blue circle

[Manfred Belheim]

Fog definitely affects it. I've been moving a Settler early in the game towards a blue circle, which will suddenly move elsewhere as the fog gets pushed back.

 

[Junuxx]

Junuxx - would you build a cottage on a wheatfield, or a windmill on an iron resource ? Would you really ? Do you by any chance automate your workers without telling them to leave existing improvements ?

Is that a serious question?

 

[Bushface]

No. It's sarcastic.

 

[Junuxx]

... ;(

 

[Bostock]

Sometimes for Settlers the blue circles do at least draw your attention to a good location you haven't noticed, but those appearing for Workers are often just silly. Why does the AI ever suggest that I send a worker to an irrigated farm with wheat, or to a hill with a properly-connected iron mine on it ?

I have often wondered about this myself. I find it to be the number-one thing that makes the circles more distracting than useful (boggletastic settler circles aren't so bad since you aren't moving settlers so much), which is a shame, because they sometimes *are* useful, especially scout circles, since villages are so hard to see sometimes.

 

[Scoottr]

If the circles don't consider unteched unseen resources...then why do we have 'captial sites' that are better than others. The AI drops you on a spot right at the start that is better (in general terms) than moving one left right or up down. Think about where you first landed at the start of the game and see how many rescources it placed in the BFC.

So if it uses that logic to say this is the good spot even though you can't see the resoucres it is just as easy to see it using the blue circles after that first city to guide you to locations that will have more unseen resouces. I don't recall seeing a blue circle for city placement on what later was revealed to have a rescource on it. That is why when you see where it places the circle it sometimes makes no sense, but it is considering that unseen resource and trying to pack a city into the space available.

 

[Willem]

That is why when you see where it places the circle it sometimes makes no sense, but it is considering that unseen resource and trying to pack a city into the space available.

There have been a number of tests to determine whether unseen resources are considered and the overwhelming conclusions have been that they aren't.

 

[DSYoungEsq]

There have been a number of tests to determine whether unseen resources are considered and the overwhelming conclusions have been that they aren't.

In the absence of someone who has read and translated the specific coding, and determined what exactly is used to determine the location of the blue circle, I think it would be virtually impossible to inductively determine what is going on, regardless of supposed empirical data.

If you can point to someone who has decoded the programming for the blue circles, and determined that the unrevealed resources are not taken into account, then we can consider the matter settled. If you can point to a definitive statement from one of the game's programmers, then we can consider the matter settled. Otherwise, we'll just have to disagree.

 

[Willem]

If you can point to someone who has decoded the programming for the blue circles, and determined that the unrevealed resources are not taken into account, then we can consider the matter settled. If you can point to a definitive statement from one of the game's programmers, then we can consider the matter settled. Otherwise, we'll just have to disagree.

I get the distinct impression that no matter what anyone says that you wouldn't believe them anyway. If you want proof that badly then do it yourself and prove me wrong.

 

[God-Emperor]

The code for this is in CvPlayerAI.cpp, in the function AI_foundValue.

When it checks for bonuses it uses the getBonusType function from CvPlot.cpp. When this function is passed a team ID, it checks to see if the team in question has the tech necessary to reveal the bonus and if it does not have it, and the bonus type is not set to "force reveal" (this can be set by some events, like the "man named Jed" event that causes oil to be revealed), then it returns the NO_BONUS value instead of the actual bonus value.

In the various places AI_foundValue calls getBonusType it passes the team ID as an argument except when the plot is a starting location or the advanced start option is active.

So it does not take unrevealed bonuses into consideration unless the specific plot is specified as a starting location or the advanced start option is active.

 

[Otaku-sama]

. . .or a fresh water bonus (the AI values this highly, perhaps a little too much so), or coastal access, etc.

They value this highly because in RL, cities always had to be built near a water source because people need water. (The more you know)

I usually go with the blue circle because they give me the most balanced cities, which is good for a pathological cottage spammer like me.

 

[Lyoncet]

I think someone just pointed this out (may have been a different thread) but…

The key term here is water source. Not necessarily a standing body. So in other words you're overlooking the wells that support a huge percentage of Earth's populace and, incidentally, are probably just assumed in Civ rather than stated, since they would be pretty much everywhere. (The more you know.)

 

[Sisiutil]

They value this highly because in RL, cities always had to be built near a water source because people need water. (The more you know)

This is a computer game, not real life, and I seriously doubt that the AI is programmed to follow the dictates of the latter. Founding a city on a tile next to fresh water in the game gives you +2 health in that city. That's it. In real life, fresh water is essential; in the game, it's kinda nice, but far from necessary. Thus, the AI overvalues it.

 

[Deckhand]

If the circles don't consider unteched unseen resources...then why do we have 'captial sites' that are better than others. The AI drops you on a spot right at the start that is better (in general terms) than moving one left right or up down. Think about where you first landed at the start of the game and see how many rescources it placed in the BFC.

It's the other way around. The starting locations are not chosen on mucho resources being present, rather the starting locations are given bonus resources.

 

[Lyoncet]

This is a computer game, not real life, and I seriously doubt that the AI is programmed to follow the dictates of the latter.

I know. I was pointing out the flaw in the reasoning of the above poster.

 

[Scoottr]

If it doesn't consider unrevealed locations then we would be seeing more blue circles located on squares that later would reveal a rescource.

But, I can also see your point in that a blue circle will move in subsequent turns as more of the map is revealed to you.