Civ 5: Civilizations/Leaders Wanted!

[bcaiko]

Spoiler :

Harrapan
The Harrapan/Indus Valley Civilization was a Bronze Age civilization, a river based civilization in the Indus Valley of India and Pakastan. They seemed to thrive on trade, but evidence suggests that they placed little emphasis on military.
Leader: Pashupati. This one's...tough. AFAIK, we don't actually know who any of the people in the Indus Valley were. We can't translate the Indus writing. We do, however, have lots of seals featuring this guy. He could be mythological, but so could Dido...and we have less to go on here. Plus, he could have a tiger. Awesome.
Unique Ability: The Indus Valley - +1 from cities built on rivers. +1 from river tiles within city borders. Trade routes produce +1 . Aquaducts are 10% more effective.
Capital: Harrapa
Unique Unit: Harrapan Priest - Replaces the Missionary. Provides +1 local and a 10% combat bonus to nearby cities.
Unique Building: Great Bath - Replaces the Water Wheel. +3 . +1 Faith. +25% great people in this city. (Unlike the Water Wheel, does not provide production.)
I tried to give the Indus a massive economic advantage and a bias toward wanting to found cities on rivers. The unique unit is based on that priests were the local leaders and coordinators of Indus Valley towns...and since the Indus Valley had no military to speak of, the unique unit needs to be a civilian unit.

I suppose no one liked my ideas about the Indus Valley Civilization/Harrapan? :/ If so, that's too bad...they're an interesting part of world history.

 

[Civciv5]

I like it actually.
UA may be a bit overpowered

 

[steveg700]

Indus Valley is very interesting. I had an idea for rewarding them every time they were the first civ to research a tech or unlock a sopol, but we just don't know enough about them, and probably never will.

 

[SMA333M]

Romania
Vlad Tepes or Mihai Pătraşcu
Order of the Dragon - +25% attack strength within cultural borders. Each active Defensive Pact boosts unit production by 5%
Bucharest
Unique Unit: Peltast, Replaces Pikeman. Cost 120. Strength 12. Movement 2. Has a unique Enslave promotion; Each Melee unit killed has a chance to turn to a Romanian worker. Starts with Charge promotion.
Unique Building: Sanctuary. Replaces Temple. No maintenance. +2 Culture, +2 Happiness, +10% Gold. Cost 120.

Hm... Mihai Patrascu as leader ?? The leader should be Vlad Tepes, Mihai Viteazul or Alexandru Ioan Cuza. But probably the best for Civ would be Vlad Tepes (aka "Dracula" ... everyone know him ).

Or they should add Romania as "Dacia"... then the leader can be Burebista or Decebal.

Order of the Dragon - +25% attack strength within cultural borders.

This would be a good choice... Dacia/Romania was always good at defending it's own territories, even against large empires like Rome and Ottoman Empire.

Unique Unit: Peltast, Replaces Pikeman. Cost 120. Strength 12. Movement 2. Has a unique Enslave promotion; Each Melee unit killed has a chance to turn to a Romanian worker. Starts with Charge promotion.

I think Peltast it's a greek unit... I'd add an early unit (like an Axeman to replace warrior) if it's added as "Dacia"... or a replacement for Musketman/Rifleman (if added as Romania). Also I'm not so sure about the enslavement thing...

Unique Building: Sanctuary. Replaces Temple. No maintenance. +2 Culture, +2 Happiness, +10% Gold. Cost 120.

Sanctuary as unique building sounds good, if the civ is added as "Dacia". But if it's added as Romania, I think "Casa Poporului" should be the unique building (not sure what it would replace, maybe Palace). Casa Poporului it's second largest building in the world, after Pentagon and it's largest building in Europe.

Casa Poporului (also knows as Palatul Parlamentului) it's the world's largest civilian building in the world... maybe it should be added as a Wonder
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palace_of_the_Parliament_of_Romania


I'd really like to see Romania in civ, but not as "Romania"... maybe as "Dacia".

 

[bcaiko]

I like it actually.
UA may be a bit overpowered

Thanks! I tried to make them a "strong UA, weak UUs" style of Civ, since historical evidence suggests no military units to give them. I kept the UU Missionary light on bonuses and saddled the UA up. Kind of high risk, high reward: You can make mass amounts of gold as Harrapan, but you'll have no unique military units to back you up.

Indus Valley is very interesting. I had an idea for rewarding them every time they were the first civ to research a tech or unlock a sopol, but we just don't know enough about them, and probably never will.

Yeah, even with our modern technology we can't even crack their language. It's sad to not know much about this HUGE culture that flourished in ancient times.

 

[chrissifniotis]

Seems similar to my idea for Portugal that's posted on the front page, but noticeably weaker, because it seems the improvements to exploration don't serve a strategy. You might find some extra goodies in the ancient era, and maybe net a small bit of gold from meeting CS's more quickly, but overall those are real game-changers.

I have the carrack and the caçadores, although they could stand to be updated post-G&K I suppose. I wouldn't readily associate the ribauldequin with the Portuguese, but maybe that's just lack of knowledge on my part.

And I confess I have second thoughts on the carrack. The caravel is in fact Portugal's major contribution to the age exploration, so it seems odd to deprive them of it. The carrack came somewhere between the caravel's innovation and the rise of the big galleons and frigates that would make it obsolete.

That's okay, thanks form the comments.
It's actually an, I suppose the best word to use is 'old', idea, having feedback from earlier the UA is more focused on City-States; double gold from discovering city-states and small chance (10%) of generating a free Great Merchant or Great Admiral; as well as a reduction of the Influence penalty for bullying slaves. I've also been working on the Feitoria idea, left it out originally. My last idea was very complex so I'm refining the UI to purely work inside City-States borders while still being an effective TI to Portugal.

 

[bcaiko]

Maybe Portugal should get bonus gold for bullying CityStates? That is how they broke into the Indian Ocean trade.

 

[ShahJahanII]

Maybe Portugal should get bonus gold for bullying CityStates? That is how they broke into the Indian Ocean trade.

An excellent idea! Maybe they should have more options for bullying. Or possibly a bonus for city-state quests. I may also suggest the part of Finland's trait that gives Maritime/Mercantile city-states the ability to gift naval units to the player.

 

[steveg700]

Maybe Portugal should get bonus gold for bullying CityStates? That is how they broke into the Indian Ocean trade.

An excellent idea! Maybe they should have more options for bullying. Or possibly a bonus for city-state quests. I may also suggest the part of Finland's trait that gives Maritime/Mercantile city-states the ability to gift naval units to the player.

That's one of the ideas where I'm going with my current version. The carrack was built with lots of storage space, so I'm giving it the Supply promotion, plus extra gold from tribute.

 

[Civciv5]

My idea for Indonesia (representing all the historic Buddhist and Hindu kingdoms and empires):
I chose Tribhuwana because she was one of few female rulers who actually expanded their territory and she was one of the keypersons (along with Gajah Mada and Hayam Wuruk) who brought the empire to its Golden Age
Indonesia
Tribhuwana
Thalassocracy - +2 Culture,+2 Food and +2 Gold for every sea resource worked by the city
Jakarta
Unique Unit: Pencak Silat,replaces Pikeman,18 Strength and +25% Strength against melee units
Unique Building: Candi,replaces temple,does not require shrine,+ 2 Culture,no maintenance

 

[Peng Qi]

My idea for Indonesia (representing all the historic Buddhist and Hindu kingdoms and empires):
I chose Tribhuwana because she was one of few female rulers who actually expanded their territory and she was one of the keypersons (along with Gajah Mada and Hayam Wuruk) who brought the empire to its Golden Age
Indonesia
Tribhuwana
Thalassocracy - +2 Culture,+2 Food and +2 Gold for every sea resource worked by the city
Jakarta
Unique Unit: Pencak Silat,replaces Pikeman,18 Strength and +25% Strength against melee units
Unique Building: Candi,replaces temple,does not require shrine,+ 2 Culture,no maintenance

UA: Broken in half. Almost every civ that gets a yield bonus gets +1 to something. This UA gives +6, and gives it to a tile that already has extremely high yield.
UU: Broken in half. Might as well just give it 21 and be done with it. It could almost go toe to toe with Musketmen and it's available so much earlier it's not funny. Why would you ever build longswordsmen? It would need to at least lose its bonus against cavalry, and even then I think you'd need to lower the base to 17.
UB: Moderately overpowered. Strictly better than Mud Pyramid Mosque.

Flavor ideas good, everything else is ridiculously overpowered.

 

[Civciv5]

Maybe this then?
Indonesia
Tribhuwana
The Nusantaran Archipelago - -50% maintenance costs and + 2 Gold per city
Jakarta
Unique Unit: Pencak Silat,replaces Pikeman,17 Strength and +25% Strength against melee units
Unique Building: Candi,replaces temple,does not require shrine,+ 2 Culture,1 maintenance

 

[steveg700]

Here's a couple of Portugal concepts I reworked:

PORTUGAL

CONCEPT #1
Unique Unit: Cacadore. Replaces rifleman. +10% when within two tiles of a friendly city's border. Has increased visibility, and while fortified within friendly territory the cacadore's visibility to enemy units is decreased.
Unique Unit: Nau. Replaces privateer. Starts with the supply promotion, allowing it to heal outside of friendly territory. When within or adjacent to a city-state's border, receive double from tribute.
Unique Ability: Legendary Explorers. Great Merchants can perform two trade missions before being consumed. Alternatively, they can be consumed to create a feitoria, a tile improvement which replaces the customs house and generates +8 (improved with Economics). After researching Astronomy, Great Merchants gain +2 movement and visibility when embarked, and a free Great Merchant appears near the capital.

CONCEPT #2
Unique Unit: Bandeirantes. Replaces the musketman. Can build mines and has +20% when within three tiles of a luxury resource.
Unique Building: Feitoria. Replaces seaport. Provides +20% to cities against naval attacks and +50% healing rate for garrisoned or adjacent ships.
Unique Ability: Merchant Lane Monopolies. Each city gains +2 Great Merchant points for each luxury resource worked. The bonus increases to +3 if the city has a feitoria. Upon researching Astronomy, a free Great Merchant appears near the capital.

ROUGH CONCEPT
Unique Great Person: Great Explorer. Replaces the Great Merchant. Has increased invisibility and movement. Can conduct two trade missions before being consumed. Alternatively, can be consumed to settle a city. The city will have a market and, if settled on a coastal tile, a harbor.

 

[jabbawackybacky]

I was playing with this idea of a Dahomey civ ...

UA: Folk mysticism: Gets 2 pantheon beliefs instead of just 1
UU: Amazon musketwoman: replaces the musketman, gets drill +1 in wooded terrain and moves as if on roads
UB: House of the Spirits: replaces the temple, also gives +1 faith and +1 food and costs no upkeep

Dahomey was a major slaving power in West Africa, and is also the birthplace of the Vodou religion. It was famous for having an army of women warriors, although after the end of the slave trade the economy crumbled and its army was vanquished by the French. Today, Benin and Togo continue to be major hubs of traditional African religion and Vodou is one of the 3 religions recognized by the Beninese government.

 

[steveg700]

My idea for Indonesia (representing all the historic Buddhist and Hindu kingdoms and empires):
I chose Tribhuwana because she was one of few female rulers who actually expanded their territory and she was one of the keypersons (along with Gajah Mada and Hayam Wuruk) who brought the empire to its Golden Age
Indonesia
Tribhuwana
Thalassocracy - +2 Culture,+2 Food and +2 Gold for every sea resource worked by the city
Jakarta
Unique Unit: Pencak Silat,replaces Pikeman,18 Strength and +25% Strength against melee units
Unique Building: Candi,replaces temple,does not require shrine,+ 2 Culture,no maintenance

Bears some similarities to my concept for Majapahit:

MAJAPAHIT

Unique Ability: Empire of a Thousand Islands. Acquire water tiles at 50% of the or cost. Bordering city-states grant twice the normal as tribute, and tiles can be annexed from them as tribute (-15 influence per tile, up to two at a time).
Unique Unit: Silat Swordsman. Replaces swordsman. Has improved sight and defense defense while embarked, and city-states fear them greatly (units count double for purpose of bullying CS's).
Unique Building: Candi. Replaces the temple. City population converts to religions 25% faster. If converted from one religion to another, the city retains the pantheon and follower belief of the previous religion.

ALTERNATE UNIT
Unique Unit: Cetbang Warship. Replaces the galleas. Has a stronger ranged attack, and city-states fear them greatly (count as two units for purpose of bullying a city-state).

 

[Liex]

Here's a couple of Portugal concepts I reworked:

PORTUGAL

CONCEPT #1
Unique Unit: Cacadore. Replaces rifleman. +10% when within two tiles of a friendly city's border. Has increased visibility, and while fortified within friendly territory the cacadore's visibility to enemy units is decreased.
Unique Unit: Nau. Replaces privateer. Starts with the supply promotion, allowing it to heal outside of friendly territory. When within or adjacent to a city-state's border, receive double from tribute.
Unique Ability: Legendary Explorers. Great Merchants can perform two trade missions before being consumed. Alternatively, they can be consumed to create a feitoria, a tile improvement which replaces the customs house and generates +8 (improved with Economics). After researching Astronomy, Great Merchants gain +2 movement and visibility when embarked, and a free Great Merchant appears near the capital.

CONCEPT #2
Unique Unit: Bandeirantes. Replaces the musketman. Can build mines and has +20% when within three tiles of a luxury resource.
Unique Building: Feitoria. Replaces seaport. Provides +20% to cities against naval attacks and +50% healing rate for garrisoned or adjacent ships.
Unique Ability: Merchant Lane Monopolies. Each city gains +2 Great Merchant points for each luxury resource worked. The bonus increases to +3 if the city has a feitoria. Upon researching Astronomy, a free Great Merchant appears near the capital.

ROUGH CONCEPT
Unique Great Person: Great Explorer. Replaces the Great Merchant. Has increased invisibility and movement. Can conduct two trade missions before being consumed. Alternatively, can be consumed to settle a city. The city will have a market and, if settled on a coastal tile, a harbor.

The 1st concept is very comprehensive, as it reflects the Portuguese seafaring and mercantile nature. I'd conceive the Nau as an earlier UU, and add a bonus toward luxury resources to the Feitoria instead of doubling its yields, but the idea is good as it is.

A small suggestion: To avoid the c-cedilla while retaining its sound, the 'caçador' could be named 'cassador'. Cacadore sounds a lot different, and the 'e' in the end sounds Italian.

 

[Peng Qi]

I think the UU is too powerful thanks to the "move as if on roads" part. It's basically like Minutemen, but better all of the time. Moving as if on roads is basically like saying "this unit has 6 movement points no matter what the terrain is," which is way OP. Just give it Woodsman and Drill for free, and maybe some really small bonus like a bonus to Great General generation. Heck, maybe make combat within a city radius give +1 or 2 Great Merchant points to that city? It should be worse than the Minuteman when it comes to combat because the UB you picked is better than having a super-late UU like the B-17, and I suspect the UA is, despite being worse than the Byzantine ability in the end game, available a bit earlier and will give you an early bump.

 

[Peacemongerer]

Portugal
This should be a civilization whose goal is to explore rampantly like Spain is now, but with the scope of expansion being of bigger concern than who's earliest. As such, bonuses should be based largely on how much Portugal has discovered by the time exploration kicks into high gear.

Leader: Prince Henry
The other option was Alfonso, but Henry just seems to fit better with the other bonuses and the whole vibe of this civilization.

Unique Tile Improvement: Colony
Instead of being built by workers, these are built by scouts on top of luxury resources. Scouts can produce them limitlessly, but you must transfer 1 population from one of your cities to found a colony. They exert cultural control over the surrounding tiles like normal cities would, but the citizens inside do not produce any tile yields towards growth except food to grow population and do not contibute to your science output. A colony produces +1 happiness and +1 gold for the empire, but does not connect the resource like a city would. It has a base strength of 5 (10 after the Renaissance), increasing by 1 per population point. It will dissapear after 50 turns unless you send-in a settler.

Other civs cannot build within 4 tiles of a colony. If an enemy civ or barbarians attacks the colony, it is looted, destroyed, and gives the conqueror 25 gold per population point. If you build a city and the colony is in its work radius, the population joins the city and the colony improvement remains, giving 4 gold if worked until the 50 turns is up. Colonies may not be founded after the scouts become obsolete at Scientific Theory, even if there are still scouts running about.

Unique Unit: Caçadore
Replaces Rifleman. Recives the "marksmanship" bonus, allowing him to both melee attack or ranged attack (1 tile) at half strength.

Unique Ability: School of Navigation
Recieve a gold bonus once you circumnavigate the globe. Get a hefty gold bonus when Navigation is discovered for every continent (At least 10 tiles big) you've revealed thus far and a smaller gold bonus for later discoveries.

 

[Liex]

Portugal
This should be a civilization whose goal is to explore rampantly like Spain is now, but with the scope of expansion being of bigger concern than who's earliest. As such, bonuses should be based largely on how much Portugal has discovered by the time exploration kicks into high gear.

Leader: Prince Henry
The other option was Alfonso, but Henry just seems to fit better with the other bonuses and the whole vibe of this civilization.

Unique Tile Improvement: Colony
Instead of being built by workers, these are built by scouts on top of luxury resources. Scouts can produce them limitlessly, but you must transfer 1 population from one of your cities to found a colony. They exert cultural control over the surrounding tiles like normal cities would, but the citizens inside do not produce any tile yields towards growth except food to grow population and do not contibute to your science output. A colony produces +1 happiness and +1 gold for the empire, but does not connect the resource like a city would. It has a base strength of 5 (10 after the Renaissance), increasing by 1 per population point. It will dissapear after 50 turns unless you send-in a settler.

Other civs cannot build within 4 tiles of a colony. If an enemy civ or barbarians attacks the colony, it is looted, destroyed, and gives the conqueror 25 gold per population point. If you build a city and the colony is in its work radius, the population joins the city and the colony improvement remains, giving 4 gold if worked until the 50 turns is up. Colonies may not be founded after the scouts become obsolete at Scientific Theory, even if there are still scouts running about.

Unique Unit: Caçadore
Replaces Rifleman. Recives the "marksmanship" bonus, allowing him to both melee attack or ranged attack (1 tile) at half strength.

Unique Ability: School of Navigation
Recieve a gold bonus once you circumnavigate the globe. Get a hefty gold bonus when Navigation is discovered for every continent (At least 10 tiles big) you've revealed thus far and a smaller gold bonus for later discoveries.

The UI is quite problematic, not only in gameplay terms, but "colony" is definitely not "unique" to anyone.

The UA also has its problems. Most seafaring UAs can be useful even in Pangea maps, specially now in G&K. It's also worth to note that the 1st circumnavigation was funded by the Spanish Crown, despite Magalhães being Portuguese.

The UU is really interesting. It could start with the Woodsman promotion as well (after all 'caçador' means 'hunter', but they indeed were a high mobility troop and had some adaptations to move through the Portuguese countryside, such as the nut-brown uniform), it'd allow some nice tactics with the ranged attack ability.

 

[steveg700]

The 1st concept is very comprehensive, as it reflects the Portuguese seafaring and mercantile nature. I'd conceive the Nau as an earlier UU, and add a bonus toward luxury resources to the Feitoria instead of doubling its yields, but the idea is good as it is.

A small suggestion: To avoid the c-cedilla while retaining its sound, the 'caçador' could be named 'cassador'. Cacadore sounds a lot different, and the 'e' in the end sounds Italian.

Thanks for the input. I'm not familiar with the language, but in English the letter "c" can certainly be pronounced like an "s". Is a "ç" different from either of those?

What would you do with the nau? It comes right after the caravel, and if anybody should have caravels, it should be Portugal. And the caravel was the first of their ocean-faring vessels, so I wouldn't place it earlier.