be slowed. The thing is you cant afford to let the German break in and take city. Maybe supply should be something that can be produced by cities like material, personal and gold!

 

[Treys1]

See your gold is much better, you must be gold producing everywhere xD. I have -280 now. The war just begun, Hitler failed operation Seelowe. I feel the tile improvement just needs to be slightly less expensive, just so the Soviets don't begin in a near impossible deficit. (Which is ahistorical, the Soviet Economy was doing decent selling everyone's food xD)

Zero, are field guns missing from yours as well?
And aye, the Soviet Supply gets hit very quickly. I love playing as the Soviets though xD


From my observations, Germany is definitely better than they used to be at defeating France. (I've played the old version around 10 times, never had France Fallen before 1941. In this, they fell in July of 1940)

 

[ZeroZeroSix]

See your gold is much better, you must be gold producing everywhere xD. I have -280 now. The war just begun, Hitler failed operation Seelowe. I feel the tile improvement just needs to be slightly less expensive, just so the Soviets don't begin in a near impossible deficit. (Which is ahistorical, the Soviet Economy was doing decent selling everyone's food xD)

Zero, are field guns missing from yours as well?
And aye, the Soviet Supply gets hit very quickly. I love playing as the Soviets though xD


From my observations, Germany is definitely better than they used to be at defeating France. (I've played the old version around 10 times, never had France Fallen before 1941. In this, they fell in July of 1940)

- Not everywhere the 6 best cities produce units and do research.

- Aye, seelowe is hard for the AI, anyway Germany never have the technology and resources to do an amphibious invasion! Seelowe was only on paper and remained there because the eastern front was opening.

- Maybe there could be some road in the north area of Russia that can be deleted since there is no cities anymore

- No field guns for me eighter, I didnt check the LUA yet to see if its normal.

- In the previous version the Soviet where very strong at start, I think they needed to be nerfed a bit.

- On the overall, its not exactly historical mod but that is hard near impossible to acheive. It is still a very good mod.

 

[Gedemon]

Zero, are field guns missing from yours as well?

Oups, forgot to add it in the units defines !

RedDefinesUnits.lua

add

RU_AT_GUN				= GameInfo.Units.UNIT_FIELD_GUN_ZIS3.ID

after

ARTILLERY				= GameInfo.Units.UNIT_ARTILLERY.ID
RU_ARTILLERY			= GameInfo.Units.UNIT_ARTILLERY_ML20.ID
AT_GUN					= GameInfo.Units.UNIT_FIELD_GUN.ID
AA_GUN					= GameInfo.Units.UNIT_ANTI_AIRCRAFT_GUN.ID

and change

RU_ARTILLERY, AA_GUN, AT_GUN},

to

RU_ARTILLERY, AA_GUN, RU_AT_GUN},

- Aye, seelowe is hard for the AI, anyway Germany never have the technology and resources to do an amphibious invasion! Seelowe was only on paper and remained there because the eastern front was opening.

U.K. was conquered in half of my test games, and I was afraid that it was too much, good to know it doesn't success every time.

- Maybe there could be some road in the north area of Russia that can be deleted since there is no cities anymore

But there will be resources that will need to be linked to cities.


And thanks for the feedback guys !

 

[Treys1]

- Not everywhere the 6 best cities produce units and do research.

- Aye, seelowe is hard for the AI, anyway Germany never have the technology and resources to do an amphibious invasion! Seelowe was only on paper and remained there because the eastern front was opening.

- Maybe there could be some road in the north area of Russia that can be deleted since there is no cities anymore

- No field guns for me eighter, I didnt check the LUA yet to see if its normal.

- In the previous version the Soviet where very strong at start, I think they needed to be nerfed a bit.

- On the overall, its not exactly historical mod but that is hard near impossible to acheive. It is still a very good mod.

Aye, I am aware of the historical implications and how difficult it was to carry over. The Soviets did begin strong in the former, but I do not know if this coupled with improvements to the other nations will lead to a proper outcome. Oh well, it may make things a little more entertaining. -320 Gold per turn now, bank in every city, maxed out supply. War with Germany begins now!

Seelowe failed (as it should really, I was worried they would get mowed over so easily. xD) For some reason Hitler is ignoring Oslo after taking Narvik. Denmark fell though, and the Fall of France event hit without issue.

Also is Vilnius still weird? In the older version you could take it before the Polish surrendered and keep it despite allying the Baltics, while if you didn't they get the City. I unfortunately didn't take it in time and it went to the Baltics. xD

As for the cost of tiles, maybe just removal of some random urban areas or so, it just seems really odd for every other nation to begin with 50+ and the USSR to start at -18. Unless this is what you want I just fear unit maintenance and further maintenances will push me to the -500 limit that has units begin disbanding.

 

[Gedemon]

Yes it's intended to have to build your economy before your army when playing USSR.

But maybe we can add back one or two cities to start with a positive value at least...

 

[ZeroZeroSix]

I started a British game and the Soviet situation is not so bad. Brit have less ground units at start and only 6 supply before being oversized. Considering I need to build at least 5 Spitfires and some ground force just to defend Britain from the oncoming Seelowe I dont know what I will do to defend Afrika! Maybe uncle Sam will give a little help?

 

[Jenyariy]

Gedemon, what will the v 45 update include? Will it only include balance changes as it does now or there will also be some optimization? Or even new world map?

 

[ZeroZeroSix]

I am still testing British and Finland took Leningrad in the first part of the war and its now with 70 defence. I will continue to see how the Russian will deal with that.

 

[Treys1]

Yes it's intended to have to build your economy before your army when playing USSR.

But maybe we can add back one or two cities to start with a positive value at least...

Yes understandable, but it is now it is impossible to build up the economy to anything positive, unless you don't build any cost buildings. I wouldn't mind taking a negative if it wasn't turning into such a large number so quickly.

Zero, aye, I feel the Soviets are fine Militarily and even supply, oil, and personnel. That gold just seems so low, and it worries me It'll start disbanding units once I take over parts of Germany.