C3C Civilizations?

[Beanzy]

I'm hopin' to see the Parthians. They'd have a nice horse-archer unit (maybe a 2/1/3 instead of a horseman?). They could also use another African nation. Maybe Boers or Berbers (though the Berbers would be right on top of Carthage in the world map, and the Boers would have to encroach on Zulu territory. In case I'm wrong about that though, keep in mind, I haven't done African histroy for a while... )

 

[Ribannah]

The Boers are a small part of the Dutch civilization (some emigrated farmers, joined by a few from other countries. Afrikaans is a Dutch dialect, close to Gronings).

It always amazes me when people suggest to include the Boers but have never thought of including (all of) the Dutch, who were world leader for over a century, explored the world, made a lot of scientific discoveries, started the Mercantile Revolution that eventually lead to the Industrial Revolution, and are still among the world's top nations.

 

[nalves]

The Portuguese .... Traits : Industrious and Religious.
UU: An ICBM that destroy cities to the ground


Wath?! ... if I am Portuguese .... ... noooooo

 

[ERIKK]

Originally posted by Ribannah
It always amazes me when people suggest to include the Boers but have never thought of including (all of) the Dutch, who were world leader for over a century, explored the world, made a lot of scientific discoveries, started the Mercantile Revolution that eventually lead to the Industrial Revolution, and are still among the world's top nations.

Well, what do you mean with a top nation. The Dutch have close to none influence in the worlds politics. They only have "some" economic power through their multinationals and their hugh GNP (#8th of the world IIRC). It's very simple: we are just a small but rich country!

About our history: yeah, based on our history you can add the Dutch as a civilization. But if you want to add the Netherlands as a civilization you should add the Potuguese too IMO. I dont know if Atari wants to add two more European civilizations in their game...

 

[Ribannah]

You forgot to mention that Rotterdam has the world's number one port.

Economics form one of the most essential parts of the game.

However, you can also find Dutch military all over the world on peace missions (which today are IMHO more important than the wars that precede them), The Netherlands house several international courts, lead the EU bank, and excel at both science and diplomacy (they consistently manage to keep friendly relationships with both sides of a conflict).

All of this comes atop the magnificent Dutch history, which I think is already a lot richer than Portugal's.

But nooo ... let's just take a small group of Dutch farmers and promote them to a civilization instead.

 

[nalves]

Hy Ribannah

Have you ever heard of the tordesilhas treaty,
or the nationality of the pope John XXI, or even who were the firsts civs to explore the world from Europe.

Yes, of course Portugal is just a smal county today, but in terms of history is a "very rich" country - a civilization.

And yes I agree that Holland is and were very great too.

 

[ERIKK]

Hehehehe,

yeah the Portuguese were the first to sail to East Asia and had that pepper monoploy until they kicked out by the Dutch!!!

 

[nalves]

not only by the dutch

But my point isn't about Portugal be a great civilization. Portugal was a great civilization for some time. and more important than that with spain they "sail the world".
The first ship to sail around the world was portuguese. The first to arrive India by sea was Portuguese, and in that time was a major discovery .
The Dutch arrive firts to where .... Holland


If you talk in terms of military strenght or comercial strenght, then I agree you you and say GO HOLLAND

 

[SuperBeaverInc.]

Adding the Boers would be silly. They were a bunch of Dutch farmers in South Africa and married a bunch of Germans. That would be like adding Oklahoma . As for the Portugese/Dutch thing, they would both be good candidates. The Dutch had colonies throughout the world including Indonesia and Nieuw Amsterdam.(Which later was traded for Guyana to the British and became New York City.) By the mid-17th century the Netherlands was the foremost commercial and maritime power of Europe, and Amsterdam was the financial center of the Continent. As for Portugal, they had a large portion of the worlds rubber in Brazil(Until the British stole it and took some to Malaysia). The Portuguese occupied Goa, India, in 1510, and Malacca in 1511, allowing for a monopoly on trade with China and the rest of the Far East. They also started relations with the African nation of Ethiopia.

 

[Beanzy]

The necessity for the Boers doesn't have to do so much with their achievements (or lack of achievements) it simply has to do with the fact that the game needs more African nations. The Boers are just easy candidates mainly becasue they are fairly well known. As for Portugese/Dutch, sure, it'd be nice to include both, but don't you think Europe is getting a bit crowded? I mean, with Ancient and Modern civilization there, it'll probably be getting hard to cram in a few more.

 

[SuperBeaverInc.]

Europe is already really crowded so they probably wouln't get any additional Civs. Most of the civs will probably end up in Africa, Asia, and South/Central America. Someone like Ghana, Ethiopia, or possible even Kongo will be chosen. Not the Boers. All they did was get conquered by the British.

 

[Ribannah]

Originally posted by Beanzy
The necessity for the Boers doesn't have to do so much with their achievements (or lack of achievements) it simply has to do with the fact that the game needs more African nations. The Boers are just easy candidates mainly becasue they are fairly well known.

You can use the Dutch in an African scenario, they didn't go to Boerland only but settled in other African territory as well.

But there are a few great native African civs to choose from, too, like Ethiopia, Mali, Nubia, Zimbabwe. They were all far more important to Africa than the Boers.

As for Portugese/Dutch, sure, it'd be nice to include both, but don't you think Europe is getting a bit crowded? I mean, with Ancient and Modern civilization there, it'll probably be getting hard to cram in a few more.

I would like to have them both, too. The argument that Europe is getting crowded is not valid since we can't play with more than 31 civs at a time anyway. The argument that it would be nice to have civs form all over the world is though, so if it were up to me I would put just one European civ (the Dutch) in Conquests.

I am, however, hoping that there will be more expansions.

 

[steviejay]

what about the Holy Roman Empire or the Austro-Hungarian Empire (Hasburg Empire)?

 

[steviejay]

ok, just want to say oops. I suggested the Austro-Hungarian Empire and its already been discussed previous, so I appologise for repeating someone else and also.....

Originally posted by Jove
I urge everyone to not purchase the expansion until the producers can truthfully claim that the AI has been significantly improved. So, SteveAtari, Yes or No, is it?

No way Jove!! I'll be dammed if I'm not one of the first people to get my hands on the new expansion pack when it comes out where I am!! Ok the AI is "sometimes" not that bright (the way they load transports for one) but name me one computer game that’s been invented where the AI has been perfect in every sense? To the best of my knowledge none because Artificial Intelligence hasn’t been fully mastered yet. So you can’t expect perfect.

 

[Vietcong]

Originally posted by nebuchadnezzar
i don't know why u think Hittites as "militaristic"?
as i know, hittites were very religious. how do i know this?
the only crime that death penalty was given was religious crimes. even you kill a king, you could have a chance to save your life, but noone could steal a dirt from a temple.. then you would say bye bye to your momma.. (stone writings tell that)
industrious may be or commercial..
with the unique unit a chariot ( i know egyptians have it) but needs iron and/or powerful on defence.. (hittites were the "iron man", the best iron workers of that time were that of hittites.)

ther was this one civilazation that punished EVERY thing with death.. so it dint mater what u did. becuss u wher dead any way.. wheather it was j walking ;D or killing the king lol thats my civ!!

 

[steviejay]

ther was this one civilazation that punished EVERY thing with death.. so it dint mater what u did. becuss u wher dead any way.. wheather it was j walking ;D or killing the king lol thats my civ!!

I'll bet that's one Civ that has the best school's ever....

"I'm sorry Timmy but 4 x 1 is actually 4... SIEZE HIM”

 

[steviejay]

this may sound stupid but I need to ask. on talking about the new Civ's more or less everytime Isreal is mentioned there is a

" <Text Deleted> "

in blue. Ok, I'm not dense enough to think that it means anything other than the obvious but my question is why is text getting deleted? is it anti-semetic or something?

 

[steviejay]

I agree that the Vietnamese (or Viet Cong) should be in the game, their UU could be an upgraded version of the rather annoylingly pointless (in my opinion) Gurilla

edit: sorry forgot to add something (and I didn't want to put it in a new post cause I've made way to many on this thread) how about the Normans?? pre-France Civ, conquered England from the Saxon's. and you can't doubt their historical or cultural value. they more or less shaped the way Britain is today

 

[steviejay]

Originally posted by Vietcong
ethiopia[thay got the zulu so y not?? thay wehr a very stong civ for a while and beat the italians in the 1870's and becus of that no other nation whold dare try to take over it agin until 1936]

I think that was because (no offence intended) no one wanted it. Its recources were limited and the Italians only wanted it because it was one of only a few places left. And it was the Itallians who tried again in 1936 and they won only due because of a HUGE advantage in weaponry, using every form of modern warfare they had (tanks, bombers, I might even be right in saying they used poison gas, but I'd need to check my history books on that one)

So I'm all for the Ethiopians getting an honoured place amongst the Civ's in C3C.

 

[SuperBeaverInc.]

using every form of modern warfare they had (tanks,

Well then, they obviously weren't using spears, or they would have beaten them easily