Blocking the AI?

L

Larwin

Prince
Joined
Apr 1, 2011
Messages
326
Location
Oregon, USA
How do people normally block the Ai from building towards them? Every game I play the AI builds towards me first. Am I supposed to build my second and maybe 3rd cities right next to the Ai even if its 10 tiles away or more? A lot of the time I am only able to get 5 or 6 cities and the Ai has 7 8 or 9 cities. And they are usually to far away for an early rush.
 
there is nothing wrong with only having your 5 or 6 cities, as long as you have decent production you can easily gear up for an axe+cata push. With 12 axemen and 8 catapults you can take 5+ cities from a neighbor. Not sure how well that would work on higher difficulties, but up to emperor it works fine. The time and resources you don't spend on settlers and workers and building the basic buildings in those few cities you wish you had, can now goes towards military so you can take some cities someone generously built for you ;)
 
about military. I was going to tech towards literature while I wait for the great engineer to build pyramids. do you think i should change my focus and tech towards construction first or go ahead with the great libray plan. I have most my trees prechopped to build great library already. Right now I have oracle in my capitol and generating a great engineer in my second city. I have 5 cities with maybe one possible worthless spot to build a 6th city. If I'm lucky I can squeeze in 2 more cities but they wont be very good. The pyramids I plan on building in my second city. I have tundra on my coastal boarder wish doesn't help much. I just recently claimed copper dont have IW yet. but a few my cities might be great for production. I think once I get literture might trade for construction if the AI is gullible enough to let me have it. with these wonders under my belt would it be better to go construction route and get a few swords and catapults build or try to get at least macemen. was thinking about using a technique to beeline to rifling but might be better to take cities sooner? It's 875 BC in this game.
 
Sometimes when a reasonably close neighbor that doesn't quite qualify for a real early rush, i.e protective and they build their cap on a hill, I'll build a city on the angle just outside their cap. This is quite helpful when you get some cats because you can take their cap quickly when you decide it's time and you've already got some culture on their squares. The may surround this city with more cities but they too will be close to your culture and allow you to take them all out before they can whip too many extra defenders.
 
Larwin said:
How do people normally block the Ai from building towards them? Every game I play the AI builds towards me first. Am I supposed to build my second and maybe 3rd cities right next to the Ai even if its 10 tiles away or more? A lot of the time I am only able to get 5 or 6 cities and the Ai has 7 8 or 9 cities. And they are usually to far away for an early rush.
Click to expand...


I like blocking AIs out of my future territory. That ensures that I get to 8-9 cities around Lib. Of course, you need some good circumstances for a block:

1, Being creative!
[ 1a, or having stonehenge (not advised) or a religion (comes late, depends on luck) ]
2, Narrow path: The path the AI has to settle through is narrow and will be under your culture with just 1 border pop (1 city block)
3, Strong Capital, strong 2nd city: If you intend a multiple city block you need a very strong start and a very strong 2nd city to assist your capital immediately. Optimally, this 2nd city is part of your blockade ring.
So, wet river corn 2x + plains cow + river side green hill makes a very strong settler pump. Ideal 2nd city should be something with good food + jewelry or good food + metal.
4, Not going broke: At some point you will need some commerce. Ideally, either your 2nd city or your capital has jewelry or cottage potential. That way you can fund your expansions. Financial helps a lot in this case. Organized is also pretty good.
5, You have a good early unit and won't die to barbs doing that: Chechua! Or any resource unit, really. Chariot prefered.
6, Against aggros: I want a front hill city for those. Placed in a way that in case they go for war they go for that city for sure.
7, Against wonder squieshies: no aggressive blocks into cities that might be popping the oracle in 5 turns. Keep that in mind or you get screwed, even with creative.

If the block is solid, you are going to have a lot of time to backfill your land. You can't expand as quickly as the AI anyways, so you need the time. Around Lib, instead of having your usual 6-7 cities you have some more. Then you can use those to conquer one neighbour or the world.
 
The problem I been having is the game starts me in a corner with 2 AI about 10 tiles or so in different directions. I had a map with 4 AI so I can get more land and they built towards me first. I'm going to try playing this game out. and when I get catapults take on the AI thats already at war with the others. When I get a new map I try looking at ways to block better. I'll try going with a creative leader too. I guess any part of the city can block a strip of land. I tend to generate maps that don't get these thin strips and I used the right settings.

I have another question. When doing a specialist economy all cities with food in their cross. There's a guide that says switch the research slider to 0 after teching alphabet. Wouldn't I want to tech philosophy and switch to pacifism before i did this? or is having representation (from pyramids), caste system, and bureaucracy enough to get you through the rest of the game?

Is having cities 3 tiles apart better than using game recommended locations?
 
Larwin said:
The problem I been having is the game starts me in a corner with 2 AI about 10 tiles or so in different directions.
Click to expand...

You know what it means when an AI starts 10 tiles from you, right? You get a second capital. See my most recent game (Ride the Rhino) for a great rush map.

On specialists: You don't need to set the slider to 0, but you can freely expand until it is 0 at breakeven. The point is, more cities = more specialists, so it doesn't matter if it drops your %.
 
Blocking AI from taking your land is a must on higher levels. Also to claim a resource. The biggest problem is that a good blocking points just happen to fall about 7-9 tiles from the capital and on higher levels it cost the most. On a Wong Kong BOTM on immortal level, I had to settle a city nearly 9-10 tiles from the capital and cost me 6 gpt. But in the process, I blocked Augustus from migrating my way and ended up with enough room to expand to about 9 good cities and got ivory and gold. It was costly at first but since I had writing by then, I knew I will manage it.

In a lower level you can just not worry as long as you have strat resources like elephants, copper and horse (or iron later) and several cities that can build you an Army. Then go to war. Now if you do not want to go to war, then by all means go out and claim the land you want (not what game recommend you) to block the AI. The maintanance wont be as bad; about 2-3 gpt at about 7-8 tiles from the capital.

Larwin said:
I have another question. When doing a specialist economy all cities with food in their cross. There's a guide that says switch the research slider to 0 after teching alphabet. Wouldn't I want to tech philosophy and switch to pacifism before i did this? or is having representation (from pyramids), caste system, and bureaucracy enough to get you through the rest of the game?
Using a guide per its words won't do you any good if the game you are playing is telling you some thing else. Switching off science at Alpha would require that you have enough cities to run specialists and when you get Alpha. is it before or after CoL? If you do not have CoL, you are limited to 2 scientists per city and perhaps some priests. Without Rep that would mean each city provide 6 science running 2 specialist and 12 science with Rep. Lets say you have 5 cities that can do this. So 30 or 60 bpt. Is that enough for you to get to the VC you want? Only you can determine that. BTW, use your first GS to bulb Philo if you need it and know math and CoL and other prerequisites. Else AI will trade Philo similar to Alpha.
Is having cities 3 tiles apart better than using game recommended locations?
Click to expand...
This is map and resource dependant. There is nothing wrong with cities closely placed as long as they can grow and support a city to its happy limit at the very least. More Cities does not automatically make the empire a better empire.
 
It's always nice if you have room to expand but in my games I typically have the same problem and cannot. So on Immortal/Deity I've mostly been doing variations of a 3-5 city Cat/Anything war with great success. It doesn't matter if you expand peacefully or by war........so long as you do it. 4 city Construction wars are very powerful and can usually allow you to conquer 4-10 cities before your Renaissance war push which is more than enough on any level.

So don't fret with a few cities...just use the whip/chops/build units to get more! ;)
 
One question on blocking. In order to keep the land to yourself you need to close borders. This seriously limits trade income which impairs teching. That in turn makes it take longer to reach a financial situation where you can afford to settle all the cities you want in the blocked land. Sometimes blocking large tracts of land has seemingly worked against me. I do try and produce a bunch of settlers and have them waiting at ther city locations I want so that I can open borders as soon as possible and settle the cities when I see the AI's fully loaded moving vans approaching but that doesn't always work. Either it takes too long to produce all the settlers or I am forced to found a bunch of cities at one time thus crashing the economy.

Is it possible to block off too much land?
 
Being too ambitious while settling and trying to block too much land is definately possible, did it in Replay #3 (Sig) when I settled some Jungle cities far away just because I thought my homeland was safe.

If you have Settlers waiting though, you need to improve your economy, try GLH, Failgold and Currency.
 
AI sends Settlers through my Borders from 2000 BC earliest but at 1500 BC the latest. Always. But that is the point, where land becomes rare.
 
Yer. The pope doesn't patronize child molesters :rolleyes: .
 
Sometimes you can utilize a choke to prevent the AI from expanding. Early on even warriors can do it, but works well with a couple of axes or chariots if you can get those running.

In a recent game I had Ragnar as a close neighbor sitting on some seriously good land, but he founded his second city on a hill and his capital was an archer-producing powerhouse already up to 40% culture defense. I only had chariots and no close metal, so rather than rush him outright I built half a dozen chariots just as he founded a third city on flatland... took the city (his archer garrison had no promo) stole two of his workers, and picked off any archers he dared walk between his cities. I also completely pillaged his countryside and denied him access to the horses he had in his borders. I cramped him into two cities while I expanded normally and eventually hooked up bronze, then sent axes. Rags stupidly sent out a settler+two archer escort right as my axes walked up and I took his capital with minimal loss. At that point it was really game over for poor Rags... just one coastal city on a hill with little food and nowhere to go, and I had some great riverside land to settle at my leisure.
 
Abegweit said:
Y'know, I did not expect posts like this from you. I thought you were a better man than that. Sorry to find out that I was wrong. :(
Click to expand...

You are really breaking my heart and make me cry. Please, what can I do that you still think that I'm a good man? I'm dependent on your opinion, you mean the world to me, say, what can I do to linder your pain that you feel because I so badly disappointed you? :cry:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

T
How do you deal with no iron copper or horses nearby?
Replies
8
Views
1K
sampsa
sampsa
ShimonSays
AI Cottage spam?
Replies
4
Views
777
Gumbolt
Gumbolt
T
Apostiolic Palace with AI religion or your own?
Replies
9
Views
700
lymond
lymond
B
Vassal Questions
Replies
1
Views
383
antimony
A
AcaMetis
Nobles' Club 352: Joao II of Portugal
2
Replies
29
Views
2K
JSS
J
Top Bottom