Building Research, Gold, or neither?
- Thread starter Scotas
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dirtyparrot
Upholding Brannigan's Law
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Quite often it does. It helps to take a larger bite than you normally would/could. Generally, building wealth is better than building gold, but there are certainly exceptions.
If the city in question has all the infrastructure it needs, and does not need to contribute with unit production then usually build wealth, this will help push the research slider up. The research coming through the slider goes through multipliers like library etc. however if you directly produce research it does not so better to produce wealth i guess.
In situations where i'm in danger of units going on strike etc. (I.e. my economy has tanked out) in the short run i may build wealth in some cities even without all infrastructure being complete just to stay afloat.
In situations where i'm in danger of units going on strike etc. (I.e. my economy has tanked out) in the short run i may build wealth in some cities even without all infrastructure being complete just to stay afloat.
A related question: how do I know how much infrastructure a given city "needs"? I understand that in, say, gold-producing cities, markets are of greater value, but does it still make sense to build everything in those cities? For instance, a jail or a spy agency adds value, but what about the opportunity cost of building that spy agency in lieu of building wealth? Is there are guide or any other kind of information that can assist in making those decisions?
Mcclaud
Chieftain
All of my cities get every building because I believe they all have a purpose.
Jails, Intelligence Agency's, Security Bureau's, etc work towards national security.
Markets, Mall's, Grocer's, Granary's, etc work towards providing food and increasing city health
Banks, Courthouses, Custom's Houses' etc work towards bringing higher income
Broadcast Towers, Theatres, Temples, etc work towards increasing Culture and increasing city happiness.
So yes, all buildings have a purpose, it doesn't matter what type of city you want to build, building everything in every city will increase your national Approval Rates, Life Expectancy, etc.
Also, make sure that when you are able to, build corporations into your cities. (provided you play BtS)
Jails, Intelligence Agency's, Security Bureau's, etc work towards national security.
Markets, Mall's, Grocer's, Granary's, etc work towards providing food and increasing city health
Banks, Courthouses, Custom's Houses' etc work towards bringing higher income
Broadcast Towers, Theatres, Temples, etc work towards increasing Culture and increasing city happiness.
So yes, all buildings have a purpose, it doesn't matter what type of city you want to build, building everything in every city will increase your national Approval Rates, Life Expectancy, etc.
Also, make sure that when you are able to, build corporations into your cities. (provided you play BtS)
Try to read some of the city specialisation articles. There are some buildings you should probably have in all cities like Granaries for example. Other buildings should be based on what the city is doing, if you have a city that is giving you a decent amount of research & production putting in buildings that boost both of these is fine.
Usually if your research slider is at the higher end of the spectrum 60% + priorities for your commerce cities should be Libraries / Monasteries / Universities / Laboratories etc.
All i can say is think about what you build, building something just cos you can is not the smartest move.
Sawney Bean
Chieftain
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Focus on your victory condition. By the time the spy buildings come along, you should know which victory type you are heading for.. Eg if aiming for conquest / dom, building wealth is only worthwhile if it enables you to get a military tech advantage - otherwise build units.
Building units instead of much of the above works towards winning the game.
^^^ Agree. If in doubt and i do not have too much of a problem with the economy, i would build units, but if is a city that is low in production maybe takes 10 turns to build one unit, i might set it to build wealth instead.
Always look at the city screen and figure out what your return on investment is, for example Banks cost quite a few hammers to produce, so if you have a production city that only generates 5 gold per turn is it worthwhile building a bank there for the extra 2.5 gold?
Always look at the city screen and figure out what your return on investment is, for example Banks cost quite a few hammers to produce, so if you have a production city that only generates 5 gold per turn is it worthwhile building a bank there for the extra 2.5 gold?
TheWilltoAct
I am observe
It is not strategically prudent (or a reasonable use of 
) to build every building in every city.
) to build every building in every city.Increasing national approval rates & life expectancy does not mean squat in terms of winning the game, example if a city is not getting close to the health threshhold i wont bother with a hospital, buildings that increase health & hapiness should only be built in cities that need them to keep growing without running into health/ hapiness issues.
With regard to corporations please read up on it in the stratergy articles section, from what i have learnt Sid's sushi & Mining Inc are pretty useful corporations but the rest kind of suck.
TheWilltoAct
I am observe
One method I try to use to judge whether something is worthwhile to build or not, is to think about how many turns it will take before my
investment will pay off. The most direct example would be deciding whether or not to build a forge. It will cost 120 which is a lot (at least to me, I'm still rather a noob 
), and it improves production by 25%. Well if I have a city that generates say 10 the forge will net me an additional 2.5 . Ignoring the opportunity cost of what I could have used those hammers on (perhaps a few military units) we can crudely calculate that we will recoop our hammers in (120/2.5) = 48 turns. Hope that's of some help, at least as one example of how to think about the most appropriate item to build.
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This is an informative thread. I've just recently become aware of the value in building wealth, research or, in certain situations culture. I've been building research a lot now and have been able to get an advantage at least on the Noble level, which I'm now winning on finally. However, I can now see the advantage of building wealth. Building research is powerful to an extent, but I see that it doesn't allow one to keep the research slider high if your economy is weak. I'm going to try the building wealth approach. The funny thing is, I'm just realizing that it was hammers that feed the build as opposed to say commerce. I'd flip the to build on my high commerce cottage or specialist cities.
This oversight does lead to a question though. If building wealth/research is reliant on hammers then it seems that "production" cities would be the focus. However, my production cities usually focus on continued production of units or wonders (in some cases). So my question is, do folks set up production cities for the specific purpose of building wealth or research? I realize one can do this in any city for some gain, especially during peace time when there's nothing to build. So I guess, an additional question is what is the timing to your approach to building wealth/research? What's optimal from a timing perspective. (I'm trying to figure this out as I try to move up in difficulty)
As for buildings, I used to build pretty much everything in each city. I'm now trying to focus more on specializing my cities. I guess the big difference or confusion for me is between the early, mid and late game. I realize buildings like granaries are important and I think libraries should go in each city not so much just for the research boost and scientists, but the culture is helpful. Sometimes I build them in lieu of monuments. However, I have a hard time in the late game. I guess this is primarily do to my difficulty in ironing out my victory conditions generally. I feel like I really stagnate late in the game and just build things for the heck of it. I probably need some help with deciding which victory condition to pursue - the when and why. Wow, this game is complex.
This oversight does lead to a question though. If building wealth/research is reliant on hammers then it seems that "production" cities would be the focus. However, my production cities usually focus on continued production of units or wonders (in some cases). So my question is, do folks set up production cities for the specific purpose of building wealth or research? I realize one can do this in any city for some gain, especially during peace time when there's nothing to build. So I guess, an additional question is what is the timing to your approach to building wealth/research? What's optimal from a timing perspective. (I'm trying to figure this out as I try to move up in difficulty)
As for buildings, I used to build pretty much everything in each city. I'm now trying to focus more on specializing my cities. I guess the big difference or confusion for me is between the early, mid and late game. I realize buildings like granaries are important and I think libraries should go in each city not so much just for the research boost and scientists, but the culture is helpful. Sometimes I build them in lieu of monuments. However, I have a hard time in the late game. I guess this is primarily do to my difficulty in ironing out my victory conditions generally. I feel like I really stagnate late in the game and just build things for the heck of it. I probably need some help with deciding which victory condition to pursue - the when and why. Wow, this game is complex.
@ lymond - I'm no expert, so i'll just tell you how i do it. I dont usually plan to build wealth, i tend to do it in one of the following situations,
1) Nothing more useful to build in a city, like i said earlier in the thread no point building things if they are not going to be needed or if the return is margnal, so in these cases whichever cities that have nothing useful to build, will build wealth, they maybe production or commerce cities. (usually though my production cities are fairly busy making units for war, so it's mostly commerce cities that build wealth for me)
2) My economy is in serious trouble, and i need some help until the effect of the cottages start kicking in, this is more like an SOS tactic for a short period of time until my economy recovers, and in these cases i get one or more of my production cities to build wealth, since as you rightly said production cities will net you more wealth from the higher number of hammers they generate per turn.
1) Nothing more useful to build in a city, like i said earlier in the thread no point building things if they are not going to be needed or if the return is margnal, so in these cases whichever cities that have nothing useful to build, will build wealth, they maybe production or commerce cities. (usually though my production cities are fairly busy making units for war, so it's mostly commerce cities that build wealth for me)
2) My economy is in serious trouble, and i need some help until the effect of the cottages start kicking in, this is more like an SOS tactic for a short period of time until my economy recovers, and in these cases i get one or more of my production cities to build wealth, since as you rightly said production cities will net you more wealth from the higher number of hammers they generate per turn.
@Mcclaud
Building infrastructure is good when it's needed, otherwise is just wasted hammers. That could have been research/gold or units(!) and plenty of them.
Granaries, libraries and forges are usually needed in the 1st cities to help whip universities as fast as possible.
Other stuff like AP monasteries/temples is good too but building jails just b/c of EP is non-sense, they are good for the war-weariness but unless trying to have some real use of EP is just stupid to build them.
Building banks is good in quite a lot of cases but if there is no commerce/gold in the city, one would be better off building wealth instead. There is immediate effect and much better.
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Research is built in very few cases: racing for a tech and knowing shaving off a turn when the slider is at max already. And no "currency", yet, thus no way to build wealth to reach the "currency" quickly.
Building infrastructure is good when it's needed, otherwise is just wasted hammers. That could have been research/gold or units(!) and plenty of them.
Granaries, libraries and forges are usually needed in the 1st cities to help whip universities as fast as possible.
Other stuff like AP monasteries/temples is good too but building jails just b/c of EP is non-sense, they are good for the war-weariness but unless trying to have some real use of EP is just stupid to build them.
Building banks is good in quite a lot of cases but if there is no commerce/gold in the city, one would be better off building wealth instead. There is immediate effect and much better.
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Research is built in very few cases: racing for a tech and knowing shaving off a turn when the slider is at max already. And no "currency", yet, thus no way to build wealth to reach the "currency" quickly.
TheWilltoAct
I am observe
In short: no. If the city is generating very few 
then you will get a very poor return on your investment. The idea of city specialization applies here: this means, in essence, that you should build buildings that help your city do what it does best naturally, not try to turn the city into something it isn't meant to be. If done properly you will save an untold number of and the game will just make more sense to you too I think. 
then you will get a very poor return on your investment. The idea of city specialization applies here: this means, in essence, that you should build buildings that help your city do what it does best naturally, not try to turn the city into something it isn't meant to be. If done properly you will save an untold number of and the game will just make more sense to you too I think. 
No. Only the hammer multipliers. Whenver you build culture, wealth or research, only the hammer multipliers can count.
binhthuy71
Emperor
It helps me to take the "Examine City" option when it comes time to decide what to build next. Over time, newly researched techs, civics changes, expanding or contracting cultural boundaries, tile improvements, etc., can interact to change the balance of a city's strengths - at least outside of my specialized cities.
I rarely switch a city to building Wealth, Research or Culture because it appears that hammers don't translate into gold, beakers or culture points on a one-to-one basis.
I rarely switch a city to building Wealth, Research or Culture because it appears that hammers don't translate into gold, beakers or culture points on a one-to-one basis.
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