Civ4 to Civ3

[Moosezilla]

I read this tread looking to see if features from civ4 could be modded into civ3. Other than mentions of civ3.5 and balencer sp. reloaded the subject doesn't seem to have interest. I wonder if this (civ4 forum) is the right place to elicit response?

Otherwise I'm glad the troll was fed. I assumed grammar was result of French Canada and haste.

 

[T.A JONES]

I read this tread looking to see if features from civ4 could be modded into civ3. Other than mentions of civ3.5 and balencer sp. reloaded the subject doesn't seem to have interest. I wonder if this (civ4 forum) is the right place to elicit response?

Otherwise I'm glad the troll was fed. I assumed grammar was result of French Canada and haste.

Hmm 1 n half out of 2 right on my written speak analysis lol Actually my posts are great to read when I read them back myself (last edit is my sig..) In a rush more or less led to my impatience on the last few, a thing from a tiring work week and other stuff to do I guess. My apolgies where in order. I don't leave any debates in bad terms, most know that.
About the french. CLose hit, My jackleg crew (who I travel down the cage with) is made up of 4 frenchies out of 6. Sudbury area is majority french, butfact is only time you don't hear it is 'on line' since Ontario made illegal to talk on the 2way in any language but English for safty reasons (protect monolingual guys like me )


But Hey woah there!, I didn't think any trollin was happening 99% of the time, unless you feel heavy afflliction to the game and feel it shouldn' be put to shame.
Ether game is allowed critism on a thread that fits, so in if you don't like to hear it heavy on the civ4 side chances are that kind of civ3 support will be there for some time, so I'd stay out for a while.

Ya I admit I do my part defending civ3. Sometimes the way you go is by showin flaws in civ4 . But even I know when Im going yards to deep. Usually Its like the last 3 posts when half asleep. Readin what I wrote is a major chore at that point. Mostly its only the massive be-ligerant!-see! that gets caught. ey, how was that '(sp)' 'mon ami'? lol

SO no troll here. I broke it down to basics MY first few pages were gold, CLassic stuff. A lil to rough was the bit on Civ'3' island discovery income' Even I had a royal pain just tryin to understand a combined two lines, cue the apoligee to whom also tried but didn't reduce to grammer swine.

But needless to say it was a good bit of debate centering on my 2 driving home points : CIv4's lack of performace and lack of easy refiniabilty. THose where always the biggest concerns for me .
As one needs to know that Civ in general has most always owed it to amatuer access for optimal utilization, Civ3 haters should realize before they critize flaws in 'default' that it fixs rather easily and the game can keep growing without the performance slowin. Thats trumps for the predecessor explained easily more or less.

all the rest I call sleepy driftin down the endless road of debate. What I guess kept me awake was the buzzing by of drone replys, fanboy surprise ,or smack-their-game up-side the-head, now here 'troll!' cries', a civ3 treader makes materialize when he infiltrates the 4 hive!

ANyway peace, love ya'll ...WHat?

 

[Joesocwork]

Can I purchase your copy of Rosetta Stone TM ?

 

[T.A JONES]

Can I purchase your copy of Rosetta Stone TM ?

Sure, its called 'Hooked on Ebonics TM ' ...ya jerk

 

[Joesocwork]

They turned me down when I suggested it. Go figure...

 

[T.A JONES]

They turned me down when I suggested it. Go figure...

Sucks hard. I tried to vouch for ya man

I heard your Neanderthal tone over the phone had em hone in you feeling more at home starting in 'Interspecies Communication 101'. Go figure....

 

[Joesocwork]

Again, I have no idea what you wrote, but I'll defend your right to write it if you aren't being a troll.

 

[r_rolo1]

What I guess kept me awake was the buzzing by of drone replys, fanboy surprise ,or smack-their-game up-side the-head, now here 'troll!' cries', a civ3 treader makes materialize when he infiltrates the 4 hive!

This , from the fingers of a person that passed 2 pages showing Civ III mods when asked to compare plain Civ III with plain Civ IV ( a thing in which he concured to be unfair to do otherwise )....... yeah, the others are the drones

 

[T.A JONES]

This , from the fingers of a person that passed 2 pages showing Civ III mods when asked to compare plain Civ III with plain Civ IV ( a thing in which he concured to be unfair to do otherwise )....... yeah, the others are the drones

Man what are you talking about? lol You think you can say IM a drone when you choose to ignore the message I carried throughout. Whats the differnce? Hell I never ignored you! Go back and read what everyone else has who hasn't pretended they can't understand englishh (I mean when theres two 'h''s on the end )
I contested the validity of this bunk arguement with ease in every arguement. Or it seemed so as it remained unrefuted from start to finish.( I can requote whats there if you say it to hard to read)
Heck,whats more proof, You left it out of my summery in your quote from this:

Spoiler :

But needless to say it was a good bit of debate centering on my 2 driving home points : CIv4's lack of performace and lack of easy refiniabilty
One needs to know that Civ in general has most always owed it to amatuer access for optimal utilization, Civ3 haters should realize before they critize flaws in 'default' that it fixs rather easily and the game can keep growing without the performance slowin.

Whats the basis of a civ3 vs civ4 in a unmodded arguement?. How many still play unmodded civ3 or civ4? That BS reduction is equal to a "whats greater, Playstation 1 or NIntendo 64?" tiff since in both civ worlds majorty have moved on to better gameplay. Thats what mods do, give the games a lift. Naturally the game that makes this easier has a plus as a WHOLE ..

I guess anyone who plays on a bigger then "plain" 'huge map (160x160)' in Civ3 is not included in your little comparison, as any size you choose is
encouraged thanks to the MAINFRAME's ease on performance But Strange, to you its also not part of the arguement as its not "plain" civ3 and thus,not a benifit to the civ3 vs civ4 discussion ...

Yep, looks like we got another smart one here, and with his own fan support :

rolo is specifically not talking about mods. You specifically are not understanding that

So like Jerry who dosn't understand civ3's easier to modify for you or the 'next guy' youve not giving the realty of greater potentail civ3 gaming a try.
Any insignifigant detraction is what you cling by simply cuz(cuz meaning: because) you can't invalidate any the improvments I poured on as examples of 'real' truth if you tried. ("real" as in "yes you 'really' can play the way I discribed in previous posts and its still 'real civ3'! - not like the rolo "plain" philosophy.. understand? )

Balancer Reloaded was just a nice example of what I thought where best ideas for implimentation . For example I could just shut off corruption in the editer like choosing "easy" in a SNES menu. Yet the example of the corruption patch I gave was the best idea for improvement upon implimention and It was my choice to play it as much as it was your choice to download and install from the company website instead. Got it? Ya with me this time?

Same goes with civ4, its your choice. You have the option as an owner of civ4 to download Burics patch or the offical patch or play both. To choose the amauter patch dosn't make it any lesser of a game ..or exclude you from the 'what games you prefer argument.' How else would you play burics 'civ4' but without the 'plain civ4?' disc ?
Balancer was even packaged with Civ3 Complete so you can even argue 'its In the box content or atleast the link is in the box. Same as with the offical patch, with both you 'got'(excuse the grammer ) the lisence to play

In civ3 its more easily your choice whatever game you prefer. If you choose plain fine, just remember next time to say its you thats lame and not the Civ ''default; game

Google: "T.A JONES" cartoon site:civfanatics.com

Disc Disaster- Help - Civilization Fanatics' Forums Originally Posted by T.A JONES View Post. Civ4's cartoon style is for young kids so young they won't be able to tell you just took the weakest link from ...
forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=254321 - 114k

Civilization V - Page 9 - Civilization Fanatics' Forums 12 Mar 2008 ... Last edited by T.A JONES : Mar 11, 2008 at 08:42 PM. .... we think its fault lies soley on the cheasy "cartoon look" but really the issue is ...
forums.civfanatics.com/ showthread.php?t=263687&page=9 - 168k

Which Civ game was better, Civ IV or Civ III? - Page 4 ...I'm not enamoured with the cartoon graphics for the leaderheads too much either. .... Last edited by T.A JONES : Jul 02, 2008 at 09:20 PM. ...
forums.civfanatics.com/ showthread.php?t=229919&page=4 - 131k


There's 29 hits, I'm not gonna format/quote them all. T.A is a Troll. And yer feeding him. Watch your fingers

Wait yer calling me a troll? The quote(in red) you used to incriminate with you just made up! I never said that!. > don't want to know about the other 2. Your links have nothing there so I couldnt check those
Dude no offence , but these are some sorry antics even for a silly cartoon loving civ4 troll, ya know? There, you can quote that.

See rolo now you get were Im coming from with the Fanboy Surprise idea aswell!

 

[r_rolo1]

Well, you said.....

the buzzing by of drone replys

implying that everyone that responded you was responding in auto mode ( exactly like you did last post with Balderstrom ) . I simply pointed that you, after agreeing that comparing mods of a game with plain versions of other was not a fair deal ( as quoted by Jerrymander ), you passed 2 pages showing or talking about mods, like if you simply couldn't talk of anything else.... and that , in my book , is a automated behaviour ( also known as drone behaviour ) . Hence my reply.

Sorry, T.A , I agree there has been some fanboyism in here ( uh, ugly word ) against you, but in this point you were acussing the others of something that you were doing as well, and probably more than anyone else.

 

[T.A JONES]

Well, you said.....

implying that everyone that responded you was responding in auto mode ( exactly like you did last post with Balderstrom ) . I simply pointed that you, after agreeing that comparing mods of a game with plain versions of other was not a fair deal ( as quoted by Jerrymander ), you passed 2 pages showing or talking about mods, like if you simply couldn't talk of anything else.... and that , in my book , is a automated behaviour ( also known as drone behaviour ) . Hence my reply.

OK I appreciate your last comments but we will have to disagree on the main points.

Your more into saying " don't tamper with the game or its not that same, nothing wrong with it, but it should be called a new name"
When it comes to messing with the original formula you think its a golden recipe made from the civ gods. Im close right? (might have exadurated but only for friendly joke purpose)
Your view, its as valid as anything else if this is how you choose to play but please except many choose another way that differs from your approach. I stated my reasons why I think this should be considered in overall game evalutaion

. We could have debated on these but you choose not to. I never deviated like 'Jeery' said. Atleast I can't find a quote so its not on some massive scale worth flaming about.



As was shown in my post above, I believe this arguement is the wrong angle to take and I don't see why it matter Jerry agrees I missed your point. AS I said I explained my mod issue was relevent so He was wrong and without any merit to be attacking my posting precedure. True I was without knowledge of the definition of term 'parallel structure' so he was right there. But Really I was on point at most times. Besides, it was not for him to judge if he couln't translate it lol

Anyway Ok to your point, Yes I give you that. I still wouldn't say the term drone was the best word to use in ryhme that time. Still It was suitable for me as I uniquely saw fit. From where Im coming from I see the predicabilty and ease the arguements go down with players who are unfamilar with civ3's intricacy and so put it down with the usual responses.
I was tryin to educated on civ3 as it is today but I guess some don't appreciate the tone when I have to drag out civ4 negatives in the process.

Its your right to disagee with a mod's validity but it dosn't make me wrong here to back its importance again and again. Again,..lol I stated above why I though it applys to the game in its entirety You never debated this so I went on giving more examples on the same 'parallel but Id prefer to stop this for a bit I can understand how repitious or dronish it most sound if your not intrested in mods

Take er easy man

 

[r_rolo1]

Your more into saying " don't tamper with the game or its not that same, nothing wrong with it, but it should be called a new name"

No....

I was simply stating that you can't measure a game by the quality of their mods, because mods are made mostly by fans and that a crappy game can give huge mods if worked right and a good game can give subpar mods if, by any reason, it does not atract good modders. So the only fair comparison is seeing the base games, not the mods, because , if you compare mods, you're comparing the modders skill and will more than the games in itself

 

[T.A JONES]

Hey theres the last words. Pritty good.. and pritty much what I said quoted only not so exadurated upon like I admitted doing with harmless intent.

For me the best civ3 is a modified version of the plain 'BIC' so thats my realty. I extra huge without the deley or the other flaws I agree existed in the plain version of civ3 and some of which are in civ4 aswell..
THe sticking points I menitoned with civ4 in my summery can't be corrected, my reason I focused on them and the constrast in civ3's mainframe
You can't deny many other shares this realty on both stages(civ3 and civ4) with reagards to improved gameplay upon dealing with a vast spectrum of variables. Therefore, Why make an obsolte comparison such as deafult civ3 vs civ4. NO sence to it. You get my drift?

I mean your opionion sounds valid to some degree especailly in the HOF areana, but I think You'd agree you havn't seen the full effects an easy access editer can have on a game. ITs very positve as I mentioned why. I can't imagine any negative effect to the system except to see something 'hard-coded', but in civ4, majorty, to all things are flawed in the way they 'hard-to code' .

Somethings really do fit the true definaition like graphics memory overkill and lack of easy editer for example. Those are hardcoded, I guess , if the sayin fits? lol

Im going to leave it there for thoughts because can't expand more, Id just be repeating what I already poured in from my 2 previous pages and especailly the 2nd last

 

[r_rolo1]

if you insist on talk mods.....

I have some experience on making mods for both Civ III and IV ( mostly small stuff, nothing worth to be published seperately ). I do reckon that for small changes ( like cosmetic stuff as unit and terrain graphs ) Civ III is far easierto manage , but Civ IV modding is extremely powerful, in a way that even a relatively noob programmer can easily make huge changes in a way that simply can't be done without the ilegal and extremely hard reverse engineering in Civ III. For a example, I can write 2 lines of code and I don't have corruption in Civ IV... for doing that in civ III... well, you can ask to the corruption patch mod maker how many time and effort he spent on that

 

[T.A JONES]

if you insist on talk mods.....

For a example, I can write 2 lines of code and I don't have corruption in Civ IV... for doing that in civ III... well, you can ask to the corruption patch mod maker how many time and effort he spent on that

Oy stop me from all this reposting...

OK yes LIke I said the corruption patch can be made easy way I just gave the 'better' way for overall gameplay. That was of course by adding improvements and wonders and even the vassel patch. Your right Thats a lot of work, also why you get those 3rd xpak mods I mentioned cuz they don't deviate from the core game we all love ; )

Civ'3 overtime made about 4 in 1000 float up. In civ4 you got some mods like these but again,there handicapped by hardcoded flaws which make deep constraints to freedom of size, hindering performance by mid to late late game.
Further more in this regard ..and already previosly stated, (sigh!) Huge maps are something you need to properly drive up the '3rd xpak' expanded tech tree.
These types of "patches cure "plain" game ailments by way of newly added "improvements' and 'wonders'' and even resources! Techs are needed and money is need to get the techs. You see the problem? You need a lot of tiles for a lot of civs to make the game fun and as challenging as it should be

Whew, that shoulda bin a copy n paste job to. See why I rush my typin?

OK and the 'fast way': Its much easier, any jerk can go into the Editer's city limit and turn the 'optimal city #' dial up to 999 citys or whatever.
Part duex would be hit the Government menu and turn all the Gov's in the game to Corruption status: "communal"
Whole job takes no typing and few clicks. You might get about 2 red sheilds per 'pop 20' city . Its not a very real patch. You just cut the problem thing out like a tumor leaving a wide gap in gameplay. Kinda like if you deleted civ4's unreal maintence and left a hole where challenge should be
Civ3 replaces with a new challnge: balance between maintence and corruption but see, I got into this already.
ITs Things that add to the game or save gameplay that consist as a real 'corruption patch' Also why the performance and easy moddin are so imporatant as a whole like I mentined over n over.

Even the tought stuff like you say, its there for you to download and (BIG THING) add new patches to right away!. Much easier then civ4.
Example ALright take " Balancer Reloaded" Its got the better then "pro grade" Pollution patch and the corruption patch I talked about.
It dosn't have the army patch on its " plain" version however .. Easy enough. Go to the "army" in 'units tab' to increase the 'health bar bonus' to whatever it says then " Game setting tab' to adjust the 'units per army' to 1 .
You just repeat from where you saw the idea of better implimentation onto the Balancer Reloaded editer and save.
No crash due to incompatible lines of code which can come up sometime way down the line to ruin your game. Ya, thats a real facet with amatuers modding in civ4 that effects real people unfortunatly