BOTM 30 Final Spoiler

..._[8]-)

Welcome to civfanatics, gOTM, and Congratulations on doing so well in your first deity game. You lasted much longer than most of us.
 
I could tell very early (from the neighbors) winning would be impossible for me on this one. Not that I have much chance on deity anyway.

Played one city diplomat/observer to see how long I could last. Everyone hated each other more than me. :lol: Elizabeth culture victory in 1812AD.

cas
 
I was too confident that my tanks could hold on the city, however it turned out to be a joke and over 60 units were buried in the city.:rolleyes:

Ooooo... I hate it when that happens. :mad:

But that's the only part of your game that sounds like anything I could do. :cry:

Nice win! :goodjob:
 
It's weird that Joao did not produce any siege unit at that time and that's my confidence come from. Obviously his infantries and cavs could do the same job.:lol:
 
I began the game with an ill-advised attempt to establish Hinduism. It went to Monty instead, in his second city just south of Mutal in the jungle. Delightful. I figure I am doomed now but will try for a diplo victory anyway.

After that I tried to REX. Managed to get a city near the eastern gold (but missed Ivory) before the barbs came in strength. Held them off with Holkans. My barbs had Archers, btw.

Gradually stemmed the tide of barbs and got some more settlers out, blocking off the big peninsula. (I called it Alaska.) Refused Monty's request to open borders so I will have time to settle near the other gold. Probably a big mistake. Hinduism spreads to Huyana and Sitting Bull and they all become friends. So I open borders after all to try and join their party. Meanwhile I spit out Settlers as fast as I can and post them in the hinterlands, ready to claim territory before the others can get it.

Naturally, Monty declares on me in the late BCs. His Cats and Elephants outclass my Holkans and Axes so despite some short-term successes he ends up capturing Mutal and two other cities. I give him a fourth for peace.

Having established those Settlers I sent out earlier I'm left with four cities. I putter along for awhile longer entertaining hopes of somehow building the UN. But when I see Izzy building The Kremlin in 1210 AD or so while I am researching Machinery, I realize this is insane. I decide not to hang around just to watch someone else win, and retire in 1210 AD.
 
Oh, here's the final spoiler, knew I was playing this one well into the month. Well, boy, was this an absolutely crazy game.

Anyway, after the initial part of the game, I, the glorious J. Omega Pacal, or whatever the royal title was, figured that there were clearly 3 good city spots for culture and it would be safer to pull off than trying to beat the AI otherwise (well, diplo might have been doable now that I think about it, Joao unexplicably got up to friendly and all others except the blood twins were pleased.)

So while I missed a couple early wonders I pulled off the Great Library and Parthenon with forest chops, and through bulbing/trading I at least kept up in tech. The other continent was ahead in everything, but Huayna led me on our continent too. Only religion I had for the longest time was Hindu - even Tao was FIDL, Islam was too, and I eventually lost Liberalism somewhere around 600 AD.

I made possibly a mistake, or possibly a right call in teching Sci Method, still not sure which. Killing my DOUBLED SISTINE MONASTERIES (they lost the +5 from Sistine, and my core cities had monasteries over 1000 years old for that bonus, arg) pissed me off, didn't realize the monasteries would lose culture when they obsoleted. And losing GL/Parthenon might not have been worth it in the long run - I also missed GP from Communism/Physics cause Izzy had em already. Vladimir Ilyich Pacalin's dreams of a Communist utopia dashed quite expertly (well, we never would have had crippled robots) we just turned back to plan B and the vanilla culture slider. Biology was the real treasure and the best reason I kept on teching - helping get many cities to +10 or +12 food and run more artists. I eventually trade for Steam Power (3x levies, all core cities go production up, helped with a certain debacle...) and Democracy. Though I never converted to my beloved Universal Suffrage, staying in Hereditary to please dangerous AI.

So come the Renaissance and when I turned tech off I really thought I had this one in the bag. All AI pleased, Monty and Huayna poised to war with each other. (already had 2 DoWs from Huayna and one from Monty in that conflict). I was running artists in many cities and all doing superbly, was estimating a victory not too far into the 200s, probably well before the midway point.

Then, about 30 turns off from victory, Monty shocked me. Which I shouldn't have been shocked, you know, it's Monty, but boy was I angry and panicking. Despite being pleased with me, and furious (like -12) with Huayna, he DoW'd me. The weird part was they'd been in WHEEORN like 20 turns beforehand - Huayna did DoW Monty, but I figured it was mutual. Izzy also later dropped a WHEEORN somehow after like 30 turns, I thought she was after Liz perhaps and Liz peacefully vassaled to cancel it.

Anyway, Monty took back his own culture flipped cities (never got to culture flip the holy city, it was only in range when Mutal hit Legendary. But I pushed back his borders from time immemorial). I had to cut culture, upgrade warriors and holkan of which I had about 1 per city (;)) to rifles, and I built a few more rifles. Luckily he holed up in the border cities till they ran out of unrest, and I didn't even have to buy off peace, because he called peace himself (Huayna was gonna run him over, and in the last war between the two, Huayna finally vassalized him) through the AP. Thankful on balance I guess that Monty got the Hindu AP for me, and didn't kill me the whole game. And Moctezume actually is spelled close enough that I knew who he was, I think that's why both our peoples in their throbbingly sacrificial heart of hearts hated those white devil Europeans who can't spell. Though hidden modifiers are always a thumbsdown - I even voted Monty into the AP, got those +2/+4, and +11 total at one point, and he's not Friendly :nono:

So that's it, or you'd think so, and so did I, as if I could maintain peace (and I even got a DP with Joao) I was good to go. Then, the Victory screen - Izzy was all of like 15-20 turns away from cultural victory. I knew she was high up there but figured I could beat her, she must have gone all out too on her slider.

What followed was the most intense culture war ever seen. Buddhist monks in hovercars (cause she had so much modern tech) built culture with their minds. Meanwhile I had more of the slavedriving operation going - tens of thousands of citizens with whips to their backs forced to paint masterpieces for their daily bowl of maize.

I got out enough GA just in time, the last 3-4 in quick succession. Actually stupidly starved some cities that never made it anyway, but just costs score and pride. An engineer I'd popped from running a silly engineer specialist way back when (lost SoL though, wish I'd gotten that one) was used for a second Golden Age with an artist, probably 20ish turns from the end. And no, I'm not sure that was the right call either - just using that artist in the city he would have gone in anyway (and maybe using the engy for a wonder like Globe Theatre, idk) may have actually payed off more. And I was going to be absolutely furious if Monty or something from thousands of years ago cost this loss to Izzy. Fortuntaley Izzy never popped an artist for at least the last 20 turns as far as I could tell, stupid Joao popped like three and nearly gave me heart attacks each time.

In short, the psy-monks lost by a hair, my people motivated by the fury of K'inich Janaab' Pakal or whatever he called himself, they were afraid to even asked, and called him their Leader alone. For that matter, all the names were ridiculous, made me hate these AI more - some of my most hated AI were here, I guess I have to count my lucky stars it was Joao who's a cool homeboy instead of Cyrus though.

What's that - right, the end of it all and the screenshots I meant to post (think these are all right, no special spoilers). I snuck in by two turns I think, but really only one since I won't have a victory on a technicality of the human's turn going first, and win fair and square. All I know is we Mayans never again have to listen to Buddhist monks brag about how Barfthelona is teh serenz. My loyal core of Mutal-isks out macroed the lisping Spaniard templars (well, they really pronounce those should-be-s-sounds-as-th) and brought a win to our New World.

Spoiler :



I like how there was more salt rubbed in her wounds at the end too. Somehow my cities took ALL TOP THREE spots even though Madrid had more culture, guess it's become I'm the awesome Kwisatz Pacalerach she's not.

Spoiler :




Monty and Huayna finished at about a mutual -14, maybe more on Monty's side with HC a little less (Huayna had more total DoWs on him). In other words, pushing the record Monty, live out your dreams and shoot for the stars (not as bad as one game I had in SP once though when it was Monty and Shaka were on an island the Prime Directive left well to itself, lolz when will Monty ever learn)
 
:lol: Duckweed, you just gave me the shield! I should have just taken the stupid domination win instead of being cute and changing it to conquest... It was a long game for me. I took military tradition from liberalism because HC was teching too fast for steel. So I had to go against SB's protective horde with cavalry instead of cannons. As a result, it took a long long time to take him out. By the time I took him out, Izzy and HC were both threatening a culture victory. THankfully, Izzy declared on me and I dragged HC in by using the AP. Izzy and HC stayed at war for probably a good 1000 years (her power was too high for HC to get out). I had built the UN but by this time, Joao's pop was #2 and he was supposed to be my voting buddy. So I had to come up with plan B.

I eventually armed myself with some nukes and a stack of about 50 units and set sail for Izzy. She didn't have SDI or fission, so I nuked her culture cities then chewed through her vassal Liz followed by Izzy herself. Eventually she capitulated after some serious nuking.

By then, Joao had launched his ship so I set sail and razed his capital. I then proceeded to conquer his cities (he didn't have much of an army after I took out his naval sod) and capitulated him too. The last one left at this point was HC (Liz got culturally exterminated by Izzy :lol:). He had initially started culture but turned his research back on after Izzy declared on him. He had most of the modern techs but not computer or robotics. I nuked him too (yeah a theme in my game) and eventually capitulated him. I gifted some cities back thinking nobody else would get conquest on deity normal :lol: That teaches me!
 
@shyuhe

I really hope for a shield this time and you deprived it.:lol::mad: I consider conquest victory the most valuable type for a true deity game. Glad to see you pull it out.:goodjob:
 
@shyuhe

I really hope for a shield this time and you deprived it.:lol::mad: I consider conquest victory the most valuable type for a true deity game. Glad to see you pull it out.:goodjob:

:lol: You're telling me! I thought you'd go for domination in your game so I was trying conquest instead :crazyeye: It looks like you did a nice job farming your score too. My nuke happy conquest didn't yield very good cities for some reason :mischief:
 
My economy crashed and although I was able to scramble up a bit higher to an equal level of Montezuma and Sitting Bull, I was unable to match Hyuana Capac. It was impossible to create enough of an army to match the strength of either of these foes and my units were not better either. I had to settle for a peaceful game and went Cultural.... sadly, that backfired because only 1 religion was spread to me until very late in the 1800s. At that point in time I onyl needed about 20 turns (if 2 religions, I would have been done by then), Isabelle was closer to a cultural victory, but the one that took the win was Joao with a spaceship.

I would probably have done better had I been able to get the sistine chapel and some other wonders, but I was unable to build fast enough to catch any of them since the AIs were well ahead of me in techs. Perhaps I spread my cities too far or focused too many early techs and alphabet too late... I don't know. All I know is that I should go down a few levels in this game.
 
I finished the game just to see who will be the victor. Didnt realize that barbs have no archery and lost 4 or 5 cities to the AIs. Got my army to reconqist my land, desided to jump at Montesuma first and nice surprise - he attacks SB. I attacked at next turn, took 4-5-6 cities and was heading for his capital when this women capitulated to SB. I ended with few badly pressed by foreign culture former aztec cities, bad placed mine cities, huge army, which killed my economy. Felt behind in techs and recover just in time to see one of the big ones from the other continent launch his spaceship. Lost in late 1800's.

It seems that I must try to learn new ways of winning this game other than military.
 
Was overrun by monty axes and jaguars 1600 bc, no archery, no funds to research it due to expansion. Tried again - monty declared 800bc. Third time Capac got judaism from Montie's city and declared on him 1000bc. Your survival depends much on luck in this game. Mine was short.
 
Your survival depends much on luck in this game. Mine was short.

Your game result will be affected by the DOW, but your survival is not, especially in this map. Predicting the DOW and preparing for it is the base for survival in deity. DOW between 1500BC to around 1AD (without cat) is the easiest to defend.
 
Your game result will be affected by the DOW, but your survival is not, especially in this map. Predicting the DOW and preparing for it is the base for survival in deity. DOW between 1500BC to around 1AD (without cat) is the easiest to defend.

Not if you didn't get metal in your second city.

I would love to have seen copper just a bit closer, I actually didn't even know where it was when I settled my second city because of my scouting path. :(

I had piles of Holkans in a preparation to rush, and was soundly defeated by Monty's Axes.
 
Your game result will be affected by the DOW, but your survival is not, especially in this map. Predicting the DOW and preparing for it is the base for survival in deity. DOW between 1500BC to around 1AD (without cat) is the easiest to defend.
Disagree. Your survival is determined by the DOW - without Archery holcans are n match to aggressive axes/jaguars. My capital was conquered on turn 3 of war despite any steps undertaken. Even Archery with 2-3 archers instead of Holkans wouldn't save the game.
Your skill is truly great, but ultra-early DOW of Capac on Monty is purely a piece of incredible luck. I see you settled cities to block Monty with 4th and 5th settlers, if not later. In my game unbound Monty settled western city before my 2nd settler was out.
 
Sorry to say that, but you guys make a gamble by not settling at the copper and not teching animal husbandry and archery, and you lost it. You are the one that counted on luck and made it a part of the equation in this game. Its Monthy at deity anyway.
 
Not if you didn't get metal in your second city.

I would love to have seen copper just a bit closer, I actually didn't even know where it was when I settled my second city because of my scouting path. :(

I had piles of Holkans in a preparation to rush, and was soundly defeated by Monty's Axes.

Archer is as good as axe in a hill city and much cheaper.

Disagree. Your survival is determined by the DOW - without Archery holcans are n match to aggressive axes/jaguars. My capital was conquered on turn 3 of war despite any steps undertaken. Even Archery with 2-3 archers instead of Holkans wouldn't save the game.
Your skill is truly great, but ultra-early DOW of Capac on Monty is purely a piece of incredible luck. I see you settled cities to block Monty with 4th and 5th settlers, if not later. In my game unbound Monty settled western city before my 2nd settler was out.

Yes, the key is Archery, in over 50% of the deity games I have played, I research Archery and that's the reason I feel most comfortable when I play with Mansa and protective leaders.

In this game, you should have at least 3 cities and 2 workers that time. Whip 1 from every city and chop 2, you'll have 5 archers in your capital, there's no way that Monty has any chance. I analyzed the DOW in the 1st spoiler. If you are in danger of being the target, then you have to prepare for it than relying on luck factor. I settled the blocking cities very late to avoid being land target of Monty before he chose his target. IIRC, the blocking cities are the 6th and 8th.

BTW, HC did not DOW Monty in my game. It was Monty who DOWed. I described the DOW situation in the 1st spoiler and I believe that is the most common situation. I have faced the deity early DOW many times and this map is an easy one to defend.
 
I dunno, HC went dagger in my game against Monty. A deity AI going dagger against the human is pretty much an auto-loss so I got lucky in that regard. You can hedge your bets against a normal war prep but those aren't the only variables in the equation.
 
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