Civ IV Mac vs PC Multiplayer

[enkiduMT]

I am wondering how the multiplayer aspect of Civ4 will work... specifically, will we be able to browse all the PC folks hosting up a game? Direct IP connection is a marginal solution to Mac vs PC play. I seem to recall that Halo uses GameSpy for host/player matching. Does Civ4 use GameSpy? It seems Civ4 uses Gamebryo tech? Does this allow for Mac vs PC gaming?

If we are relagated to Mac vs Mac on say GameRanger, this is much less desirable.

Any info on this would be appreciated! My preorder will be here in a bout a week! WOOT!

 

[AlanH]

Brad did say that cross-platform multiplayer would work on Civ4. I don't know any details, but I think Aspyr are committed to it.

 

[AlexandrNyetski]

It would be tremendously stupid for any developer of the Mac version to deliberately plan to keep the very small Mac user community from being able to play with most people.

 

[enkiduMT]

I did not intend to give anyone the impression that BradO et al are deliberately trying to limit multiplayer to only mac vs mac.

To quote the man himself: (feb22, 2006 thebradhole)
"Civilization 4. It's a beast. It's not often, but there are games where, while working on them, I think to myself, "it'll be a miracle if this ever runs on the Mac". I thought that about Sims 2, and I sometimes feel the same way about Civ4. It's a huge codebase with lots of interconnected parts. More problematic - and a personal gripe of mine - is the use of third-party libraries. Civ4 has probably set some kind of record in this regard: it uses Gamebryo 2.0, GFC 1.0, GameSpy (which is an umbrella of several minor libraries), FreeType, Python, Zlib (a more recent version than included with OSX), Bink, Miles 7.0 (no Mac version exists for this yet), Microsoft's XML library (including schema support, which Apple's XML doesn't do) and of course DirectX." (thx google! now sit fella! good boy!)

I know gamespy can work (Halo multi works just fine thank you), but the license fee or other factors may be huge stumbling blocks.

I noted that in the IMG preview posted yesterday "Unfortunately, the Mac version will not be able to host a Pitboss server, although the Mac version can join them, and thankfully can play with the PC version via direct IP." Implies that we CAN join pitboss (and any other multiplayer types?) but just not host a Pitboss 'move and leave' type of game server. What troubled me is the little tag on the end that says we can play PC folks via a direct IP connection. This may impy that we don't get to browse all the Civ4 games that folks are hosting on PCs... I don't have a PC or a gamer friend who has Civ4 or I'd ask them to show me how it works.

Just trying to get a picture of whether gamespy if used for matching up servers and players.

whew! long one

 

[Helmling]

It would be tremendously stupid for any developer of the Mac version to deliberately plan to keep the very small Mac user community from being able to play with most people.

It's not that they'd deliberately try to deprive us of this privilege, but they may not have the time or resources to dedicate to the Herculean task of keeping the Mac version synched and compatible with the PC version now and for all future updates.

 

[AlexandrNyetski]

support is support, i say!

 

[macguy]

Well i for one didn't see support for gamespy. According to what i've been getting from pc users, i am getting the impression that they have a list of multiplayer users who are currently playing. I think they got a internet button along with gamespy asking you for a username and password. Civ 4 seems to only have Direct ip, lan and hotseat(this doesn't seem to work). It would've been better if they made it more like halo. Hotseat isn't working when i put 2 humans and 2 Ais. Instead i end up controlling more than 4 players. What the heck is going on... This is so far my biggest complaint towards Civ 4 on the mac side.

 

[AlanH]

In teh Civ3 equivalent - GameRanger - you browse to the GameRanger site using Safari or whatever, and sign up. You then download a GameRanger application that allows you to see a list of running games. You can join one or start your own. When you do so it launches Civ3 and your in-game options are then available.

I've no idea whether GameSpy works like this, but I'm pretty sure you would have to register with them on-line before you could use the service.

 

[macguy]

In teh Civ3 equivalent - GameRanger - you browse to the GameRanger site using Safari or whatever, and sign up. You then download a GameRanger application that allows you to see a list of running games. You can join one or start your own. When you do so it launches Civ3 and your in-game options are then available.

I've no idea whether GameSpy works like this, but I'm pretty sure you would have to register with them on-line before you could use the service.

Yup, i know about gameranger but the problem is that they don't have Civ 4 yet and i am not sure they will anytime soon. I'm not sure if it does get going on gameranger if it will become as popular as age of empires. There is literally tons of people playing that game every single day but i don't think that will be the case with Civ 4 . So i also want to play with windows users(shame on me lol) because of the lack of mac users playing Civ 4.

Gamespy should be integrated into Civ 4 like halo. I could sign up there but Civ 4 doesn't ask for a account. There is just lan, hot seat (doesn't work properly) and Direct ip. Too bad.

 

[AlanH]

I wasn't suggesting that GameRanger would have it - I know they don't, and you wouldn't want to play there anyway as the main population of players are Windozies.. I simply thought that the model, requiring some sort of registration online form outside the game, might give a clue.

After I posted I had a look around on the Gamespy site. They do have a downloadable game browser module, but of course it's presumably Windows-only. I know it goes against the grain, but have you looked in the manual to see if there are any instructions for accessing Gamespy?

 

[Eio]

I wasn't suggesting that GameRanger would have it - I know they don't, and you wouldn't want to play there anyway as the main population of players are Windozies.. I simply thought that the model, requiring some sort of registration online form outside the game, might give a clue.

After I posted I had a look around on the Gamespy site. They do have a downloadable game browser module, but of course it's presumably Windows-only. I know it goes against the grain, but have you looked in the manual to see if there are any instructions for accessing Gamespy?

Both GameRanger and GameSpy are advertised on the box of the game... Yet neither option is available in the game. I'd doubt GameSpy will ever work due to licensing costs that Aspyr will not pay.

GameRanger on the other hand is a free Mac-only match making service that should have been available out of the box.

 

[AlanH]

If GameSpy is on the box, Aspyr should have it licensed? Wouldn't they feed off the main Firaxis/Take2 license for Civ4?

 

[macguy]

I wasn't suggesting that GameRanger would have it - I know they don't, and you wouldn't want to play there anyway as the main population of players are Windozies.. I simply thought that the model, requiring some sort of registration online form outside the game, might give a clue.

After I posted I had a look around on the Gamespy site. They do have a downloadable game browser module, but of course it's presumably Windows-only. I know it goes against the grain, but have you looked in the manual to see if there are any instructions for accessing Gamespy?

Yes i looked in the instructions but they give nothing or say anything about gamespy. The only way i can play multiplayer is through direct ip. The multiplayer on the mac side is kind of useless and still didn't improve on it after they released Civ3 complete. I have no one to try it out on but oh well. I'll just wait and hope some update to Civ 4 or gameranger is released.

 

[Eio]

If GameSpy is on the box, Aspyr should have it licensed? Wouldn't they feed off the main Firaxis/Take2 license for Civ4?

My guess is that the GameSpy logo went on the box because it's actually on the main title screen in game as well. The read me on the Civ IV DVD states that GameSpy is not supported and the manual information for GameSpy has been removed. There is no GameRanger information in the manual either.

One would think that if a publisher was able to obtain the rights to port a title that all licensed software included in the original title would also be licensed to the porter. Guess that isn't the case and certainly not in this case.

 

[Brad Oliver]

Both GameRanger and GameSpy are advertised on the box of the game... Yet neither option is available in the game. I'd doubt GameSpy will ever work due to licensing costs that Aspyr will not pay.

GameRanger on the other hand is a free Mac-only match making service that should have been available out of the box.

GameRanger is supported - via the GameRanger app. ;-) That's how all GameRanger apps work.

GameSpy is somewhat supported. We got a license for the network code (this drives the entire net game), so cross-platform games work. However, we could not license the in-game server browser, so you have to find some way of joining PC games by getting the IP address yourself. Likewise, hosting an internet game (not a LAN game) requires talking to the GameSpy server browser - which ties into the above - and we could not license that.

 

[Brad Oliver]

One would think that if a publisher was able to obtain the rights to port a title that all licensed software included in the original title would also be licensed to the porter. Guess that isn't the case and certainly not in this case.

You've got it. We're pretty much always on our own for third-party libraries.

 

[Eio]

GameRanger is supported - via the GameRanger app. ;-) That's how all GameRanger apps work.

Having GameRanger and being an avid user, it is physically impossible to host a Civ IV game via GR at this time. This is using GR 4.5.1.

I understand the issues with GameSpy due to licensing but I'm certainly not thrilled that they exist.

 

[Brad Oliver]

Having GameRanger and being an avid user, it is physically impossible to host a Civ IV game via GR at this time. This is using GR 4.5.1.

"Physically impossible?" Is there an invisible wall that blocks your hand or something? ;-)

Seriously, what happens when you try?

 

[Eio]

"Physically impossible?" Is there an invisible wall that blocks your hand or something? ;-)

Seriously, what happens when you try?

LOL

GR doesn't appear to recognize Civ IV is installed so it's not available via the "Host" option. Also, it's not available in the list under "Preferences > Games". This usually means that GR doesn't know that said game exists so it thus becomes "impossible", physical or otherwise

 

[Brad Oliver]

GR doesn't appear to recognize Civ IV is installed so it's not available via the "Host" option. Also, it's not available in the list under "Preferences > Games". This usually means that GR doesn't know that said game exists so it thus becomes "impossible", physical or otherwise

Do you have the Civ4 plugin for GameRanger? Scott usually pushes those out to GameRanger as an update when our games hit the shelves.