Christianity and Islam: ANY similarities?

[GenMarshall]

And the storm is back...

Beware of the fury of the Storm since Katheryn will still mow down this argument .

 

[Trajan12]

Beware of the fury of the Storm since Katheryn will still mow down this argument .

Its why im glad I usually agree with her! She must have like a million references.

 

[Perfectionist]

I would suggest that you are not seeing the big picture. Islam and Christianity may be different, if you look only at those two religions. If those are your only points of views, then of course you can point out all the little stupid differences and say "Look. They are completely different". However, if you compare the two to the wider religious landscape, the similarities become apparent. I think you will agree that Islam is far more similar to Christianity than Hinduism is, which teaches that there are many gods, but all are simply expressions of one god. Or what about Shinto, which is animistic. Or Confucianism, which emphasizes ancestors and filial piety. Or Jainism, which believes in Karma and the independence of the soul. Or Buddhism, which teaches that meditation is the way to enlightenment. The list goes on and on. When compared to this wider religious background, the similarities between Christianity and Islam become apparent

 

[Katheryn]

Good post about Falwell. Most see Jerry as a good man and have respect for him but lately noticed he's getting too heavy into politics. Most christians don't mind some mentioning of politics behind the pulpit as long it's not too often.

Did you read the whole thing? It's awesome. It's a big spankin'.

 

[Katheryn]

And the storm is back...

It's too long, isn't it?

 

[Trajan12]

It's too long, isn't it?

How on God's green Earth(Or Mother Natures ) Do you manage to respond so fast and so hard?

 

[Katheryn]

I would suggest that you are not seeing the big picture. Islam and Christianity may be different, if you look only at those two religions. If those are your only points of views, then of course you can point out all the little stupid differences and say "Look. They are completely different". However, if you compare the two to the wider religious landscape, the similarities become apparent. I think you will agree that Islam is far more similar to Christianity than Hinduism is, which teaches that there are many gods, but all are simply expressions of one god. Or what about Shinto, which is animistic. Or Confucianism, which emphasizes ancestors and filial piety. Or Jainism, which believes in Karma and the independence of the soul. Or Buddhism, which teaches that meditation is the way to enlightenment. The list goes on and on. When compared to this wider religious background, the similarities between Christianity and Islam become apparent

Stupid little differences?

I have to admit, I can hardly believe someone said that. After all the painstaking references and quotes and wikipedia cut and pastes!

Stupid little differences?

The only conclusion I can come to is that you completely skipped over my posts. You will probably skip over this one if I stop and explain it again.

The study of religion is this:

WHO IS GOD? WHAT IS MY RELATIONSHIP TO GOD? CAN I KNOW HIM IN A PERSONAL WAY? WHAT MUST I DO TO BECOME RECONCILED TO HIM? WHAT DO OUR SCRIPTURES SAY? HOW DO I LIVE SO THAT I CAN PLEASE GOD?

And there are no similarities between Islam and Christianity in these questions.

At least in Buddhism and Christianity, they both allow free will, and do not force anyone to live as 'dhimmi' or as second-class citizens, if they do not convert.

 

[Trajan12]

I have to admit, I can hardly believe someone said that. After all the painstaking references and quotes and wikipedia cut and pastes!

So thats the secret.

 

[Katheryn]

How on God's green Earth(Or Mother Natures ) Do you manage to respond so fast and so hard?

Hard? Am I hard? Oops.

I didn't mean to be.

Why do you think I get so much rebuttal?

I mean, I am only giving out standard Christian doctrine, that really hasn't changed in 2000 years.

 

[Trajan12]

Hard? Am I hard? Oops.

I didn't mean to be.

Why do you think I get so much rebuttal?

I mean, I am only giving out standard Christian doctrine, that really hasn't changed in 2000 years.

No no, I mean well when I say hard. Y'know like,"Hit em hard and hit em fast" kinda hard, its a good thing.

 

[Perfectionist]

I did not skip your posts. I am suggesting that the differences are stupid and little, compared with differences between the Abrahamic religions and other religions. I do not see how you can possibly argue this point. And by the way, Buddhism does not have any creator god. This is a far greater difference than quibbling over the divinity of a particular person.

I have one last thought. I can end your absolute insistence that there are no similarities between Christianity and Islam right now. Are you ready? Here it is: They both believe that a divine being created the world.

 

[Katheryn]

Why do people WANT Islam to be similar to Christianity?

I mean, I don't get it, really I don't.

Why do they care?

Are they afraid that Christianity is going to start a Crusade or something? As far as I know, Jerusalem is in the hands of the Jewish people, and all the manuscripts are accounted for, which was the reason for many of the Crusades.

What is it?

Do we need to be 'similar' to get along? My sister and I couldn't be more different but we adore one another. My brother and I are the same. But we know one another and respect one another.

That is more important than being 'similar'.

It sounds like some kind of "put all the religious nuts over here in the corner.... we'll deal with them later!" kind of thing.

 

[Perfectionist]

We don't want it to be similar. We simply believe that it has similarities. A better question is why people like yourself insist that it has no similarities, in the face of all evidence. And yes, we do need to be similar to get along. If I believe that you must be killed, we are unlikely to be the best of friends.

And by the way, the Crusades were far more complicated than that. They were based on, among many other things, the rise of primogeniture, the rise of a warrior society and the arrival of the Seljuks in Anatolia. But that is a discussion for a different thread.

 

[Trajan12]

you know theres another guy with a similar name.

 

[Mott1]

How on God's green Earth(Or Mother Natures ) Do you manage to respond so fast and so hard?

I agree, people on this forum are so intent on attacking her that they fail to appreciate the great amount of information she has contributed. I have certainly learned a lot about Christianity just by reading her posts. Granted there are people that pose legitimate arguments on this thread however many are only trying to debase everything she says simply because they disagree with her position. Katheryn is like the lone hare in this thread, staving off a pack of rabid atheistic wolves and doing a fine job at holding her own.

If people would be a little more interested in learning and little less combative, they would do well to listen to people like Katheryn and aneeshm who seem very knowledgeable in their respective beliefs.

My hats off to both Katheryn and aneeshm.

 

[Katheryn]

We don't want it to be similar. We simply believe that it has similarities. A better question is why people like yourself insist that it has no similarities, in the face of all evidence. And yes, we do need to be similar to get along. If I believe that you must be killed, we are unlikely to be the best of friends.

And by the way, the Crusades were far more complicated than that. They were based on, among many other things, the rise of primogeniture, the rise of a warrior society and the arrival of the Seljuks in Anatolia. But that is a discussion for a different thread.

Yes, well then you agree with me then that there is NO possibility of a new Crusade, then right? That since all the wealth is not concentrated upon the firstborn, they don't need to go out an 'win' treasure to make some kind of future? I completely agree.

But I completely disagree that we have to be similar. That we have to manufacture similarity. Why do we have to kill if we are not similar? I think that is your weak point.

 

[Katheryn]

I did not skip your posts. I am suggesting that the differences are stupid and little, compared with differences between the Abrahamic religions and other religions. I do not see how you can possibly argue this point. And by the way, Buddhism does not have any creator god. This is a far greater difference than quibbling over the divinity of a particular person.

I have one last thought. I can end your absolute insistence that there are no similarities between Christianity and Islam right now. Are you ready? Here it is: They both believe that a divine being created the world.

Okay, I'll change my mind. There is one but ONLY one.

And only because we come from Judaism, which Islam also copies. I suppose that is a similarity, but I said before that the similarities are really between Islam and Judaism. Christianity simply accepts Judaism as it's progenitor.

 

[Trajan12]

I agree, people on this forum are so intent on attacking her that they fail to appreciate the great amount of information she has contributed. I have certainly learned a lot about Christianity just by reading her posts. Granted there are people that pose legitimate arguments on this thread however many are only trying to debase everything she says simply because they disagree with her position. Katheryn is like the lone hare in this thread, staving off a pack of rabid atheistic wolves and doing a fine job at holding her own.

If people would be a little more interested in learning and little less combative, they would do well to listen to people like Katheryn and aneeshm who seem very knowledgeable in their respective beliefs.

My hats off to both Katheryn and aneeshm.

Yup, touché.

 

[aneeshm]

You can have your own opinions, but not your own facts. I believe it is a fact that Islam and Christianity share much in morals, stories, rules and so on.

But those are merely the externals . What are the similarities in the core , the essence of religion ? If they're so similar , why have they been at loggerheads for so long , whereas India and China , both of who share similar religions , never had a religious war ( only once did some Muslim occupier of India once tried to invade China ( he is known to have been slightly off his rocker ) - and watched his entire army perish in the Himalayas ) ? It's because at the core , Islam and Christianity hold different values to be dear , but Hinduism and the Chinese religion share many fundamentals , and , most importantly , are not exclusive . They do not claim that theirs is the only way . These religions are not totalitarian .

Christianity , after reforming itself , has lost its totalitarian bent . The Church no longer aspires to completely control every aspect of a believer's life . But Islam hasn't lost that bent yet . Anybody who reads the compilations of fatwas on this topic will realist that the common people are urged to approach religious authorities even for the resolution of secular issues ( such as - when and how to plant crops , whether or not a well into which a frog has fallen and died is impure , whether on not a vessel licked by a dog or a cat is impure , and many other completely secular things which have no bearing on religion at all ) will realise this , because Islam does not distinguish between the divine and the secular . There is no "Render unto Caesar" in Islam - everything is only to and for God . No distinction between Ulema and State - let us remember that Mohammed's greatest achievement was forging a strong , centralised state out of what were essentially desert nomadic tribes . His medium for doing this was his religion . And that statist flavour has pervaded that religion ever since . There is no way that they can ever be separated , unless there is a great cultural shift in the Muslim regions - a cultural shift which is , alas , rendered impossible by the nature of the religion itself .

An interesting by-product of this was that wherever Islam went , it carried its culture with it , and it seeks to turn every place it spreads to into its own little version of 7th century Arabia . Indonesia is a textbook example of the impact of different types of religions on people and their culture .

Hinduism spread there by three means - Indian settlements ( which include the trade effect ) , royal patronage , and Indian conquest .

One of the most interesting things about the spread was that it was not disruptive - the earlier animist beliefs of the country were simply assimilated into Hinduism - or the opposite could also be said to be true - that Hinduism was assimilated into the animist beliefs of the country . It is impossible to tell , because both played an equally influential role in the people's lives after the shift .

The story of royal patronage is also interesting . The kings of Indonesia , wanting the semi-divine status the Indic religions would grant them ( The Divine Rights of Kings , or rather , its Indic equivalent ) , chose to literally import Indian priests into their court to perform the ceremonies which would grant them that status . The aristocracy naturally emulated the king . The educated common people , once they saw that the new religion did not displace the old , embraced it in emulation of the king and aristocracy . And following their example , everyone else adopted it too .

It is also interesting to note that Indian influence acted as a booster to Indonesian civilisation . Many cultural achievements which would not have been possible to a culture so fragmented as Indonesia were made possible , after which the Indonesians surpassed themselves . India acted as the spark that ignited the flaming torch of Indonesian achievement , as a sort of quick starter .

Islam , on the other hand , was a disruptive thing . It could only spread to Indonesia because it had snuffed out the central civilisational light of Hinduism in India . The full effects are visible today - Arab missionaries are doing their work in Indonesia , trying to destroy the last remains of animist and Hindu belief and culture , and trying to substitute in its place their Arab fantasies of the pure faith .

And the worst part is , it's working . Aceh , one of Indonesia's conservative provinces , has already adopted Sharia law . More will follow . And the indigenous culture of Indonesia will be completely destroyed forever .

 

[Katheryn]

I agree, people on this forum are so intent on attacking her that they fail to appreciate the great amount of information she has contributed. I have certainly learned a lot about Christianity just by reading her posts. Granted there are people that pose legitimate arguments on this thread however many are only trying to debase everything she says simply because they disagree with her position. Katheryn is like the lone hare in this thread, staving off a pack of rabid atheistic wolves and doing a fine job at holding her own.

If people would be a little more interested in learning and little less combative, they would do well to listen to people like Katheryn and aneeshm who seem very knowledgeable in their respective beliefs.

My hats off to both Katheryn and aneeshm.

Why thank you very much, you are very kind!