Caveman 2 Cosmos (ideas/discussions thread)

[Hydromancerx]

What's a furphy?

I did not know what it ment either ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Furphy

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

I did not know what it ment either ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Furphy

You just missed my posting of kelp.

 

[Hydromancerx]

@strategyonly

I did not out all i wanted in this update but I thought i better do an update soon. I can put some more buildings in next time.

HydroC2C17d Changes
- Added Brick Mason and Cheese Shop.
- Added 4 New "Goods".
- Tweaked existing buildings to support the new "Goods".
- Added 8 Fossil Bonus Resources.
- Strategyonly's NIF Fixes.
- Other Minor Fixes.

Note: Requires DH's Walrus and Seal resources plus the newer tech tree. Intended for strategyonly.

You just missed my posting of kelp.

Awesome! I will have to go check it out then.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Edit: yes the changes to jungle camps are in v12. And now for something completely experimental Kelp. This is a coastal feature its file goes in the Assets/Modules/Resources for now. I need feedback on this one as it may be OP as is, but has the potential for more buildings and mprovements.

As side from the weird clown icon the kelp seems cool. I think its a greatly needed addition to the ocean since it was greatly neglected in vanilla.

 

[strategyonly]

Hi! I just downloaded C2C v12 and had a go. But for some reason everything on the screen is black except some trees and my units. It looks like graphics isnt there. And when I move around with my unit it just moves around in the black. Nothing is revealed or anything.

Anyone experienced this before??? I have tried several times and with different maps too.

First off this should be in the Modpack thread, as its really nothing to do with ideas. Now having said that, YES i have noticed this also, once in awhile, i found out it has to do with (and still testing) the Custom Leaderheads, i am trying to figure out which one is causing this, but its hard, because sometimes i take out a LH and the terrain comes back, but then next time i re-start my PC its black again so it wasn't that LH, so i delete another one, and terrain is back again, weird stuff, but if you dont EVER want the black terrain for now just delete ALL the Custom Leaderheads.

@DH:

Have the attached error:

should read:

z_experimental

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

As side from the weird clown icon the kelp seems cool. I think its a greatly needed addition to the ocean since it was greatly neglected in vanilla.

I could not find a button. You should see the "rubber duckies" I use fr unit graphics.

 

[strategyonly]

I could not find a button. You should see the "rubber duckies" I use fr unit graphics.

Here i made this:

 

[Hydromancerx]

@Dancing Hoskuld

I made you a better Kelp icon/button and also added a Coral Reef and Walrus Totem (in case you ever have a subduable walrus). I still have not found a Totem icon/button for the Gorilla, Orangutan, or Rhino. But I did find a Hippo one if you want it.

EDIT: I found a Camel Totem. I re-uploaded the icons. Make sure it has the camel icon in it. Now the "Myth of the Camel" won't have to look like a wolf anymore.

 

[Talin2009]

Once the maintenance rework is complete we can look at specifically unbalancing gold system elements and ways to fix those unbalancing sources. I suspect we may want to re-evaluate the religions and make them not so gold-centric all around. They are emerging as a neat way to specialize the empire - one provides xp primarily, one provides extra production, one gold, etc... then try to balance those all out so that all kinds of needs get equal coverage.

Another place we find an imbalance is a combination of slavery and I think coinage - a way to get extra gold for every specialist... not sure how that was done cuz I never realized it til someone mentioned it.

So if we can pinpoint some specific issues that are throwing the whole out of whack we can attempt to reign it in where the problems are. We may not need all the above listed steps but many do sound reasonable. Civics in particular are something we may need to consider rebalancing out entirely as well. But first things first...

I gotta get you that spreadsheet as I have it so far Kosh!

Religions as gold sourcs - i remember rushing to found your own religion was way to stabilize your economy and further expand. In current economy i won't even notice if i have holy city or not. Once i switch to monarchy i am on steady +300 gold per turn minimum.

Btw, it's offtopic but that's perfect example of inflation Except you can't monetize everything in real life - you still need resources, energy and manlabor to maintain existing level of life of your people, to fund science, build army, trade for resources you don't have. Gold (and money in general) by itself doesn't provide anything - it's mere tool of trade and economy so economy subjects can count their relations and set prices in some way that suits everyone. Banks (and central bank especially) are supposed to give credits and take deposits, establishing a way for money to flow, and having some RATIONAL interest in it, and MUST be strictly regulated by central govt, but when they start looking at economy and clients and think how else we can make more we have what we have - that industry becomes uninsteresting place for investments, while financial speculations provide much more profit and in much shorter period of time. As a result of this ratio of industry/financial capital in USA moved from something around 50/50 in 1960-70s to 10/90 in 2000s. That's called deindustrialisation... I could go longer here but it's offtopic.

More on civ's gold - DH mentioned army costs. That's one of examples of gold usage - but it requires lots of work assigning prices. I think (from previous games) that army cost and expeditional costs and upgrade cost should be much more and tied to age you're in. For example - Light swordsman cost - 2 gp/turn, Swordsman - 4 gp/turn, Hvy - 6 etc. Same with other units of their age. Progressing as we move deeper into future. Upgrading units should cost 5-10 times of current. As of now - i upgrade my 500 hvy swords into musketeers and 200 catapults into artillery and hardly notice it. It should cost 15-20 turns of me switching all science to gold . At Flintlock age it's around 15000 (combined gold+scince) beakers a turn. that makes 300000 total. So upgrade cost should be arond 400-700 gp per unit (for that age).

p.s. Combination of slavery and patricianism (not coinage) - one gold per every slave you plant in city. One way would be to make citizen (non specialist) - not provide that gold (no negative gold, cause if you switch to bureacreacy you shouldn't go negative gold from slaves).

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

@Dancing Hoskuld

I made you a better Kelp icon/button and also added a Coral Reef and Walrus Totem (in case you ever have a subduable walrus). I still have not found a Totem icon/button for the Gorilla, Orangutan, or Rhino. But I did find a Hippo one if you want it.

EDIT: I found a Camel Totem. I re-uploaded the icons. Make sure it has the camel icon in it. Now the "Myth of the Camel" won't have to look like a wolf anymore.

Thanks, I don't think there is a walrus unit. I am thinking I will have to place coral reefs after map generation like goody huts. Resources are not appearing in kelp, or vice versa.

 

[strategyonly]

OK guys:

I am STILL having the Distant Civ Circumnavigated the World problem (see attached pics)\

I just started the Tech Naturopathy, and a civ has gone around the World ALREADY, no darn way

I have the techs on on pic, the DCCW on another pic, and also where you can get at a MINIMUM a canoe to get water paths started. That is a HUGE map btw. Mostly all civs only have ONE town/city?

So something in the code must be wrong someplace??

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

OK guys:

I am STILL having the Distant Civ Circumnavigated the World problem (see attached pics)\

I just started the Tech Naturopathy, and a civ has gone around the World ALREADY, no darn way

I have the techs on on pic, the DCCW on another pic, and also where you can get at a MINIMUM a canoe to get water paths started. That is a HUGE map btw. Mostly all civs only have ONE town/city?

So something in the code must be wrong someplace??

Is it land all the way round? If so you only need two scouts one going east and one west to circumnavigate fairly quickly. Even I have done it once

 

[strategyonly]

Is it land all the way round? If so you only need two scouts one going east and one west to circumnavigate fairly quickly. Even I have done it once

Yeah but you have to have a canoe in order to get the the tundra area? And there is no way anyone has that tech yet.

Also did something happen to the Holy Cities??

I founded Nagh... and is my state religion but if you look at the religious stuff NO ONE has a Holy City So you cant build any more of the special buildings??

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Yeah but you have to have a canoe in order to get the the tundra area? And there is no way anyone has that tech yet.

Also did something happen to the Holy Cities??

I founded Nagh... and is my state religion but if you look at the religious stuff NO ONE has a Holy City So you cant build any more of the special buildings??

I haven't done anything that would cause that. I have not touched that religion either.

 

[strategyonly]

I haven't done anything that would cause that. I have not touched that religion either.

I wonder what would cause NO civ to have NO Holy Cities, NONE at all

 

[Hydromancerx]

Is it land all the way round? If so you only need two scouts one going east and one west to circumnavigate fairly quickly. Even I have done it once

Yeah from that map it looks like scouts could walk around the world.

BTW strategyonly, has this problem only happened with this map or other maps too?

 

[strategyonly]

Yeah from that map it looks like scouts could walk around the world.

BTW strategyonly, has this problem only happened with this map or other maps too?

I believe its just this map.

 

[little_cyclone]

I wonder what would cause NO civ to have NO Holy Cities, NONE at all

Is Limited Religions on? I had issues with that back in RoM/AND earlier on.. Turned on Limited Religions at game setup, and no civ was able to found a religion at all till I went into the BUG menu and toggled it again.. Was interesting playing a game with no religions for awhile..

 

[JosEPh_II]

Talin wrote:As of now - i upgrade my 500 hvy swords into musketeers and 200 catapults into artillery and hardly notice it.

Baloney! Gross exaggeration! What Mod are You playing???? And How do you even have 500 hvy sword? I can barely keep 2 stacks of 25! A preposterous statement!

Are you playing a Map that has a resource every other tile?

How many cities do you own?

I have 25 at 1790AD and have just gotten frigates and have only had arqs for the past game century. I run science at 60%, Culture @20%, and Esp@10%. I make 600+/turn and have a treasury of 9800+. I'm constantly spending gold for upgrades and to finish badly needed buildings. I'm battling Unhappiness in every city and every other turn am building something to reduce this so I can build the necessary units to keep the greeks at bay. Been at war with Alexander for 3 centuries now.

I do Not lead the pack in cities or units or gold production. I just climbed into 3rd place and Ho Chi Min and Henry the Navigator are 400pts each ahead of me. And they have Iron frigates, Paddle steamers and Rifle and cavalry, etc. So if either turn on me I'm toast! Fortunately I have Henry as a Friend and ally in the war against Alexander. But if Ho Chi wasn't 1/2 a world away I'd be swimming in Khmer Rifle units right now.

Don't take this skepticism personal but I feel you are exaggerating to push your desire to see gold reduced to match your way of playing. And I find it unreasonable and counter productive to this mods development. I truly hope I'm wrong, but alarm bells keep going off in my head every time you post things like this.

JosEPh



What you have been posting is inconsistent with what I have been seeing and experiencing with C2C. And this is why I'm in disagreement with what you are proposing.

I Need to see some Hard evidence (screenshots, etc.) of what you are saying to believe any of it.

And I am Not playing with Revolutions on either.

 

[little_cyclone]

Baloney! Gross exaggeration! What Mod are You playing???? And How do you even have 500 hvy sword? I can barely keep 2 stacks of 25! A preposterous statement!.

Perhaps not completely preposterous... I'm playing a game now (Large/Donut/Conquest-Domination victory/started with 10 Civs), where I have several hundred (probably 200-250-ish at most) Gunpowder units spread across the map. The relatively high number (or so I thought) is that I like to bolster my vassals somewhat as we're getting to a point in the game where revolutions are frequent, in addition to my own homeland defense forces and dedicated expeditionary units. So long as I don't use Hurry Production too often I'm able to upgrade my troops without noticing the cost of upgrading all that much, nor the upkeep costs..

That being said, I also control 4 major religions and their shrines and 1 corporation, all of which are housed in one city