[BtS] Destiny Mod

[smeagolheart]

I've definitely seen another thread where they talk about invisible unit problem, but can't find the link now. I believe the problem was with running the game with graphics settings low and/or older videocard

 

[kuff-dam]

Hmmmmm, I've been running low to speed up the game, will give it a try as I've got quite a dismal graphics card

Aswell as that, ran into a problem building a modern day scenario on this mod as worldbuilder doesn't have any game editing options, plus I'm not sure some of the graphics included are suitable, need to think this one out properly as it'll be my first scenario/mod effort since my alexander the great ones for civ3

 

[Pessimus Dux]

I just downloaded & tried this mode.
It is very VERY good, nothing too much is added but enough to make this mode more than interesting. The things I liked the most:

1) new religions added - now I can play with all nations and have their historical religion, like Amun-Ra (Egypt), Shinto (Japan) etc.
2) new leaders & civs - all added were (quite) significant in history of mankind, and deserve their place among others. In addition, Holy Roman empire was removed, and I fully agree with that. One German civ with three leaders is enough, and avoids confusion + Holy Romans were overpowered IMHO.
3) unit upgrade tree is more accurate & complete. I was especially happy when I noticed Bombard unit, badly missing artillery-type unit from an early gunpowder era. After all, the invention of a gunpowder affected artillery FIRST, infantry later.
4) I noticed that some civs have more unique units or buildings, but they are still balanced well. It could be avoided I suppose, but hey, it's more fun & historically accurate this way.
5) Terrain remained untouched; I usually dislike alternative Civ4 terrains, so this is a +, not -.

Good work, and thnx for hours and hours of fun, in advance!

 

[smeagolheart]

I'm glad ya liked it! Also glad the mod's purpose is being met in that the additions aren't *totally* overwhelming the game.

 

[Pessimus Dux]

Yes, when I'm playing the game, I still have feeling that I'm playing Civ4, not some gigantic genetically-improved version of it.
After a while, I noticed some small but perfectly balanced details you made. For example, Maceman unit is renamed to Heavy Footman unit, which fits better to some civs whose medieval footmen don't use maces. Even more, you added 50% strength vs other melee units, making them much stronger opponent to the axemen & swordsmen - it's not only historically more accurate, but it also prevents civs like Romans to build Praetorians in the medieval era instead of Heavy Footmen.
What to say, excellent job!

However, I have some questions:
a) is there a way to replace or improve graphic for Idn Sadr? Current graphic seems very strange/weird when compared to the Saladin for instance. I don't know is this just me, but I have feeling that animation is only partially complete.
b) rams - how can they be used in a game? I mean, I know how but it seems that their usefullness expires very early in the game. Are they made for marathon speed when first xcy turns most civs have warriors only?

 

[smeagolheart]

I must give credit to Wolfshanze's Wolfshanze mod for the footman and actually most of the units are from his mod (including the rams). They are there to provide early alternatives for warfare in the early game before the discovery of catapults which can occur a few techs into the game (construction) and as you say it is historical since early peoples had other options for city seiges before catapults. I don't see them as really useful but they are there if you feel (or the AI) that you need them to make war really early in the game. I think it's a bit overkill to have both the ram and capped ram before catapults but it doesn't really harm I guess.

Ibn Saud is in there because he feels unique to other leaderheads and I definitely wanted to give the Arabians more leaders especially when there are so many for Russia and USA for example. I did replace his background because I didn't like the one that I found him with but I'm not 100% happy with the replacement but it seems ok. There are a couple other Arabian leaderheads I could use (there's a good Abu Bakr one out there). Ibn Saud, as the founder of Saudi Arabia seems important enough to include.

Unique Leaderheads for meaningful leaders are tough to come by!

 

[Pessimus Dux]

I must give credit to Wolfshanze's Wolfshanze mod for the footman and actually most of the units are from his mod (including the rams). They are there to provide early alternatives for warfare in the early game before the discovery of catapults which can occur a few techs into the game (construction) and as you say it is historical since early peoples had other options for city seiges before catapults. I don't see them as really useful but they are there if you feel (or the AI) that you need them to make war really early in the game. I think it's a bit overkill to have both the ram and capped ram before catapults but it doesn't really harm I guess.

Ah, I see. Yep, well it definitely gives you more options in a very early stage. Although I usually prey to not get into a war SO soon.

Ibn Saud is in there because he feels unique to other leaderheads and I definitely wanted to give the Arabians more leaders especially when there are so many for Russia and USA for example. I did replace his background because I didn't like the one that I found him with but I'm not 100% happy with the replacement but it seems ok. There are a couple other Arabian leaderheads I could use (there's a good Abu Bakr one out there). Ibn Saud, as the founder of Saudi Arabia seems important enough to include.

Unique Leaderheads for meaningful leaders are tough to come by!

Yes, I'm aware of the fact that making an animation of civ4 leader isn't easy at all. Well, Ibn Saud (pardon for not remembering his name correctly, silly me, I mixed him up with some other guy) definitely deserves to be a leader of Arabs, and yes, Arabs deserves more leaders. I only wandered is it possible to get a better animation somewhere - and it is not background so weird, it's Ibn himself. But Ok, I'm already more than happy with the option to play Arab leader whose traits are Spiritual and Financial!

Btw, I noticed this whole "Revolution Watch" thing, something I never met before. It's pretty self explanatory, but I don't know which governments citizens are more likely to prefer, is there any formula how to keep two-three religions in a city and still not falling in danger of Revolution? What happens if one of my cities gain independence? Does it became a "minor nation"? If I re-conquest the city, will it start to request independence again? And how can I affect things like "distance from palace" which obviously makes my citizens more eagerly to declare independence. Can Forbidden Palace help?

Sorry if I'm bothering you, and thanx for the answers!

 

[smeagolheart]

Here's info from the mod's doc.. (my directory: C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Beyond the Sword\Mods\Destiny\docs\RevolutionsDCM)

Spoiler :

Revolution Description
Version 1.3
Enabled by default

The goal:

This component allows sections of disgruntled empires to rise up together and demand changes or attempt to break away from the motherland. No matter what the source of the complaint, you will be given an option to either ignore the complaint or accept the cities demands. If their demands go unmet and situations deteriorate, the cities may give you an ultimatum and take up arms if you do not comply!

How it works:

This component is intended to add realistic dynamics to the game, making keeping your cities and regions happy more important and challenging. Each city in your empire will have factors that make it want to stay and factors that make it want to rebel. If you cannot find a balance that keeps each of your cities happy, you will face revolts! Revolts come in many different styles, including requests to change civics, requests to change state religion, and demands for independence. No matter what the scenario, you will always be given choices when confronted with a rebellious city.

This component has been updated to support Vassal states and other new features of Warlords. It also now incorporates most of the ideas from the prior Rebellion component. The AI logic appears bug free, but it's difficult to test all the human popup handling. However, it has undergone extensive testing and is in a good working state. If you do encounter a revolution popup whose results don't follow from what you selected, please let me know!

More Details

Spoiler :

Each city has a Revolution Index, and when that index gets up towards 1000 they start to get restless. You will be warned whenever a city passes over 900 and every ~15 turns while it's in the danger zone, and once over 1000 it may instigate a revolution. Other nearby cities with rev indices over 600 can join in a revolution. If a city is unhappy, things are very similar but the minimum threshold for a revolution drops quickly with the number of unhappy citizens.
There are several different Revolution styles and the situation in the Revolution instigating city determines the style. Many styles have peaceful and violent variants: denying a request will just agitate the city further, but denying a demand will lead to civil war! In order of precedence:

- Return to or reform dominant culture: Cities in which you don't have a majority culture will become increasing aggitated and may attempt to break away for cultural reasons. The instigator and nearby, similarly cultured cities will ask (peaceful) or demand (violent) to join or reform a dead rival. Denying this request will cause your relations with the rival to deteriorate, and they may choose to declare war!

- Religious differences: Cities may ask for a change away from Theocracy or to Freedom of Religion, or to switch your state religion. They can also ask or demand independence for religious reasons.

- Homeland revolutions: Ask for various different civics. May ask for you to go on a crusade to capture your religion's holy city.

- Colonial revolutions: Ask for change to representative government. (Independence handled below)

- Capital or majority of cities revolting: Cities will ask for changes in away from repressive civics, or for some form of a say in the government. They can also ask or demand a change in ruler! If you're running a representative government, accepting their requests will mean facing election. If you are replaced, the game will automate some number of turns and then return control to you (this feature can be disabled).

- Independence: If none of these particular conditions apply, the cities will ask for or demand independence. They may request full independence or assume Vassal status.

If you face civil war, the situation may become quite dier. Strong garrisons may be able to maintain some semblance of control in some of the revolting cities, but weaker garrisons may be run out of town and the revolutionaries will take the city. Your homeland will not be the same for generations if you face multiple revolting cities on the battlefield! In addition, rebellious cities that the rebels have not yet taken may turn out rebel reinforcements.

The Revolution Watch

Clicking on the red fist button below the normal info buttons or pressing Ctrl-Shift-W in the game will open the Revolution Watch popup. This popup displays which of your cities is in danger of rebelling, thinking about rebelling, or happy with your empire. In each category, the cities are ordered with the most rebellious towards the top. In addition, cities whose local situation is deterioirating are shown in orange. For specific information on how your civ-wide policies or the local city situation are effecting the rebelliousness of the city, scroll down and click the details button. This will open a new popup containing a lot of important information about the rebelliousness of your cities.

At the top of this detail popup is an analysis of your national policies and situation. The effect of your civics, anarchy, golden age, empire size and fiscal situation are shown here. These affect all of your cities equally. Next is a city-by-city listing of local effects. The location of the city, the religions and cultures in the city, the happiness and healthiness of the people, the size of the city, the size of the city's garrison, and culture rate are all important factors you may see here. For both positive and negative effects the specific causes are ordered with the strongest first and grayscale indicating the intensity with whiter being more intense.

Your civics can have a significant effect on how these local factors are felt. For example, running a theocracy will cause cities with non-state religions to be more rebellious, but keep cities with your state religion less rebellious. Representative government civics will greatly decrease the effects of distance on outlieing cities or colonies.

If you want to understand a bit more of how all of the revolution factors work, you can enable a debug option in Revolution.ini that will add some numbers to the Revolution Watch popup. While this level of information is unrealistic for the leader of an empire, it may help you understand how the mod reacts to certain decisions you make.

Also the forum for Revolutions is: http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?f=261

In general, having "happy" civics will make your citizens happier than say slavery or despotism. And you can always spend a lil gold to bribe the discontented peoples so it's always good to have a couple hundred in the treasury.

 

[Pessimus Dux]

Ok, this makes much more sense now, thanks. Viva la revol... oh, I meant: "God save the Queen".

 

[ATG]

Greetings!

I took a long break from civ because I wanted the excellent mods out there to mature a little before attempting a long game. Unfortunately, it seems these HUGE mods only keep getting bigger while the bug load increases as well. I wish modders would first find a stable base before adding new items just for the sake of adding them.

Which brings me to your mod.... I definately agree smaller is better. The game can be much more enjoyable with small quality rather than big quantity.

I am very much interested in starting a new game with this mod.

The only thing is I really enjoyed NextWar for what it added to the modern years of gameplay. I couldn't image progressing to the future with the monotony of the same units...it kinda left something to look forward too since I do most of my war mongering in the later years. Does this mod incorporate any aspect of nextwar?

Thanks.

 

[smeagolheart]

Greetings!
Does this mod incorporate any aspect of nextwar?
Thanks.

Not yet...

I am interested in adding Nextwar content, but so far have not been able to get it some of it to work correctly so it's not in (ps if anyone can assist with some unitclass issues send me a pm )

I do plan to add cyborgs, automatons, biological warfare missles and labs, and mechs from NextWar. The dreadnaught likely won't make it, the mechs are enough. I am not in love with the implementation of "anti-biological" promotions and such, seems a bit much. I'd like to do that part another way.

For now, this mod does add quite a bit to the later years with the Wolfshazne content to include trench class units and lots more modern naval ships.

There may be other "future" tech type stuff to flesh out the era and balance it a bit. If so it will be based on principles from previous civ games or scenarios and not some crazy overpowered stuff.

So stick with this mod, some Nextwar stuff is coming in the next version, likely out in a week give or take......

 

[smeagolheart]

I am also pondering adding Chemical Weapons Missle and Chemical Weapons Lab but am not 100% sure the "best" way to do it. To me this could represent some of the big threats that were prevalent in say WWI and the 1980s (even today as well). I imagine using this effect...

So rough ideas are that when you make the chem weapons plant, your relation with other leaders goes down to some degree. When you attack (or are attacked) the missles would maybe add an unhealthiness effect to cities for X number of turns. Since it's for more than 1 turn it would be a bit more potent than the spy mission "poison water". Not sure if I want my Chemical weapons missles to be able to attack troops or not as well and if so maybe persistent for a couple turns ala the WWI trench warfare.

A lot of these type ideas would need python to make them work properly, I'm no python programmer but I think I can make it work once I have a solid plan on how something like this would fit in the big picture of the game so it wouldn't confuse the AI and unbalance everything else in the game.

It is a bit amusing to imagine in the game where a Civ has the capability to launch missles with chemical, biological (nextwar) and nukes (vanilla) and then to imagine the story of the conversations the leaders in the game might have had before... Such as assuring each other "we have no weapons of mass destruction"...

 

[Onionsoilder]

With chemical weapons, unhealthiness shouldn't really be a factor. The weapons used in WWI and WWII, like Mustard Gas, simply suffocated the soldiers on the battlefield. Theoretically, it could be used on cities as well, but the last thing people wanted to do was to kill everyone in a city.

If you do want to add them in, I would suggest a strict -1 or -2 pop in cities that are targeted with them, and -20% health per weapon strike on 5-6 units in the tile(excluding things like tanks and aircraft for obvious reasons).

 

[smeagolheart]

I've cooled a bit on the idea for now of chem weapons. The next version is coming along great now and should be ready within a couple days.

I've expanded the tech tree to include some NextWar units as a tech from Civ 3. I'm currently just trying to add a version of the Urban Planner unit (from Call to Power) and then I'll be releasing the new version.

 

[phungus420]

I notice you are considering creating a scrolling scoreboard to deal with the large # of civs that can occur late game on large maps. If you do, please share your work with glider1 in the RevDCM thread so that this can be incorporated in the RevDCM core.

 

[smeagolheart]

Well, poking around the forums, I've seen this scrolling scoreboard by Johnny Smith http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=7376010 but it sounds like there are a couple of minor issues with it. Also the Community Civ V supposedly has it also http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=7376010 in the future, I intend to have a look at their code and see how it goes, once I do I'll share in the RevDCM thread

 

[smeagolheart]

I'm finishing up the next version of the Detiny Mod. Polishing up a few bugs and so forth. It will be available very soon.

Credit goes to EmperorFool, Phungus420, and zappara for their assistance!

Here's a sneak peek at what the near-final next version will offer:
Version .99:

• Added Philip II of Spain. Leaderhead from Colonization, PW90
• Added Macedonian Civilization (Alexander's Conquest Mod BTS). UUs, UB added.
• Alexander moved to Macedonian empire. Philip II of Macedon as second leader (yes this mod has two Philip IIs now)
• New Units (NextWar) - Clones (advanced workers), Biological Warfare Missle, Automatons, Cyborgs
• New Buildings (NextWar) - Cloning Facility, Biological Warfare Lab, Mind Control Center (Final Frontier) - Mining Facility, Nutrition Facility
• New Unit: Urban Planner (Call to Power 2)- Can create cities size 3 with a couple buildings already built or can be used to build a few basic buildings in other cities
• Added Leonardo's Workshop Wonder (Civ 3 Wonder by Tsentom1) - Leonardo's Workshop reduces the cost of military upgrades by 50% until it obsoletes
• Public Works National Wonder (Tsentom1) - Public Works constructs a basic infrastructure in a city at a fraction of the actual production cost. Use it to quickly bring a city founded late in the game up to speed with the rest of your empire.
• Eden Project (Tsentom1) - Completing the Eden Project improves all terrain within your cultural borders by one level.
• National Intelligence HQ National Wonder - Can be built by Great Spy, increases espionage output
• Added Centers for Disease Control National Wonder (Nextwar)
• Modified Sphinx art
• Updated Cristo Redentor to "White Christ from Rio" model by HROCHland
• Added [BTS] Volcano mod by hrochland, Fierabras. The Volcano random event will look like a volcano
• Added Proper Crossings by Niessuh
• Added [BTS] Tornado mod by hrochland, GarretSidzaka, Fierabras. Tornado event will add animation.
• Incorporated NextWar/Future techs: Terrestrial Networking, Ascendancy Theory, Theory of Everything, Cloning, Aquaculture, Hydroponics, Bionics, Cybernetics, Astrogation
• New techs Urban Planning (Call to Power 2), Terraforming (Tsentom1's Thomas' War), Smart Weapons (Civ 3)
• Modified Montezuma traits to Imperialist, Spiritual
• Updated gametext files

 

[phungus420]

[*]Added Leonardo's Workshop Wonder (Civ 3 Wonder by Tsentom1) - Leonardo's Workshop reduces the cost of military upgrades by 50% until it obsoletes

I'm actually going to add this one into the base WolfRevolution mod whenever Wolf releases 2.86 (He's kind of disapeared though, I'm starting to wonder if Wolfshanze 2.86 is actually coming). Anyway the released Leonardo's Workshop by Tsentom1 was free upgrades; Like you, I'm going to reduce this to 50% cost as well, but that's kind of a weak effect for a wonder to be honest (especially since it goes obsolete relatively quickly). I'm going to have it grant a free Engineer along with the reduction in upgrade cost; I recommend you consider adding a corresponding buff if you're going to be nerfing it as well.

 

[smeagolheart]

Version 0.99 released!

See the first post for the download link!

Enjoy "Destiny" fans

 

[Agent327]

Will check it out.