Civ Switching - Will it prevent you from buying Civ 7?

[DWilson]

I actually do not remember significant backlash from V to VI (which people were optimistic wouldn't be barebones on release, like V was).

I do recall significant agitation about 1UPT, but I don't think it was quite as significant as mandatory civ changing.

 

[TheGrayFox]

Dude, I'm not going to buy your attempt to re-frame civ firestorms to fit your narrative that this is the "big one", this is where Firaxis has really jumped the shark. The threads are there. People talking about modding in stacking limits months before the game came out. People talking about how it's not realistic. People encouraging others not to buy the game to send 2K/Firaxis a message. Polls to gauge the community's reaction. It's all there. This isn't any different. Feel free to continue making stuff up, but all it does is undermine your position.

you don't have "buy my attempts" (a view i'm not even the only person to hold here)

If you guys want to change history and pretend that taxation sliders and 1unit per tile (a requested feature that literally drove up engagement with the series and sales) caused as much of a backlash as civ swapping is now you are free to believe

 

[Zaarin]

I actually do not remember significantly backlash from V to VI

I was new here at the time. I remember a few new threads a day complaining the art style had doomed the franchise forever.

 

[TheGrayFox]

Frankly, I don't think so. I feel like you're the one with the tainted-glasses looking back with some soft nostalgia. I don't know the switch from III to IV, but I vaguely remember the switch from IV to V and definitely remember from V to VI. Edit: for a more recent example, I remember the second-hand backlash that Eleanor and leaders leading different civs brought to the game, with the most inane takes on it and some of the most over-the-top hyperboles on what it would entails for the future of the franchise.

And, frankly again, the whining and tantrums I see here for this "feature that'll kill the franchise" is broadly the same amount of whining and tantrums we had for any element that changed through any other change. Plus ça change, as French people say.

Now, I'm not saying that, since any tantrum threw in the past ended up becoming a beloved feature, that people throwing tantrums over the civ-switch is proof that it'll become a beloved feature. But from my point of view of having played Civilization for roughly 20 years, it definitely has the same feel, as far as I can remember.

and several of us who were here for IV to V and IV to V are telling you you are making up history if you actually think taxation sliders were as unpopular as civilization swapping....

but you guys are free to "whine" and "have tantrums" at us for pointing that out to you.

 

[TheGrayFox]

I was new here at the time. I remember a few new threads a day complaining the art style had doomed the franchise forever.

again we've already established that the art style was easily the biggest and most vocal complaint most had with civ 6 and that is why 1/3rd still plays Civ V and why a mod changing its art style was created almost immediately and is still among its most popular

but even then the art style is much easier to change/mod and get over than fundamental changes to the inherent design of the game

 

[Professor Phobo]

you don't have "buy my attempts" (a view i'm not even the only person to hold here)

If you guys want to change history and pretend that taxation sliders and 1unit per tile (a requested feature that literally drove up engagement with the series and sales) caused as much of a backlash as civ swapping is now you are free to believe

You're really missing the point. The scale of the backlash is not a persuasive component of your argument. It's irrelevant. Let me try to explain.

Imagine I choose not to watch a Youtube video under the following scenarios:
A. It's about astronomy and I'm not interested in astronomy
B. It's about astronomy, which I am greatly interested in, but the description says it's a basic overview and I skip it because I'm past that stage
C. It's about astronomy, which I am greatly interested in, but the comments section negative as to the quality of the video

For Scenario C, we need to ask another question: what's up with the Youtube comments section? It's a common piece of internet hygiene advice to never read the comments; comments sections are heavily tilted towards negativity. Happy people move on to the next video. Unhappy people are angry.
Looking further, it's a flat earth review bomb; the negative comments are caused by a social context beyond the actual quality of the video. By contrast, the comments could be that the video cuts out to a RickRoll twenty seconds in. These two sub-scenarios greatly change how reasonable it was for me to skip the video.

You're in scenario A. You don't need anything else to justify your disinterest. You certainly don't need to add scenario C to buttress your case.

Like, someone (on this thread? another thread?) pointed to the reaction in the twitch chat as evidence the fanbase will reject civ-switching and it's a bad move for Firaxis. Twitch chat! You will never encounter a greater haven of hooting psychopaths than the average twitch chat! The evidentiary value we should place on it is negligible.

 

[Gori the Grey]

Sure, maybe it will. But it could also be one of those things were you resist trying a new food because it sounds gross, then you try it and it's delicious. They could have some other element of the game's later stages that address issues people have with "losing" their civilization, like some kind of elegant aesthetic hybridization or the narrator whispers "remember you used to be Egypt" in your ear the whole time.

I think they should do a lot in this vein, to mitigate the identification problems that some of the skeptical here have voiced. "That people once known to historians as the Egyptians but now more commonly the Mongolians . . ." "The Hanging Gardens, built by the earliest predecessors of modern Mongolia and still one of that culture's most treasured wonders . . ."

 

[Professor Phobo]

I think they should do a lot in this vein, to mitigate the identification problems that some of the skeptical here have voiced. "That people once known to historians as the Egyptians but now more commonly the Mongolians . . ." "The Hanging Gardens, built by the earliest predecessors of modern Mongolia and still one of that culture's most treasured wonders . . ."

I'm saying it now and I'll say it again: give us Romongolia.

 

[pokiehl]

again we've already established that the art style was easily the biggest and most vocal complaint most had with civ 6 and that is why 1/3rd still plays Civ V and why a mod changing its art style was created almost immediately and is still among its most popular

I’m pretty confused here and there’s some incorrect information in the post.

1/3 of whom plays Civ 5? What is the total figure you’re referring to? Are you trying to make some point that Civ 6 isnt as popular as it could be? It’s the best selling game in the entire series.

The mod did not come out “almost immediately.” It came out after the 2nd expansion—years after release. And the civ 6 art dev made it himself to show modders how flexible the art modding system is.

You’re framing the mod as some immediate reflection of backlash from fans but that’s just not the case at all.

 

[Gori the Grey]

I'm saying it now and I'll say it again: give us Romongolia.

That's the way to NOT do it!

No one will identify with EgyptoMongoNetherlandia

 

[Professor Phobo]

That's the way to NOT do it!

No one will identify with EgyptoMongoNetherlandia

How dare you deride my Babyneezilian Empire!

 

[Gedemon]

And I hope Civ VII never becomes popular, so the devs realize what a mistake they've made.

that's a weird logic, if the game is popular, then they didn't make a mistake.

...and by the way, even if they get 80 % of their player base back, loosing 20 % of their previous customers isn't great either!

depends how much new consumers they gain.

Sorry let me correct myself "one of the most popular mods through 6's history was a mod changing the art style back to 5s and 1/3 of the player base still plays V"

should give you hope that someone from Firaxis made it.

I actually do not remember significant backlash from V to VI (which people were optimistic wouldn't be barebones on release, like V was).

I do recall significant agitation about 1UPT, but I don't think it was quite as significant as mandatory civ changing.

you are all wrong, the biggest crisis in civ history was when they didn't release the civ6 DLL code.

I mean, I remember very well, I was the one complaining all around that time

 

[pokiehl]

How dare you deride my Babyneezilian Empire!

This lightheartedness is reminding me of ANOTHER round of gamer rage towards Civ: the New Frontier Pass. Some people got so angry about the optional fantasy stuff.

I always like that content. It’s silly that people think Civ has always been some super serious game. Every single Civ game except Civ 1 has optional supernatural or fantasy stuff.

 

[Professor Phobo]

I never tried the optional modes for VI. Are they any good?

It's actually one of my favorite things they are able to add going forward, and I hope we see some weird stuff in VII as an option. I really liked the Civ 2 scenario packs back in the day. I still remember fighting the Hodads.

 

[Zaarin]

I never tried the optional modes for VI. Are they any good?

They explode the power level, but some are fun. Corporations & Monopolies and Barbarian Clans seem to be prototypes for Civ7. Secret Societies and Heroes are a lot of dumb fun.

 

[pokiehl]

I never tried the optional modes for VI. Are they any good?

It's actually one of my favorite things they are able to add going forward, and I hope we see some weird stuff in VII as an option. I really liked the Civ 2 scenario packs back in the day. I still remember fighting the Hodads.

They explode the power level, but some are fun. Corporations & Monopolies and Barbarian Clans seem to be prototypes for Civ7. Secret Societies and Heroes are a lot of dumb fun.

My favorite was Apocalypse Mode. It was so funny having comets literally destroy your cities.

 

[DWilson]

you are all wrong, the biggest crisis in civ history was when they didn't release the civ5 DLL code.

I mean, I remember very well, I was the one complaining all around that time

Heh, at least they released it eventually, IIRC, but then they've refused to release it for VI entirely. Which is why I am less confident that mods can fix VII

 

[thecrazyscot]

and several of us who were here for IV to V and IV to V are telling you you are making up history if you actually think taxation sliders were as unpopular as civilization swapping....

You do know the taxation slider thing was a lighthearted joke about how civ fans will get worked up over anything, right?

 

[Professor Phobo]

You do know the taxation slider thing was a lighthearted joke about how civ fans will get worked up over anything, right?

Yeah, by itself it wasn't that controversial, but many people did see it as part of a worrisome "dumbing down" trend that some suggested happened between IV and V.

IV still had the slider or am I misremembering? Anyway, it's hard to say the modern Civ games aren't more complex than Civilization II, which I think is still the benchmark for the franchise, so it all comes out in the wash.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

They explode the power level, but some are fun. Corporations & Monopolies and Barbarian Clans seem to be prototypes for Civ7. Secret Societies and Heroes are a lot of dumb fun.

Definitely have done all of these. I use SS and Heroes occasionally especially for situational games. Such as when playing as Scotland I turn on SS so I can build my own "Hogwarts" with the Alchemical Society, for example.