Better Unique Power

[say1988]

Arabs I would put near the top. Get Spiral Minaret, Sankore, and, if possible, AP in your state religion, and you can go on a rampage 4 beakers, gold and hammers for any conquered city right after it is out of resistance not to mention the culture and happiness, so you get right into useful buildings. Yes it takes a lot of hammers to get this going, and requires a militaristic style, but it is quite powerful.
Germany's I can't comment on, as I never played much modern (as my computer slowed down a lot of Warlords, even), but I have to assume it would be very powerful (Leonardo's workshop anyone?), but like its UU and UB it comes late.
Russia just doesn't suit me, I play offensively (offensively enough that it is usually my downfall).
Else, I pretty much agree.

 

[Verily]

Arabs I would put near the top. Get Spiral Minaret, Sankore, and, if possible, AP in your state religion, and you can go on a rampage 4 beakers, gold and hammers for any conquered city right after it is out of resistance not to mention the culture and happiness, so you get right into useful buildings. Yes it takes a lot of hammers to get this going, and requires a militaristic style, but it is quite powerful.
Germany's I can't comment on, as I never played much modern (as my computer slowed down a lot of Warlords, even), but I have to assume it would be very powerful (Leonardo's workshop anyone?), but like its UU and UB it comes late.
Russia just doesn't suit me, I play offensively (offensively enough that it is usually my downfall).
Else, I pretty much agree.

Even better for the Arabs is to ignore the UHV, convert to Christianity ASAP and get four free shields in every conquered city from the AP. It makes trading a lot easier, too.

 

[blizzrd]

Oh yes and I never really understood the Vikings UP, in medieval Europe there usually is very little worth pillaging and its weakness in production means that the European powers (especially Russia and Germany) will quickly out-produce it. I would like The Power of Piracy: Viking ships able to take treasures (gold) when they have sunk an enemy ship.

I played Vikings yesterday and used their UP quite a bit. I collapsed Germany and then pillaged around 500 gold from the various improvements they had built. Ditto England.

I would say the rest are so-so: America, Egypt, Mali, Japan, China, Khmer, Netherlands, the rest.

France's UP is very nice. The only time I've ever had Arabia open borders with me was one time when I was playing France.

 

[onedreamer]

I played Vikings yesterday and used their UP quite a bit. I collapsed Germany and then pillaged around 500 gold from the various improvements they had built. Ditto England.

Before England and Germany develop so much improvements and before you collapse and pillage everything the timeline for 5000 gold will most likely be over anyways (actually I'd like to read some real strategies on how to win with Vikings). Also it is too random, once I pillaged 2 mines in a turn: 5 gold the first, 45 gold the second........ I do think the UP is good, but it doesn't help much with the UHV goal. Also I don't like the goal at all. It should be something connected to plundering and pillaging, but accumulating wealth doesn't necessarily mean this.

 

[blizzrd]

Before England and Germany develop so much improvements and before you collapse and pillage everything the timeline for 5000 gold will most likely be over anyways (actually I'd like to read some real strategies on how to win with Vikings).

I disagree, I had lots of time getting to the gold requirement in mid-1400s.

As a general Viking strategy I adopt the following:

1) Make Inverness your capital (i.e. don't found any other cities until you capture Inverness). When England spawns, you won't lose your capital. In the 600AD start, you get your workers before you found any cities. In the 3000BC start, you will lose your workers with this strategy. I choose the 600AD start normally for this reason.

2) Adopt Slavery, not Serfdom. Slavery is vital for Kalmar to produce anything worthwhile at any stage before Universal Suffrage. The Strategy guide in the wiki favours Serfdom which I consider to be a poor choice.

3) Initially found Lulea, Kalmar and Sundsvall (after making Inverness your capital). Later on also found Oslo, but don't worry about Bergen. You don't really need the Whale that much. Found Dubh Linn (raze any cities built by England/Independents which cannot get all three coastal food resources within their fat cross).

4) Research Civil Service first (Berserkers and Bureaucracy). Then put your research on 10% while heading for Astronomy (Compass before Guilds). Trade techs wherever possible, even if you get a poor deal, especially where it will allow you to open borders agreements.

5) Build Berserkers like they are going out of fashion, preferably with 2x promotions via Vassalage and Barracks. Then start pillaging and razing cities. A spearman escort when entering Germany is advisable. Attaching a Great General to a Berserker will allow for rapid pillaging if you choose the +1extra movement promotion.

Also it is too random, once I pillaged 2 mines in a turn: 5 gold the first, 45 gold the second

The UP is 5x the base value, so this is not unexpected. But I was averaging around 25-30 gold per improvement pillaged (taking mines/pastures/farms/cottages into account).

I do think the UP is good, but it doesn't help much with the UHV goal.

Not so. You can use the money to buy some of the techs that you are lacking enroute to Privateers. What else were you planning on doing with that money anyway?

Also I don't like the goal at all. It should be something connected to plundering and pillaging, but accumulating wealth doesn't necessarily mean this.

Other than pillaging, I suppose it could include razing a couple of cities (looting), or capturing a bunch of workers (raping). This might be nice, but I'm generally happy with the Viking UHV conditions. They are attainable, sufficiently challenging and sufficiently historically accurate for my tastes.

 

[onedreamer]

I do pretty much everything you said (except my capital is Kalmar and I adopt Caste System), but I don't get anywhere close to 5.000 gold. I'll try the "just pillage" tactic although I faced big problems vs siege engines and cavalry when I tried...
You said you collected most gold in the 1400s, this is exactly what I meant, the Vikings pillaged around Europe way before, but before you don't have sufficient military power and the units are already obsolete as you start.

 

[3Miro]

When I played Viking UHV, I used slavery and vassalage. Get Civil Services and razed Inverness. The whip Berserkers and conqer England when they spawn. Eventually they respawned, but I was only turns away from victory so it made no difference.

The key to the 5000 gold in my game was couple of great merchants which I got without caste system (whip markets). After CS I slowed research to get more cash and went for Optics and Astronomy. Afterwards go for Chemistry, get a lot of Pirates to sink those ships.

I have some memory of using Berserkers to capture Rome and then I razed and pillaged some Byzantine cities. Also pillage some work boats. In that respect the UP was useful.

 

[blizzrd]

You said you collected most gold in the 1400s, this is exactly what I meant, the Vikings pillaged around Europe way before, but before you don't have sufficient military power and the units are already obsolete as you start.

What I meant was that I finished achieving got the UHV condition in the 1400s, not that I went from 0 to 5000 gold in the 1400s. I started collecting gold way earlier, right after acquiring Civil Service.

 

[onedreamer]

After CS I slowed research to get more cash and went for Optics and Astronomy. Afterwards go for Chemistry, get a lot of Pirates to sink those ships.

Question: how do you beat France to the New World if you slow research ? I normally have trouble being on par with France if I research at 60%-70%. If less they will beat me to the New World.

edit: ok this is way OT, sorry.

 

[s09119]

I think America's UP could use an overhaul. Maybe make it something more like this:

The Power of Innovation

All American cities recieve a 100% production and research boost starting in the Industrial Age.

That probably needs tweaking, but you know what I mean. The "American Dream" one is a UP of necessity so US cities get population fast, but it's not terribly useful. That could be fixed by making American cities grow faster or have an artificial, invisible food modifier until they reach a certain point.

 

[say1988]

The US had great land. It doesn't need production/research boosts.
Their UP is one of the best ideas. People moving from unhappy and unhealthy cities to America. Sure it isn't the most powerful, and has some problems (such as when the population goes to a city causing starvation), but they can't have everything.

 

[Úmarth]

+100% production would make them monstrously overpowered.

 

[s09119]

+100% production would make them monstrously overpowered.

I know that, hence the "tweaking" thing. On the other hand, though, America has an incredible ability to produce things at insane rates when the country faces danger... so it may not be all that unrealistic.

 

[chococid]

I know that, hence the "tweaking" thing. On the other hand, though, America has an incredible ability to produce things at insane rates when the country faces danger... so it may not be all that unrealistic.

The WWII mod that ships with BTS has a nifty thing that simulates this, the various industrial techs give huge boosts to production and happiness in cities, but none are as good as what Fascism (which Germany, Italy, etc start out with). Perhaps Police State should improve production of everything, not just units? Or at least, have some sort of "military building" category for stable, barracks, drydocks, West Point, the Pentagon, etc..

 

[Úmarth]

I know that, hence the "tweaking" thing. On the other hand, though, America has an incredible ability to produce things at insane rates when the country faces danger... so it may not be all that unrealistic.

Yeah but like say1988 said that's already well-reflected by the number of brilliant production cities available to them. And after all, what's the source of this 'incredible ability'? It's not some mystical feature of the American people its just a consequence of a populous, highly industrialised society with abundant natural resources.

 

[The Q-Meister]

Yeah but like say1988 said that's already well-reflected by the number of brilliant production cities available to them. And after all, what's the source of this 'incredible ability'? It's not some mystical feature of the American people its just a consequence of a populous, highly industrialised society with abundant natural resources.

I agree completely; I'm open to suggestions for an alternative American UP but 100% production for a civ that may already be the best production civ in the game would unbalance it.

 

[onedreamer]

it is by far already the best productive civ. Denver is monstruous.

I'd rather work on its current UP so that immigrants would go to the city with the highest difference between produced and consumed food, with priority on smaller cities in case of parity.

 

[Kao'chai]

chinese up isn't strong enough!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[3Miro]

Question: how do you beat France to the New World if you slow research ? I normally have trouble being on par with France if I research at 60%-70%. If less they will beat me to the New World.

edit: ok this is way OT, sorry.

May be out of topic and sorry for not reading the question earlier. The way I do it is I chop most of the woods in Scandinavia and build cottages there. Then with all the extra food, I rum MANY specialists. When I conquer England I can run 6 - 7 specialists in London. All of that adds up. France also tends to go for cultural techs (Aesthetics and others), I go straight for Astronomy (after Civic Services).

 

[Dabur]

Hi ,


just one idea , why not have two UU for each civ , ... ? one early and one later game UU , ....


a lot depends on what your settings are , if you can give two or three promotions to a UU like the cho ko nu can make the chinese UU beat up the mongolians when they come , ....

for example as second uu , japan could have zero fighters , ....

france could get the FFL , French Foreign Legion as a second UU , ....


Have a nice day