[BtS MOD] Wolfshanze 1850-1920 Enhancement Mod v2.0

[Wolfshanze]

Well, I'm just running a test right now... the "problem" is not so-much the fact that the AI uses MGs to defend cities... that's not the problem... the "problem" is that unless the AI is on the offensive somewhere, it tends not to have any other types of troops around... what that means is you have a "free hand" to walk around his empire with impunity, without worrying about any kind of counter-attack against unescorted units, or severely weakened forces... because MGs can't attack!

If he has a stack of 6 MGs in a town, that's a tough cookie to crack, but you can batter yourself against him like crazy without worrying about a counter-attack... if he had so-much as one or two riflemen for every 4 or 5 MGs in a city, then there would be the threat of a counterattack of some sort.

So no... the AI is doing a great job of defending in-and-of-itself, but you can assault AI territory with impunity since MGs can't attack offensively. I would just like to see one or two riflemen per city in a stack of MGs. Unless the AI is actively forming a SoD for the offensive, it won't do that (but unlike previous versions which formed SoD with MGs, at least the current version prohibits MGs in SoDs).

I'm running a TEST right now on my end... if I'm not happy with the result, the current AI tags will be continue to be used... for now, it's just a test.

 

[blitzkrieg80]

wouldn't it be most historical if MGs COULD attack, esp. concerning WW2 era? 'defend-only' is a crappy game mechanic for AI, as seen time and again by Civ sequels... but it isn't hardcoded is it? i think a second gen. MG would be cool and actually fix this too!

OR, better YET, since an extra unit is prob too much extra work, just make the MG less powerful slightly and mobile- maybe start with city defender but less overall? or i am sure you guys can think of something creative to signify a mobile MG and defense but less mobility than other

 

[arstal]

Maybe cut MG Str to 14 so AI doesn't upgrade much, but give it +75% vs Cavalry, +25% vs Infantry

 

[phungus420]

I'd rather MGs stay how they are. They are very good city defenders, especially with their immunity to collateral damage. Removing their "can't attack" ability would have huge consequences, and require alot of rebalancing, that isn't really necessary.

 

[Wolfshanze]

I'm not changing any of the MG stats or ability to attack/not-attack... I'm just looking for the "perfect" AI use of the MG... it's fairly decent now, and it will stay as it is now unless I find something I like better.

 

[blitzkrieg80]

well, not wanting to mess with balance makes a lot of sense... but faith in Firaxis hardcode / AI....

 

[Wolfshanze]

well, not wanting to mess with balance makes a lot of sense... but faith in Firaxis hardcode / AI....

Like I said... I'm toying with different AI routines/combinations... I've already got MG use by the AI far superior to what the default AI code/use was... and if I can't improve on it any further, I'll leave it as-is... but I still have hope I can tweak it just a bit more... if not, as it is in v2.85 is where it will stand... if I can find something a bit better, I'll make another adjustment.

 

[phungus420]

Wanted to say there are nearly 300 downloads of the WolfRevolution 1.1.1 build. So combined with the merged mod, there are quite alot of people effectively using the Wolfshanze mod.

My spidey senses are also tingling on Wolfshanze 2.86? Is this just wishful thinking on my part?

And one last thing, I'm not a fan of adding techs. I can see what you are saying with the triremes though, I guess I'll have to see. My main concern though is the Industrialism tech, it's very crowded, do you have any plans to split that up somehow?

 

[Wolfshanze]

I'm not a fan of adding techs either... I'd much rather rearrange units on the existing tech tree and/or rearrange the existing techs... if I do add-one it's after much thought, and because doing the aforementioned fixes just don't work the way I want. I have no regrets with either Muskets or Air Superiority being added. I've long not-liked how/where Triremes are on the tech chart. I have repeatedly tried to think of repositioning triremes on the existing tech-tree, but nothing seems to work to my satisfaction, but I think I have a solution that will work like what I mentioned before, and because it's an early tech, and will be dirt-cheap, it shouldn't mess with anything, and should in-fact enhance tech flow and get triremes in action more in-line with where they should be. Let's just say I have a plan, and it's been long in the planning... I don't do things like that light-heartedly...

On Industrial Techs and "splitting them up"... do you mean adding a new industrial-age tech? I might, but I still don't have any firm plans as-of this second... and I refuse to do anything "just because I can"... I'm not going to add any techs just for the sake of adding a tech... I'll only add one if it makes sense and/or fixes/corrects a problem/issue with the existing tech/flow or appearance of a unit(s). As of this moment, there are no plans on adding any new industrial-age techs... I haven't thought of anything that meets my requirements, so no... at this second, no plans. I won't ever rush adding any techs... they all MUST be well-thought-out.

v2.86? It exists (as does almost any new version within 24hrs of releasing my previous version), but it's in no-means ready for prime-time.

As of THIS SECOND... v2.86 is a few ideas (listed in previous posts), and these already-implemented items:

************
New in v2.86
************
Fixed Cuirassier placement on F6 tech-tree for Hussar and Heavy Hussar UUs
Changed Viking Longboat main AI routine
Changed Machine Gun AI routine (*experimental, may change-back*)
New Asian ship unit buttons
Tweaked Ironclad Gunboat pre-req techs

New models/skins for:
Austrian Franz Josef LH (updated)
Japanese Emperor Meiji LH (updated)


******

In other words, as you can see... not a whole lot has been done... heck, I just released v2.85... so v2.86 still has a lot of growing-up to do before it sees the light of day.

 

[phungus420]

I mean Industrialism, the Tech itself. Like I said it just feels like it alone is too crowded (lots of stuff it does). I'm not thinking of a quick fix here, just something to think about down the road.

 

[Wolfshanze]

I mean Industrialism, the Tech itself. Like I said it just feels like it alone is too crowded (lots of stuff it does). I'm not thinking of a quick fix here, just something to think about down the road.

Industrialism is the main WWII-tech, much as Assembly Line is the main WWI-tech... in either case, both have "companion" techs that complete the world-war techs... you need Artillery to make WWI units show-up and you need Radio to make WWII units show-up... I also add a few late-WWII units with Rocketry, so it is split-up a bit more then it may seem on paper (in other-words, to get all the WWII-era units, you pretty-much need Industrialism, Radio & Rocketry... not-counting the aerial requirement of Air Superiority).

Anyways, to answer your question directly... no, I don't really have any plans for doing anything with the Industrialism tech... I'd be more inclined to add some sort of tech in the Industrial era for pre-dreadnoughts or something, but as I've mentioned before, I don't have any pre-set plans for either adding or splitting any techs right now, other then a new (very minor) tech for Triremes early in the tree.

 

[Wolfshanze]

Wanted to say there are nearly 300 downloads of the WolfRevolution 1.1.1 build. So combined with the merged mod, there are quite alot of people effectively using the Wolfshanze mod.

FYI:
5,257 downloads of Wolfshanze Mod since v2.70 (when I started tracking it)...
955 downloads of Wolfshanze Mod v2.84 alone...
341 downloads of Wolfshanze Mod v2.85 since 28 October...

 

[phungus420]

The 300 number is from the version released of the 2.85 build, added the 31st I believe. So if you include it in the numbers it nearly doubles the ammount of users using the 2.85 build, and combine that with the merged mod, and I wouldn't be surprised if there are nearly 3 times as many players playing 2.85 as you're recording at filefront. Just saying your mod is pretty popular.

 

[JimMac99]

And I've passed your mod to my brothers and nephew who use it as their standard CiV version, so add another 3

As I see it one of the many strengths of this mod is that you dont add techs or units simply because you can; stick to your guns on that.

So, is there any reason why I would choose not to play using the Wolfshanze Mod?.. Yeah, if I wanted to get the benefits of the latest Better AI work.

I know you indicated before that to incorporate this work is a major job requiring the assistance of another, but I wonder: with the release of Dresdens unofficial patch 0.21 in Better A.I. 0.41, do you think it might be time to consider an update in this aspect?

 

[Ninja2]

Actually, the people who play Merged Mod shouldn't be counted, as they are already included in Wolf's downloads. But still, plenty of people are playing the various combinations, which is great - and pretty much the only reason why I keep developing Merged Mod.

 

[sourboy]

Another potential error:

Naval units can enter mainland tiles if the tile has a fort built on it.

 

[arstal]

I think that is WAD, and can be done in the base game.

 

[Wolfshanze]

Another potential error:

Naval units can enter mainland tiles if the tile has a fort built on it.

Forts double as both PORTS and airbases in default Civ4... has nothing to do with the Wolfshanze Mod, that's a standard feature of Civ4.

 

[tomppb]

I go back and forth between vanilla wolfshanze mod and revolution wolfshanze mod. I like both experiences. The game as it stands now is fantastic and the flow of how the units transition is great.

As for the Trireme, could we not just bring it in with sailing? I have always felt that galleys didn't represent the very first sailing boats (that would be workboats from fishing) but rather advanced merchant ships like the Phoenician, or Greek ships that were capable of long distance trade. But by the time these types of vessels were around the Trireme was not far behind. So why not have Triemes come in with sailing but just make bonzeworking also a requirement for them?


Anyway I love this mod! its pretty much the only computer game I'm playing.

 

[Wolfshanze]

As for the Trireme, could we not just bring it in with sailing? I have always felt that galleys didn't represent the very first sailing boats (that would be workboats from fishing) but rather advanced merchant ships like the Phoenician, or Greek ships that were capable of long distance trade. But by the time these types of vessels were around the Trireme was not far behind. So why not have Triemes come in with sailing but just make bonzeworking also a requirement for them?

For multiple reasons... trust me, I ran every scenario with existing techs and was not happy with any of them...

First off, Sailing+Bronze Working for Triremes... I don't know about you, but in 99% of my games, I always prioritize researching Bronze Working before sailing. If that's the case with most people (even 55%-60%) then most people will have access to Triremes and Galleys simultaneously with a Sailing+Bronze Working for Triremes, which is NOT what I want.

Assigning Triremes to come with Iron or Metal Working is just too late and/or too expensive in my opinion.

I am a firm believer that Galleys should have a time-frame of their own... Triremes were not the first or simultaneous rulers of naval warfare in ancient times... Galleys of various sorts ruled the seas for a long time before Triremes entered the picture (remember, the game starts in 4,000 BC, not 400 BC). Just because Triremes were "Ancient" Warships, doesn't mean they were available in early ancient times. Supposedly Triremes didn't even appear until around 700 BC, The first definite reference to the use of triremes in naval combat dates to 525 BC. With the game starting in 4,000 BC, I don't think they should be the first ship available (once again, I think most folks develop bronze working before sailing anyways, and if not first, certainly very, very quickly and well-before 700 BC).

I don't add techs willy-nilly... I think these things through, and the question of Trireme placement has bugged me for a very long time, I've just never changed it because I've never been happy with any solution given the existing techs... I have a surprise in-store for adding a new tech that I think people will applaud, and once-again, give a boost to the fact the Wolfshanze Mod is the champion of naval warfare in Civ4. Don't fight this change... it's well thought-out and I have a method to my madness... remember, when it comes to the Wolfshanze Mod and ships...