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C2C - UEM - Ultimate Earth Map 100% MOD and SVN update compatible by Pit2015

Discussion in 'Maps & Scenarios' started by Pit2015, Sep 25, 2015.

  1. Blazenclaw

    Blazenclaw eccentric eclectic

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    Should've scrolled up.... yeah, that would do it.
     
  2. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    Yes economy problems caused by my hard expansion, thats normal. :thumbsup: Meens challenging game now, thats good.
     
    JosEPh_II and Blazenclaw like this.
  3. Thunderbrd

    Thunderbrd C2C War Dog

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    I feel that's really a trap use of Generals... a way to get the absolute least you can out of one.
     
  4. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    If AI use some great general commanders it will make the AI harder, also AI puts all great hunters into city for food now, AI should build some great hunters units with it again. AI use field commanders sometimes but dont builds great hunter units now as it looks like. AI puts them into citys. Will make the AI even harder if they use great hunters better again and put 50% generals to warlord unit commanders and the rest to field commanders. If the AI use warlord unit commanders then its to rare, AI should be teached that.

    @Thunderbrd Ok i looked deeper into the AI, so the problem is that all of the AI get a lot of great hunters and low generals points, because they use primary hunters to hunt so AI gets to less generals.

    Complete great hunter/generals system should be done better, meens if you have enouth points from hunting then you should be able to select if you get a general or a great hunter. Then the AI will become much stronger if they use more generals better. Or better get 1 hunter then one general, AI gets only hunters mostly all the time because they dont use much military units to hunt. Thats the problem. AI will get 95% only great hunters and no generals, becaus AI creates mostly great hunter points.

    Also AI puts all great hunters into city now, same for all citys look screenshot here... AI dont use great hunters anymore for hunting.

    So let me know if you will change that system and teach AI to use and get more generals better to get hard units or not. If not i will remove the option from scenario to make the scenario harder, this way the gamer can easyly conquer all AI because AI will never have good generals unit to counter. But generals gameplay is very cool.

    So change the system from random great hunter/general to auto +1 great general then +1 great hunter if enouth points done. So the AI will get some generals and then the AI needs to use it for field commanders and sometimes in one of its best unit as direct unit commander to get powerfull units. Also AI needs to use great hunters as hunters again.

    So no more great hunter/generals points from hunting by different units, only one points for all then, automatic... if you have enouth points then you get one general, if you have again enouth points then you get a great hunter... if you have enouth points again then you get a general again, will give the AI also generals.


    Rest AI stuff works good now, but this will make the AI much stronger and harder.

    @Thunderbrd @Toffer90 So guys let me know if you will change that combat points system so all gets one great general and then one great hunter then again one greate general and so on, so the AI will get some generals, also and let me know if you will make the AI use generals as field commanders and strong unit commanders or not, otherwise i will turn the option off, will make the game less interesting because generals and there promotions are very cool, AI needs to get generals and use them, AI should not put them into city and AI should not be able to put great hunters into a city, maybe best is to remove the put in of great generals and great hunters completly from citys. Then i will start a new game, otherwise i will remove the option to make the game harder and the AI able to resist.

    AI has to create and use more generals and use them as field and unit commanders, unsing great hunters for +5 food in city sucks. AI creates 95% great hunters, AI needs to create 90% generals and 10% great hunters as they produce enouth normal hunters already.
     

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    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  5. Yudishtira

    Yudishtira Spiritual/Creative

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    I love field commanders but stopped using the option because of how much of an advantage they give the player over... everyone else. Even without field commanders on, it is still basically never the best play to put a Great General on a unit. Your idea to force the AI to do this would make them worse not better.

    I love the current elegant system whereby you get GG points from using military, GH points for using hunters, etc. I strongly disagree with changing it.

    The only thing I agree with you about, is that the AI code for these kinds of decisions is woeful. I would think that, given how bad it is currently, it should be quite easy to improve. Tbrd assures us however that AI coding is of the highest difficulty at all times, and I suppose I have to defer to that. I am still curious as to how MattCA would find it if he delved into some of the worst of the AI code as we have here.
     
    MattCA likes this.
  6. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    Well if the gamer can have much more stronger units then the AI with unit commanders it will make the AI suck always, so there must be a change. If you dont use field commanders then you can use the great general as unit commander and you wil have a unit that the AI cant resist. (With turning off field commanders, still unit great generals possible?) I can conquer everything slow with one elite general unit. Also turning off field commanders suck, so changing the system a bit and giving more great generals to AI should work and the AI will have also great general units also field commanders option will work.

    If the AI code can be changed to make the AI use more unit great generals and more field commanders and create more great generals then only mostly great hunters that may work, but will be hard, if you get great generals from combats and next a great hunter is not a big change but ensures the AI gets great generals also.

    Problem here is the gamer can have super elite units with great general units (Direct command of a unit by great general), the AI will never have them, so AI will mostly never can resist these units.

    AI use field commanders, so thats fair, but AI dont use great general elite units. (Direct command of a unit by great general) Because they dont use them and because they dont get enouth great generals, only mostly great hunters.

    Unsure what @MattCA can do there, but system needs to changed a bit because AI gets 90% only great hunters and wasting them, AI needs alot of more great generals.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  7. Toffer90

    Toffer90 C2C Modder

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    We're going to have great admirals and great aviators too, a nation who barely have a navy shouldn't get as many admirals as a GB-like navy-nation, same goes for air force.
    A nation that hunt a lot get a lot of great hunters, those that fight a lot of land war with barbs/neanders or other nations get great generals. This won't be changed.
    Only viable change I can see is to make the enemy unit type decide what kind of experience your unit get from defeating it. Though TB was quite adamant about having it the other way when I last brought it up, and I see his point about it.

    P.S. Better AI in general is the solution to this issue, not sweeping rule changes to this mechanic
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  8. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    Point is if the gamer can have unit generals and so elite general units (LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD) the AI should be able to have them also or the gamer dont should have them if the AI dont has them.

    You ever saw the AI use LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD ? ANYONE SAW THE AI DO IT? Looks like AI is not doing that or dont gets enouth great generals for it. Sometimes i see the AI use field commanders but not LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD.

    Great admirals and aviators sounds good.

    Edit:

    One more possibility will be to keep field commanders but remove LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD completely. LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD units will put the AI into big disadvantage because AI is not using this strong units.

    Otherwise AI needs to use LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD units and AI needs a way to create more great generals.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  9. Toffer90

    Toffer90 C2C Modder

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    We are in agreement then, better AI in general is the solution to this problem. lol
     
  10. Thunderbrd

    Thunderbrd C2C War Dog

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    It's not as common because they build so many hunter stacks already that they can't get as much benefit out of the Master Hunters as a player who holds back some. I think it's still, or should still be possible that they do sometimes use Master Hunter options. It was when I last played.

    I am definitely not going to change the way GMPs are awarded as I find it's a great middle range between picking what you get and random. Quite proud of how it works actually. The AI MAY be a bit more inspired to use less full on explorer units for hunting soon though.

    'LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD.' is a trap option that sucks. You are FAR better off planting the Warlord as an XP generator in your military production city. These units aren't powerful enough to warrant such a wasted use but if you feel you benefit from that as a player... great use it.

    However, they should be using them more as field commanders but part of the problem is that the coding for armies coming together is still a bit wonky and they almost had to be completely stopped from doing this because they were too happy to send them out with small hunting parties to be easy kills for ambushers and stalkers.

    This issue will get some AI improvements when programming for the unit plans taking place gets going.
     
  11. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    Yes if possible. :goodjob:

    Is there a way or option to disable LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD? Otherwise will be cool to get such an option, otherwise the AI will be killed to easy.

    So letz say i do a extra hard mod for UEM, how to disable LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD button? So great generals are only useable as field commanders, not anymore as unit warlord commanders, will make the game harder.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  12. Toffer90

    Toffer90 C2C Modder

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    I think you can do it easily by removing <LeaderPromotion>PROMOTION_LEADER</LeaderPromotion> from the <Type>UNIT_GREAT_GENERAL</Type> entry in unitinfo xml
     
  13. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    Ok i will update UEM:

    Changes:

    I will remove the option "Field Commanders" from UEM because AI sucks at using them and gives the gamer to much advantage over the AI.

    LEAD TROOPS AS WARLORD should be ok, its not soooo a big impact without field commanders.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  14. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    RELEASED: C2C - Ultimate Earth Map V5.0 100% MOD and SVN update compatible.

    Changes in C2C - Ultimate Earth Map V5.0 100% MOD and SVN update compatible:
    Removed the option "Field Commanders" from UEM because AI sucks at using them and gives the gamer to much advantage over the AI, makes the game harder.
    Added Advanced Economy: Allows for inflation and some decimalized values in the economy, as well as some deeper stuff with trade.
    Added Upscaled Research Time: Technology costs have been increased by 40%. Better for the large UEM map because of more research produced later in game and you have to use your units a bit and techs are really worth something now.
    Added more caves to the map far away from citys on map so cave lions and cave bears can spawn.

    Download at first posting here:

    https://forums.civfanatics.com/thre...-and-svn-update-compatible-by-pit2015.552901/

    Have fun - Pit
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2020
  15. JosEPh_II

    JosEPh_II TBS WarLord

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    I d/l'd your latest version Pit.

    But there has been changes made in Civics in particular the Government Category that you will see with the latest version of C2C. Also Toffer just made changes to Anarchy length by Game Speed as well. ;)
    Might want to check these changes out.
     
  16. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    Yes i started a new game now with latest SVN. :)
     
  17. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    BUG/PROBLEM:

    @Toffer90 and others... Neanderthal health display bug still in sometimes, screenshot and savegame to fix it. (Unit is fully healed but green bar dont displays it correctly.)

    Also good new Neanderthal documentation with new knowledge, you can turn on subtitels in youtube.

     

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  18. Thunderbrd

    Thunderbrd C2C War Dog

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  19. raxo2222

    raxo2222 Time Traveller

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  20. Pit2015

    Pit2015 Emperor

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    TV station did not... not me. :) You cant watch it outside of europe?

    How can I watch YouTube videos outside my region?
    4 Ways to Watch Blocked YouTube Videos in Your Country
    1. Proxy. A web proxy is a computer in a remote location that acts as a mediator between a client computer and the Internet. ...
    2. SmartDNS. When surfing the Internet, a SmartDNS is will spoof your location by redirecting your traffic through different servers just the way proxies do. ...
    3. VPNs. ...
    4. Download Youtube Videos.
    Also: You can try open it in youtube directly not here in forum, maybe works.
     

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