C2C - Units

Yes to have each one as a building gets round the very real problem I have of preventing prebuilds. It's just I was hoping to avoid it because it's very unrealistic...

Just because you learn weaving doesn't mean you automatically have Slings.
Just because you know woodworking doesn't mean you automatically know how to build Rafts.
Click to expand...

I agree that Slings should maybe use my new mechanism. ;)

And Rafts already do have their own tech.
 
Would you build an inventor or would you have to wait for one to birth? We'd need AI for this or the AI player would be hurt by the added step significantly. And how would this differ from say simply adding a deadend tech off of the ones that don't seem to sufficiently incorporate the 'invention'?
 
Thunderbrd said:
Obsidian is one of those resources that should be able to give your civ a huge edge in this era (and doesn't do all that much for you later in the game) so if you are lucky enough to have it, why not allow you to dominate easily? You'll find it plays out very differently if you DON'T have obsidian and the atlatls are going to be quite tough to take down with the stone wielding melee you've got.
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Yeah and in another game I had elephants instead so it was even easier... and stone for neanderthals previously... The atlatls were for a (really unlucky) defending civilization or barbarian city which had nothing of that.
At least they should get higher city defense now. That gives some challenge when conquering cities. But C2C is now too easy with all that new mess and free specialists anyway...
 
Thunderbrd said:
Would you build an inventor or would you have to wait for one to birth? We'd need AI for this or the AI player would be hurt by the added step significantly. And how would this differ from say simply adding a deadend tech off of the ones that don't seem to sufficiently incorporate the 'invention'?
Click to expand...

1. You would build the Inventor, but he would not be unlocked until there was something to invent. (This is to prevent you prebuilding him.)

2. I thought there was a taboo against deadend techs. That would work yes, probably better than the unit, especially if the AI is better able to adapt to it.
 
Rodnok said:
Yeah and in another game I had elephants instead so it was even easier... and stone for neanderthals previously... The atlatls were for a (really unlucky) defending civilization or barbarian city which had nothing of that.
At least they should get higher city defense now. That gives some challenge when conquering cities. But C2C is now too easy with all that new mess and free specialists anyway...
Click to expand...

I won't discount your claim. However, we waited for a number of people to say it was getting too hard to take cities before we made adjustments that made things easier and now that we have we're hearing it's gotten too easy. I'm going to wait until others concur before reacting.

Particularly with city defense levels on throwing units also being a measured gradient from one upgrade to the next - if one gets changed the whole web of them should be adjusted.

I don't think we've changed the tech prereqs for city raider either so there's still that going for city defenders.

One thing that would make it easier for them in regards to those elephants... if the ai would make sure to build a spear unit or two for each city that would make it a bit tougher to dominate with riding units.
 
Yudishtira said:
1. You would build the Inventor, but he would not be unlocked until there was something to invent. (This is to prevent you prebuilding him.)

2. I thought there was a taboo against deadend techs. That would work yes, probably better than the unit, especially if the AI is better able to adapt to it.
Click to expand...

I personally like dead end and alternative path techs... I think they're cool because they can be skipped if the situation doesn't demand it, which I think a number of technologies were for real world developing civilizations.
 
Thunderbrd said:
I personally like dead end and alternative path techs... I think they're cool because they can be skipped if the situation doesn't demand it, which I think a number of technologies were for real world developing civilizations.
Click to expand...

We had this discussion if we shouldn't add so much dead end techs that you can't research them all (without falling behind too far) and need to make choices of what you really need. Like a "all Chariots get +20% str" tech.
But before we consider it, we should fix the AI so it doesn't research useless dead end techs anymore (like it does with already founded Religions or "wonder is build" Punk techs.
 
We have discussed dead end techs before. I too like them where appropriate. I also dislike the idea that you have to study every tech to get to the end of the tech tree. An historical example of a people skipping techs is the Nok of Africa, they went from stone tools to iron tools and weapons, skipping the whole copper/bronze stage. They traded for the iron techs and had iron but little or no copper.

Remember it is possible to limit a tech by having it require a building somewhere in your nation before it can be studied. So you could have a tech "Advanced Chariots" require a "Chariot Workshop" somewhere. Make the tech not able to be traded and the AI wont be able to waist time or resources on something it can't use.
 
I did use it but on such an important tech that it broke the game - Dog Domestication required the Wolf/Dog Myth for a very short while. :D
 
@Yudishtira

Carroballista
Graphic: Here
Icon: ?
Type: Same as War Wagon
Strength: 7
Movement: 2
Cost: 100
Req Tech: Ancient Ballistics
Req Resource: Horses AND (Copper Wares OR Bronze Wares OR Iron Wares)
Req Building: Siege Workshop
Upgrades To: War Wagon

Special Abilities

  • Same as War Wagon

Note: Use War Wagon as a Base.

---

Also could you change the Chariot to upgrade into the Carroballista instead of the War Wagon?

Should be like this ...

Early Chariot (4) -> Chariot (6) -> Carroballista (7) -> War Wagon (8) -> Siege Wagon (16) -> Armored Car (36) -> Humvee (55) -> ACV (80)

Thanks! :goodjob:
 
Hydromancerx said:
Also could you change the Chariot to upgrade into the Carroballista instead of the War Wagon?
Click to expand...

Same for the War Chariot and the Hittite Chariot I suppose?

Can/Do I do this in the module or in the main UnitInfos?
 
Also... please take note that I'm officially requesting that anytime a new unit is added, the creator notes that in the new Unit Review thread!
 
Yudishtira said:
Same for the War Chariot and the Hittite Chariot I suppose?

Can/Do I do this in the module or in the main UnitInfos?
Click to expand...

1. I forgot about those. Yeah and the Shang Chariot too.

2. The new unit should be in the module and the changes to the other chariots should be in the core or wherever else they are located.
 
Big Problem: the Carroballista model is mounted on an elephant...

ETA: I realize the pic and description on the download page say horse-drawn. There are 'horse' ddses in the download, but the nifs are all elephants.
 
So I was looking though the game Stronghold 2 for siege defenses and also found this ...

burningcart.jpg


Burning Carts
Sort of like pitch on wheels. These are expensive, 100 gold each, but can be very effective against siege engines and advancing light troops. They are very fast, but are easily taken down by enemy missile fire. Keep them away from archers at all costs. They function best working with some hardy ground troops and archers. In this mission, however, they can get by without much support until the very end. To train them you need an engineer's guild and a siege camp.
Click to expand...

This seems to be the land equivalent of Fire Ships. Anyone have ideas for stats, what unit to use? Al I know it would be a one time use unit.
 
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