Clive1 - Monarch (Training ?) game

[Bede]

So you're saying change to theology?

Yup.

Riverbend after FP?

Nope.

I think Riverbend produces too many shields and should probably provide military support for the war in Japan. Smith's is only 600 shields IIRC and we are still a long way out so any town that can get 6-10 spt will probably work for the prebuild.

 

[Sir Clive]

Good start. My old man always told me hit 'em in the jewels first

Quite right he was too

Revised roster


Viper275 -
MSTK- on vacation 31 Jul - 19 Aug
Sir Clive - Just played
mtgfreak - vacation 31 Jul - 13/14 Aug
Admiral Kutzov - Up !!!!
Bede - On deck

It's now 00-45 here and so I'm too knacked to post any sensible comments
but will try to send something tomorrow.

@Admiral - your suggestions sent after my first 5 turns looked good -
unfortunately things have now changed slightly due to the war

Like the idea of thinking about Smith's now - it's something I miss
out on all too often even at Regent level.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

But now I think you see what I mean about WC's in city assaults.

I'm slow, I admit it. What's a WC?

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

A typo, I guess (WC= War Chariot, usually; at least in a Civ surrounding )
He spoke about 3MCs/Swords and their respective roles in city assaults a couple of post earlier.

 

[Bede]

A typo, I guess (WC= War Chariot, usually; at least in a Civ surrounding )
He spoke about 3MCs/Swords and their respective roles in city assaults a couple of post earlier.

You know, the guys in the wheeled thingies with the javelins, not porcelain bowls with chains and water tanks.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

Per forum notes - wholesale changes are bad form unless discussed, Therfore, I sugesst the following:
Emar to rax
Ogliath to pike (rush) - counter attack apparemt at this locale
Hattusha - lib -> rax (wastes 2 shields)
Tyreraq -> lib
Hubishna : change from walls to rax
Karhuyuk : channge to MI
Delhi 3MC then pike
Tarrsus: change to settler
Silk forrest: change from 3MC to MI
OK: change from #mC to aquaduct
Allepo: chnge from 3 MC to MI (this city rocks!)
Ankuwa change from 3MC to MI (12spt)
Ylaburt to rax
Rubble to Ch
Greenland from 3MC to MI
Izumo from walls to pike
Iron river: release the 2 swords to go fight

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

like i said, i'm slow and have trouble distinguishing water closets and war chariots. I thought we were speaking of 3MC earlier.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

What attributes do the guys with the wheeled thingies with the javelins, not porcelain bowls with chains and water tanks have in Conquests? (like I said, I'm slow)

 

[Bede]

Comments in italics


Emar to rax
Town is culturally exposed, not militarily, if anything should have temple or library rushed.

Ogliath to pike (rush) - counter attack apparent at this locale
Switch to barracks and rush. Then upgrade existing garrison to MDI. Shift garrison at Iron River to Ogliath. There are five A2 units inbound. They are not much of a threat to D2 units fortified in a city.

Hattusha - lib -> rax (wastes 2 shields)
The cultural expansion at Hattushas is worth more than another rax in the west, especially that close to Grassy Beach and Silk Forest.

Tyreraq -> lib
Can't seem to find this town.

Hubishna : change from walls to rax
Don't need a rax. Temple or library for cultural expansion, or even a worker to chop the forests at Tyrana

Karhuyuk : change to MI
Marketplace would be a better choice. Again it is too far from the current front to be a military production city. Give the mined hill to Kanesh for 10spt.

Delhi 3MC then pike
Delhi should have all its terrain irrigated so it is very long food, then use the city as a tax and scientist farm.

Tarrsus: change to settler
Let Tarsus complete its acqueduct then retask the city to something other than worker farming. With a library for border expansion and a marketplace it would be real gold producer.

Silk forrest: change from 3MC to MI
There is a forest chop at Silk Forest right now. Rather than waste the 10 shields on military use it for a library or something lasting.

OK: change from #mC to aquaduct
OK is going to have a hard time geting much past 14fpt so an aqueduct won't help much. It is at a solid 10spt right now and is close to the front. Keep building miltary here.

Allepo: chnge from 3 MC to MI (this city rocks!)
This town might make a good candidate for a Smith's prebuild. Using the GA gold we are about 30-35 turns from Economics and Aleppo will produce 600 shields in 36 turns

Ankuwa change from 3MC to MI (12spt)
3MC is better as it upgrades to Knight which upgrades to cavalry. If we need MDI there are 24 swords and 10 warriors available for upgrade. Some are regulars but they make good city defenders.

Ylaburt to rax
This town is far from the heart of the action and the military needs of this quadrant are better met by Kanesh.

Rubble to Ch
This town is really long food and would do well with a granary and could be a worker source for the NE

Greenland from 3MC to MI
With a little micromanaging G-land would be net 15 spt, a really good town for building 3MC's. MDI would waste 5 shields over three turns.

Izumo from walls to pike
Izumo is a really special case. First thing is to make sure all non-resisting citizens are tax collectors. You want to starve out the native Japanese so the city should never produce surplus food. The town can build workers, which will also reduce the population.

Iron river: release the 2 swords to go fight
They should be used at Ogiliath until the threat is reduced or eliminated.

A comment in passing on Desert Filler. It is currently stealing shield producing tile from Riverebend, give it back to RB and you can shave a turn off the FP and give Greenland some more powerful terrain to work.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

IBT Bede's comments noted and adopted (except for change to theology; I'll take care of that next turn). Izumo swords survives 2 horse charges, redlines. Allepo builds 3MC, change to Smith's prebuild. Vineyard completes aquaduct, switch to 3MC. Grassy complets rax, to 3MC. Same for Kanesh. Spice completes walls, to courthouse.

560 Elite swords S of Plains City attacks redlined Japanese horse - wins, no promotion. Disband scout near Plains. Rush rax at Osgliath.

570 Movement preparing for counterpunch, Upgrade warrior at Iron River.

580 Japanese archers make heroic stand in our territory (on grassland!), survive attacks from vet swords, vet 3MC. We take hills overlooking Osaka. 3MC promoted to elite while crushing horse near Izumo (Hot Wheels Brigade). Invasion fleet (Japanese) sighted off our coast. Appears they're making a run at the iron near Pompeii.

IBT FP complete at Riverbend. What to build? Another 3MC promoted elite near Izumo (Wheeled Thunder Brigade). Poor political oversight of war results in capture of worker near Osgliath, Baron Denethor goes back to throne room.

I stopped after 3 turns to be sure I'm not grossly mismanaging the war. I've got 5 3MC arriving at the projected invasion site near the iron SE of Pompeii. Send more? Diverting just enough troops to Osgiliath to hold. Will not open second front during my turn. MDI razing Japanese lux & closing invasion path from Osaka. Plan to raze more roads near Osaka & Kyoto to prevent counter. Will attack Shimonoseki & set up for Tokyo assault on hills to NE of Toyko. Troops from Izumo to move south on Tokyo as well.

Instinct tells me we can't win the race to Sun Tzu and I don't want to spend the money to find out. Build orders for Riverbend?

If get GL, I intend to build army. Outfit with 3MC, MDI or save until Chiv?

I'll finish later today.

 

[Sir Clive]

If get GL, I intend to build army. Outfit with 3MC, MDI or save until Chiv?

I'll finish later today.

Heven't got time to look at the save at the moment - hopefully have a look later and give my views on the war strategy.

Re GL - I always build an army and use it as soon as I get my first leader. Seeing as armies are now stronger than they were in PTW and the AI hardly ever builds them I think they give the human a big advantage. Even if we fill it with relatively weak forces were not going to be coming up against any AI tanks or mech inf just yet so it should stand a chance of doing some damage We must have quite a few elites by now so hopefully we'll get a leader on your turn Admiral !

 

[Bede]

Well done!!

Comment on troop dispositions: keep them concentrated.

Shimoneski is ours, easily. Treb first, then swords, then 3MC, if needed.

City management. Make these changes to boost production. If you want to take the time go through all the miltary towns and try to get to even multiples of 5(any), 6 (pikes and 3MC), 8 (MDI), 10 (any), 15 (3MC or pikes).

With these reassignments Riverbend will do 30spt, that's one 3MC every turn.

With these Greenland is at 15spt

Izumo and all other captured cities need this kind of setup:

Change research to Theology and turn science to 100%. As the turns to learn go down adjust spending downwards.

 

[Sir Clive]

Change research to Theology and turn science to 100%. As the turns to learn go down adjust spending downwards.

Can some one remind me why we are so keen to get Theology quickly ? I know it has been mentioned before but I can't find the original post and Theology is something I never normally go for if I have the Great Library.

 

[Bede]

Theology is the path to Economics and Smith's Trading Company for the commercial benefit, which powers everything else.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

IBT - do my best to adjust cities per Bede.

590 Elite SM near Osgiliath attacks archer, we get GL, build army. Army consists of 2 elite swords and an elite MDI. I didn't upgrade the swords because I wanted the extra health bars. Take Shimonoseki with ease, capture 2 workers. Getting nervous about Russian cultural imperialism, so rush library in Emar since we can't build McDonalds.

IBT- Japanese horse materializes from Orenburg. 1st Japanese Galley sails by 4 3MC who are waiting on the beach of the projected invasion near Pompeii. we wave, they give us the finger. Egypt has theology.

600 Cut last road to Kyoto. Wheeled Thunder wins battle near Osaka, no GL.

IBT - Cathy is annoyed because our scout cut a corner. She has nothing to trade. Japanese request audience - denied. Lose 3MC to horse + archer near Tokyo. Izumo down to one, now allowing growth, start treb (me thinks we need more artillery)

610 Setting up Army Group South for Tokyo campaign

IBT Japanese Suicidal Horse Brigade lands at Shimonoseki, killed by 3MC. Learn Theology from Egypt and Japan. Learn Chivalry from anon.

620 Still arranging Army Group South. Mongols have worker to sell, don't see the point.

IBT Japanese attack kills MDI near Izumo

630 Our Army wins a battle. Still setting up for Operation Olympic

IBT Egypt building KT

640 Occupying high ground around Izumo in the face of kamikaze archers
Army Group South consists of 3 swords, 1 MDI, treb., 9 3MC. GHQ sends go order, the battle for Tokyo is on. Vet sword loses to spear. Elite sword loses to spear. Elite sword loses to spear. Elite MDI def. spear. vet 3mc loses to spear. vet 3mc def. spear. Hot Wheels kills last spear, Tokyo falls.
Raze it - Bede can do better with the city placement (settlers are in the house).

Misc: Our true army is up north near Osgliath for future havok creation & defense. I think the 4 turn settler pump is up - the governor keeps trying to do strange things. There are a couple of knights in play with more on the way. We're researching Education. Riverbend is set to build HE - should we change to KT to deny Egypt? Aleppo still doing smith's prebuild. I'll do dotmap shortly.

Kill 'em all & let God sort it out!

 

[Bede]

Way to rock and roll.

Now let's see what the old monk can do! Yee-hah, silk jammies and a javelin slinging chariot ride. On to Kyoto.

Got it.

 

[Sir Clive]

Revised roster

Viper275 - On deck
MSTK- on vacation 31 Jul - 19 Aug
Sir Clive -
mtgfreak - vacation 31 Jul - 13/14 Aug
Admiral Kutzov - Just played
Bede - Up


Nice set of turns Admiral - told you you would get a leader soon

Is it a good move to put the elites in the army ? Am I right in thinking that an elite in an army cannot produce another leader ?

I normally use all my elites for leader fishing.

@Bede - I am interested in your proposal for Izumo and all captured cities.

I normally just employ as many clowns as I can , maybe rush a temple / library and only allow the minimum starvation possible. Is your proposal to starve right down down to size 1 to eliminate the resistors and then build up again ?

Still haven't had a chance to look at the save I'm afraid but it sounds as if we are in good shape still.

Are we planning to eliminate Japan completely (it certainly sounds as if we have the fire power to be able to do this) or are we going to leave them with something ? I presume they have nothing of worth to give us for peace ?

 

[Bede]

Use taxmen or scientists instead of clowns and starve the city down to 1. Starvation will not happen until the resistance ends BTW. The point of doing so is to avoid contentment problems during an ongoing war or subsequent wars.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

Is it a good move to put the elites in the army ? Am I right in thinking that an elite in an army cannot produce another leader ?

1st elite was the one that generated the GL. so he couldn't generate another GL anyway. 2nd was a sword - I wanted the extra health bar for the army and had elites all over. MDI became elite after joining the army - I'm not sure how this happens, but it works for me.

I normally use all my elites for leader fishing.

Conquests doesn't seem to let you build much with leaders, so I didn't worry about it as much

@Bede, just in case, FYI, there's a stack of 3MC just sitting by the volcano for the invasion that never came. (IF you haven't seen it already)

Re the caputred cities, I took Bede's advice with one exception, I had content cit on mountain for more shields to speed worker production (Izumo). I was correct in my assumption that captured cities hould begin to produce/grow again once they drop to one pop?

I had to reload windows recently - paint is giving me problems and won't let me save as anything but bmp. Anybody have any suggestions? No dotmap for now.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

Can we build HE with GL? If we can, like the idea of switching riverbend to KT (lots of elites running around)