Civilization 5 Steamworks questions/concerns for inclusion in the FAQ

[12agnar0k]

As far as I'm aware Steam makes no attempt to do anything over the internet while in offline mode, and if you are suspicious that it is, then just have your firewall block the application so it can't. If you have a reason to not want it too.

@ Sahkundher "Thank you for your response as well and again as I posted above I wish no offense, but why can't we hear an answer from someone official?"

Why would you need to hear something that I have stated to be fact from someone official, sure if you aren't getting the correct answer from me then ofcourse you will still want it, but if I knew something 100% to be true, then you would "need" no other source of information (though 2 confirmations are better than 1), if you were a bit sceptical you might ask me to prove my information, but you would also ask the same from any 2k representitive. My point, just because I'm not an official representitive of 2K doesn't automatically dismiss everything I say to be merely "a possibility" I know you said no offense intended so I will leave my point there as you weren't really saying this to be true.

As it happens I don't actually know for sure if their will be any regional restrictions (so I can't complain that you are still unsatisfied regarding your answer you want), I just shared what little information I do have, which I can basically sum up as, "Don't buy from Russia or Thailand if you don't plan on playing Civ5 in that country for the rest of your life. Because thier might be some regional restriction there," And as far as I am aware, no Regional Restriction other than this has ever existed for any other Steam game/service, i.e buying in the US would mean you can't play in the UK. Their are Regional Price differences, & Regional Content Difference's though in several cases.

 

[Thoughtful Thug]

Thank you for your response as well and again as I posted above I wish no offense, but why can't we hear an answer from someone official? I'm not the first to ask this question and the prolonged silence from the 2K corporate PR reps is absolutely deafening.

July 26 - Original post on the first page of 2K Greg's Official Civ5 Steamworks FAQ thread.

August 15 - Repost to 2K Greg's thread.

August 17 - Left a message on the account page of 2K Greg.

Should I post my question over at the 2K Games forum on their Civ5 Steam FAQ thread? Should I send a PM to 2K Greg or 2K Elizabeth?

What value is a "Community Manager" that starts a FAQ thread and then doesn't answer (or respond in any way) to the posted question?

They never answer my question regarding compatibility issues with off the shelf retail versions with digital download versions, if ever there will be more DLCs and/or expansion packs in the later future.

 

[Wardancing]

Not trying to defend Steam here but we don't even know if that log is taken when steam was on offline mode as we can't see the time anywhere.

I didnt incude an entire screenshot as my resolution would have made the JPG even larger.

Maybe someone else with a higher post count could verify my findings?

I cleared PG's log, opened the MafiaII demo (offline mode), and was spammed with blocked attempts to the listed IP's.

If no one cares to verify, i could FRAPS a video of a cleared PG log window , then opening the Offline mode demo of mafiaII (will need to redownload and install the demo), but i fear even that isnt really going to be enough proof to some, as we know video's can be manipulated as easily as still images.

By all means, try it yourself and tell me if you have different results. Im using the last version of PG, along with updated iBlocklist's, and whatever MafiaII pc demo is floating around the net. I also allowed steam to update after installation (i needed to, to play the demo).

Again, i believe this is where people have different results in offline mode concerning 'need to update before you can play (in offline mode)', because some people in offline mode have no connection to the net, some with a more secure/controlled connection to the net, while others have a less secure/controlled connection which allows steam to know theres an update, even when in offline mode.

EDIT:::

You should've blurred your steam user account.

It is an account i created today, simply to try 2k's demo.

As far as I'm aware Steam makes no attempt to do anything over the internet while in offline mode, and if you are suspicious that it is, then just have your firewall block the application so it can't. If you have a reason to not want it too.

Do programs pass information to other programs and/or OS processes to communicate to the net? I would guess VAC must do something like this, if not cheats would just always be hidden, no?

I performed my test, and i reported my findings. You are all free to believe this, or believe that. I would rather someone else with PG experience, or iblocklist, to try it out and report back. You could also just add those ip's to your firewalls block, but I dont believe people should need to do that when they tell a program to be in Offline mode.

 

[12agnar0k]

Because of Steam, all games will have all the same files, if they aren't included on the DVD they will be downloaded while Steam is in online mode with the first patch. Which will probably be on day-1.

So it is then likely due to all civ5 versions all having all language files, this is so they can all play together online, i.e non-segregation, that any Civ5 game brought from anywhere can be played with any language, though to load that language may be a Steam function rather than a ingame function, though this is just an assumption, it could work completely illogically.

 

[isndl]

If Civ5 handles languages in the same fashion as Valve's games, changing languages involves deleting your current language files and downloading the new ones. It's still handled by Steam, but you're going to be stuck without a playable game until after it finishes downloading the files. Probably repeat the process again if you want to change it back, unless you manually backed up the files beforehand.

 

[lietkynes]

Maybe someone else with a higher post count could verify my findings?

I just tried this:

1) Launched Steam
2) Clicked on "Steam > Go Offline"
3) Popup appeared "Do you want to restart Steam in offline mode ?", answered "Yes"
4) Steam restarted in Offline mode, no internet traffic from Steam
5) Launched a game (Mount & Blade), no internet traffic from Steam or from the game

I don't know what happens in your case, but I really can't confirm what you are saying.

By the way everyone can try this, just make a Steam account, download a demo of a game or one of the free games and see for yourself.

 

[PieceOfMind]

lietkynes, what were you using to monitor ingoing/outgoing connections?

 

[tom2050]

It's already been shown long ago by a moderator that Steam does communicate in some form to it's servers when offline... it was a very small amount of information none-the-less...

 

[lietkynes]

lietkynes, what were you using to monitor ingoing/outgoing connections?

Firewall

 

[lietkynes]

It's already been shown long ago by a moderator that Steam does communicate in some form to it's servers when offline... it was a very small amount of information none-the-less...

I was in offline mode for little more then 1 minute, zero communication from Steam or the game.

 

[lietkynes]

It's already been shown long ago by a moderator that Steam does communicate in some form to it's servers when offline... it was a very small amount of information none-the-less...

"offline" is different from "offline mode".

Steam can go offline because he can't communicate with the server, in which case he will surely try to reconnect all the time.

 

[tom2050]

You were using Windows Firewall to monitor internet activity?

I was referring to offline mode. Moderator did a test in offline mode and being unconnected to the internet.

 

[lietkynes]

You were using Windows Firewall?

I was using Zone Alarm

And I just repeated the test turning off the firewall and monitoring with Ethereal, same result

But really if you don't trust me try it yourself, it takes less then 5 minutes to create a Steam account, install Steam, download a free game or a demo, go offline and make the test.

 

[lietkynes]

You were using Windows Firewall to monitor internet activity?

I was referring to offline mode. Moderator did a test in offline mode and being unconnected to the internet.

I was always connected to the internet during the test.

 

[tom2050]

But really if you don't trust me try it yourself, it takes less then 5 minutes to create a Steam account, install Steam, download a free game or a demo, go offline and make the test.

You were asked what you were using, and you said "Firewall". From that vague answer, I assume specifics may not be your thing. Thereby, I will wholeheartedly believe the moderator's tests, who gave precise and very detailed info and analysis.

You probably and should have still had activity from other programs and running services on your computer though.

 

[PieceOfMind]

I tried it out using the Resource Monitor provided with Windows 7.

I set the program to run in offline mode.
What I found was there was definitely a small transmission upon launching steam and before it asks you whether to go online or offline. Once I had told it to go into offline mode, I didn't see any further transmission but I didn't watch it for very long.

The transmission I saw was on the order of bytes or tens of bytes at most. I suppose that's just a packet or two. Probably the "hello, are you there?" sort of thing.

 

[lietkynes]

You were asked what you were using, and you said "Firewall". From that vague answer, I assume specifics may not be your thing. Thereby, I will wholeheartedly believe the moderator's tests, who gave precise and very detailed info and analysis.

You probably and should have still had activity from other programs and running services on your computer though.

The moderator test was different then mine. I just found what you were talking about.

He says:

I checked a few times: its not the particular game (Portal) that tries to call home in offline mode - but the steam client. What happens is that the client starts up, checks for an internet connection, attempts to use it and only then opens a window asking the user whether he wants to stay in offline mode or connect to the Steam Server.

Which may be true because it's different from what I did.

In my case Steam was already running and in online mode. Then I switched to offline mode and verified that there is no internet traffic at all from the client. This is a fact that anyone can verify, if you don't believe me it's your problem.

In his case he tried to start Steam directly in offline mode, and found out that the client was checking if an internet connection was available before starting.

I just repeated that exact test, these are the steps:
1) Launched Steam
2) Clicked on "Steam > Go Offline"
3) Popup appeared "Do you want to restart Steam in offline mode ?", answered "Yes"
4) Steam restarted in Offline mode, no internet traffic from Steam
5) Launched a game (Mount & Blade), no internet traffic from Steam or from the game
6) Closed Steam
7) Launched Steam again, got 2 outgoing requests to Steam server
8) Popup appeared asking me how to start, I selected "Start in offline mode"

So yes he is right. If you switch from online mode to offline mode there is no internet traffic. If you start Steam directly in offline mode the client checks if you have an internet connection available before asking you if you want to stay in offline mode or going online. After that I stayed in offline mode for 3 minutes and tried few different games, there was no internet traffic from the Steam client.

 

[Stilgar08]

as I said, Why all this hassle?? Why no different distribution in addition? So Wezqu and everyone who wants can dl from steam and me and others can play freely... *check my sig*

 

[Wezqu]

as I said, Why all this hassle?? Why no different distribution in addition? So Wezqu and everyone who wants can dl from steam and me and others can play freely... *check my sig*

I'm not downloading it. I'm going to install it from dvd. I never buy games from online but I don't have anything against Steam. I have used it since it was released and I don't really have anything bad to say about it anymore. In early days yes as it was still buggy but it still was better than the original multiplayer servers they earlier used.

ps. there is no such thing as "play freely"

 

[12agnar0k]

"What happens is that the client starts up, checks for an internet connection, attempts to use it and only then opens a window asking the user whether he wants to stay in offline mode or connect to the Steam Server."

This is not the Steam Client trying to connect to its friends at home base in secret and passing on information about you, this is Steam check to see if it can connect to the internet so that you can go into online mode, if the check fails then your given the "can't go online, want to play offline?" option, but if it succeeds then it depends on which mode you were on last, if online it will automatically load online, but if it was offline it says "play online or stay offline" or smth like that.

The Steam Client is allowed to check to see if the internet is available for your "go online" option you know. Its not sending all your secrets to homebase or checking to see if thiers any updates it can force you to download or seeing if Steam's cousin has put any new pictures up on facebook about your holdiay, no!, its a normal process for the Steam app.

What you need to check your log information for is further packets sent to the internet while Steam is already running in offline mode.