The Capo
godless Heathen
Any progress on this glider?
[BtS] Super Spies
- Thread starter Trojan Sheep
- Start date
glider1
Deity
@Capo
Yeah thanks it is coming along but slowly. The real world is slowing progress down. The missions are working but the AI doesn't yet know how to properly use them in context with other espionage missions. When is it good to assassinate a great specialist? This is what the AI doesn't yet understand.
Cheers.
Yeah thanks it is coming along but slowly. The real world is slowing progress down. The missions are working but the AI doesn't yet know how to properly use them in context with other espionage missions. When is it good to assassinate a great specialist? This is what the AI doesn't yet understand.
Cheers.
The Capo
godless Heathen
Okay, sorry, I'm just being impatient. If you need help with anything let me know though, although my coding skills are quite limited.
Lord Tirian
Erratic Poster
Sorry for being sort of impatient... but how is it going, so far?
Cheers, LT.
Cheers, LT.
glider1
Deity
@Capo and Lord Tirian
Sorry for the lack of update. Super Spies has been released as a new version 1.3 but not here. It is merged into RevolutionDCM below. If you want to play Super Spies 1.3 but without the other components in RevolutionDCM, you can turn all of them off which would leave Super Spies on it's own. The components to turn off would be:
Revolutions
IDW
DCM
If you are still interested, I can show you how to turn them off. When I get time, I will try to release a straight version here without RevolutionDCM. However RevolutionDCM is taking most of my time with near 2000 downloads.
Super Spies 1.3 doesn't improve much except this:
1) Bribe mission (can bribe workers only) - AI aware as well
2) Assassinate mission (can kill great specialists) - AI aware as well
3) AI city poisoning rate reduced
4) Missions converted into standard BTS format
5) Missions can be turned off or on and controlled as per any other espionage mission.
Cheers.
Sorry for the lack of update. Super Spies has been released as a new version 1.3 but not here. It is merged into RevolutionDCM below. If you want to play Super Spies 1.3 but without the other components in RevolutionDCM, you can turn all of them off which would leave Super Spies on it's own. The components to turn off would be:
Revolutions
IDW
DCM
If you are still interested, I can show you how to turn them off. When I get time, I will try to release a straight version here without RevolutionDCM. However RevolutionDCM is taking most of my time with near 2000 downloads.
Super Spies 1.3 doesn't improve much except this:
1) Bribe mission (can bribe workers only) - AI aware as well
2) Assassinate mission (can kill great specialists) - AI aware as well
3) AI city poisoning rate reduced
4) Missions converted into standard BTS format
5) Missions can be turned off or on and controlled as per any other espionage mission.
Cheers.
Lord Tirian
Erratic Poster
Well, how well annotated is your source code, i.e. is it always clear what part belongs to Super Spies or not?
I'm mainly interested because I familiarise myself with the SDK and looking at the work other people have done is immensely helpful - plus I want to merge Super Spies into my own experimental mod, where I can play around with the dll.
Cheers, LT.
The Capo
godless Heathen
Ditto @ what LT said.
glider1
Deity
@Lord T and Capo
If you search the source SDK of RevolutionDCM, you will find two comments relevant to you: Tsheep and RevolutionDCM. Both have beginnings and ends commented and most if not all of the RevolutionDCM comments are to do with espionage code. The RevolutionDCM additions are not significant. If you want you, could take the Super Spies 1.23 version and go with that. You will not get the missions but the RevolutionDCM missions are just a tidy up and standardisation effort largely. Tsheeps assassinate mission had no AI awareness and was not in BTS format.
If you want to alter the rate of AI poisonings or other AI espionage activity, that's all in XML in assets/xml/gameinfo/espionagemissioninfos.xml. You could take my RevolutionDCM version of that file and compare with base BTS to see the differences.
I'm happy to answer any espionage mechanics questions here. I have spent a fair bit of time trying to get my head around the espionage engine.
Cheers.
If you search the source SDK of RevolutionDCM, you will find two comments relevant to you: Tsheep and RevolutionDCM. Both have beginnings and ends commented and most if not all of the RevolutionDCM comments are to do with espionage code. The RevolutionDCM additions are not significant. If you want you, could take the Super Spies 1.23 version and go with that. You will not get the missions but the RevolutionDCM missions are just a tidy up and standardisation effort largely. Tsheeps assassinate mission had no AI awareness and was not in BTS format.
If you want to alter the rate of AI poisonings or other AI espionage activity, that's all in XML in assets/xml/gameinfo/espionagemissioninfos.xml. You could take my RevolutionDCM version of that file and compare with base BTS to see the differences.
I'm happy to answer any espionage mechanics questions here. I have spent a fair bit of time trying to get my head around the espionage engine.
Cheers.
Lord Tirian
Erratic Poster
Well, concerning this, I do have a question - how do you make spy missions into the BTS format?
I thought I followed the trail of your code pretty well and got all your changes in the source code (as well as tsheeps), adjusted the xmls... until I tried it out in the game - where bribe and assassinate don't do anything - everything else works fine and bribe even calculates a cost and can get a spy caught... but it just does nothing except creating a pop-up saying that the mission is not available.
I have the feeling I missed something...
(by the way... if I do get this working, I'd gladly zip up my efforts as a stand-alone version so people can use it - if that's okay with you, of course)
Cheers, LT.
glider1
Deity
@Lord T
Yeah sounds like you have not turned the two missions on in the xml. Check out the readme for super spies 1.3 in: RevolutionDCM/docs/Super_Spies_readme.text under the heading "Missions" half way down the document. Here is the quote from that:
Assassination:
- a spy either human or AI, can assassinate a great specialist in a city.
The mission is disabled by default in order not to disturb game balance but can be re-enabled in CIV4EspionageMissionInfo.xml:
<iDestroyUnitCostFactor>1</iDestroyUnitCostFactor> under the assassination mission section.
The cost of the mission and other parameters such as probabilities of success can be changed as per any standard espionage mission in the same file.
Bribery
- a spy either human or AI, can bribe a single worker for an espionage cost.
The mission is disabled by default in order not to disturb game balance but can be re-enabled in CIV4EspionageMissionInfo.xml:
<iBuyUnitCostFactor>1</iBuyUnitCostFactor> under the bribery mission section.
The cost of the mission and other parameters such as probabilities of success can be changed as per any standard espionage mission in the same file.
Those two missions the AI understands and I think is actually balanced for game play ok, except that the purists that play RevolutionDCM don't want missions that change the espionage dynamics in any way. After all, being able to bribe a worker is pretty powerful, and being able to kill a great specialist is also potentially unbalancing if not set up right. The thing is those two missions can be controlled in the same way as any other espionage missions in the code. They herald the way for even more standardised missions for this mod in the future.
Cheers.
Yeah sounds like you have not turned the two missions on in the xml. Check out the readme for super spies 1.3 in: RevolutionDCM/docs/Super_Spies_readme.text under the heading "Missions" half way down the document. Here is the quote from that:
Assassination:
- a spy either human or AI, can assassinate a great specialist in a city.
The mission is disabled by default in order not to disturb game balance but can be re-enabled in CIV4EspionageMissionInfo.xml:
<iDestroyUnitCostFactor>1</iDestroyUnitCostFactor> under the assassination mission section.
The cost of the mission and other parameters such as probabilities of success can be changed as per any standard espionage mission in the same file.
Bribery
- a spy either human or AI, can bribe a single worker for an espionage cost.
The mission is disabled by default in order not to disturb game balance but can be re-enabled in CIV4EspionageMissionInfo.xml:
<iBuyUnitCostFactor>1</iBuyUnitCostFactor> under the bribery mission section.
The cost of the mission and other parameters such as probabilities of success can be changed as per any standard espionage mission in the same file.
Those two missions the AI understands and I think is actually balanced for game play ok, except that the purists that play RevolutionDCM don't want missions that change the espionage dynamics in any way. After all, being able to bribe a worker is pretty powerful, and being able to kill a great specialist is also potentially unbalancing if not set up right. The thing is those two missions can be controlled in the same way as any other espionage missions in the code. They herald the way for even more standardised missions for this mod in the future.
Cheers.
Lord Tirian
Erratic Poster
D'oh... talk about missing the obvious. Or RTFM.
But it worked, many thanks. Now... I'm off to fiddling around with the exact values!
Cheers, LT.
glider1
Deity
@LordT
I noticed in my experimentation that bribery seems about right in cost in the early game, but it's really hard to say what the effect of any of them are over many games played right through. Assassination could be problematic in that it's hard to say exactly how much worth a great specialist has contributed and will contribute. So far the AI conducts assassination vary rarely because the cost is pretty high, a bit like stealing a tech. Some say that the assassination mission is not fun. If you have any thoughts about it or other missions, express them here, this is the forum.
Cheers.
I noticed in my experimentation that bribery seems about right in cost in the early game, but it's really hard to say what the effect of any of them are over many games played right through. Assassination could be problematic in that it's hard to say exactly how much worth a great specialist has contributed and will contribute. So far the AI conducts assassination vary rarely because the cost is pretty high, a bit like stealing a tech. Some say that the assassination mission is not fun. If you have any thoughts about it or other missions, express them here, this is the forum.
Cheers.
Lord Tirian
Erratic Poster
Will certainly post it here, once I get time to actually play a bit more... but I can see why people think that the assassination isn't fun - because it's so hard to recuperate from that - once one is lost, it's possible that it will take a long time to get another great specialist again - plus some specialists you simply *have* to pop for other things (academy, holy shrine, corporations)... making the few specialists left worth even more.
Anyway, a side effect of my experimentation was that I'm pretty dissatisfied with the current promotion buttons... while the red makes them pretty distinct, it also makes them a bit weird compared to the other things (and it looks odd with the bluish overlay when a spy has that "promotion glow"). So I made a replacement pack with new buttons that look a bit more "civ" and aren't re-uses of current promotions.
Cheers, LT.
glider1
Deity
@Lord T
Thanks for the contribution!
Cheers.
Thanks for the contribution!
Cheers.
glider1
Deity
Thanks to Lord Tirian for making available a true standalone version of this great mod. 
Please head out to Lord Tirian's mod forum for all future discussions on TSheep's wonderful creation and how it can be improved even more.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=300992
Cheers.
Please head out to Lord Tirian's mod forum for all future discussions on TSheep's wonderful creation and how it can be improved even more.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=300992
Cheers.
cripp7
Playin' Bored
good work glider!!
The Capo
godless Heathen
Yeah, why hasn't this been updated to 3.19?
Afforess
The White Wizard
Probably because the creator is MIA. It's in RevDCM, and that works with 3.19.
