Commanders have a huge flaw

[Leyrann]

If I wanted to have a Commander on garrison duty I'd usually pick the promotion that grants +1 Gold per packed unit, but not being able to act after unpacking can be fatal.

Wouldn't +5% to all yields be better?

1 gold per packed unit is up to 6 gold.

5% to all yields means you've got 6 yields per turn (most of them more valuable than gold) if your city produces just 20 of each yield.

 

[Melkus]

1 gold per packed unit is up to 6 gold

And you would have to keep your units, which cost maintenance, packed at all times. And you would have to use yet another promotion to even get it from 4 to 6.

Maybe "no maintenance for packed units" would scale better - though it sounds worse.

 

[UWHabs]

I guess the advantage of 1 gold per packed unit is that counts while travelling. But yeah, 5% to yields is a lot stronger if it's just there as a garrison commander.

 

[The_goggles_do_nothing]

Military Academies started popping up in Europe at right about the initial period of the game's Modern Age: a new Building that, perhaps, gives 1 XP point per commander with the payment of Inluence/Gold/Production, etc?

Great people can give commander promotions. A Military academies could allow you to produce ‘instructors’ that grant XP.

If you want to farm XP just forward settle a IP and place some fortified infantry with a commander between the cities.

 

[BarbarianHunter]

And you would have to keep your units, which cost maintenance, packed at all times. And you would have to use yet another promotion to even get it from 4 to 6.

Maybe "no maintenance for packed units" would scale better - though it sounds worse.

I gladly use yet another promotion to get the pack max from 4 to 6. So far as I know, if units are packed, they can carry over to the next age and there's quite a lot of production there if you have 4 commanders. Plus you need 33% less comanders to carry the same number of units across to the next age (and the more commanders you build, the more they cost).

 

[Leyrann]

So far as I know, if units are packed, they can carry over to the next age and there's quite a lot of production there if you have 4 commanders.

Afaik you carry over 6 units plus however many you can pack in your commanders, and at a minimum start an Age with 6 units.

But honestly if I have three filled commanders that's 18 units without bonus slots, that is more than enough for me.

 

[Siptah]

I tend to have 2-3 high level army commanders in my games, and one fleet commander.

I tend to have at least 2 in antiquity, either to both "guide" one larger army or because I've split my army. In the latter case, I might want to have 3 commanders already in antiquity.

In terms of promotions, I think it depends a bit and I like to spread them out (e.g., no two commanders are too similar). The defense and assault trees are nice for actual fighting, but logistics and maneuver are super helpful as well. I would mix and match the trees more often if the commendation points for finishing a tree wouldn't be so good. I also think that the use depends a bit more on difficulty: I tend to loose more units on immortal than on sovereign, hence the raw CS from assault and defense might be preferable to logistics.

I haven't really looked much into leadership, that tree seems weaker than the others. Mainly because it needs a first promotion that allows to get EXP from having it stationed (e.g., 5 exp per building built in that city while stationed)?

I really like commanders and especially the support mechanic! So many clicks saved and yet additional choices offered...

 

[ColPaladin]

You guys are giving good opinions, but from an aggressive player standpoint. I am a defensive, diplomatic player, and I have been trying to get it so my commanders give bonuses to the cities they are stationed in, but you just can't get XP to do so if you are playing defensive, and playing offensive to get XP just get's you into wars in the end anyway. If only gold; culture or maybe even diplomatic resource could be used to spend on XP on the right 3 sections.

 

[MasterPaw]

You guys are giving good opinions, but from an aggressive player standpoint. I am a defensive, diplomatic player, and I have been trying to get it so my commanders give bonuses to the cities they are stationed in, but you just can't get XP to do so if you are playing defensive, and playing offensive to get XP just get's you into wars in the end anyway. If only gold; culture or maybe even diplomatic resource could be used to spend on XP on the right 3 sections.

yeah there should be some other way to level up, maybe giving Commander first perk being to give passive xp

Maneuver is good at offense I don't think this tree is too bad

 

[Tanel]

yeah there should be some other way to level up, maybe giving Commander first perk being to give passive xp

Maneuver is good at offense I don't think this tree is too bad

Or have Commanders gain +1 XP per turn when stationed on a military building. Could also give +1XP when a military unit is trained in a city the commander is stationed in.

 

[Leyrann]

You guys are giving good opinions, but from an aggressive player standpoint. I am a defensive, diplomatic player, and I have been trying to get it so my commanders give bonuses to the cities they are stationed in, but you just can't get XP to do so if you are playing defensive, and playing offensive to get XP just get's you into wars in the end anyway. If only gold; culture or maybe even diplomatic resource could be used to spend on XP on the right 3 sections.

Surprise, military linchpin units are most useful when coupled with a militaristic strategy.

 

[Mr Jon of Cheam]

You guys are giving good opinions, but from an aggressive player standpoint. I am a defensive, diplomatic player, and I have been trying to get it so my commanders give bonuses to the cities they are stationed in, but you just can't get XP to do so if you are playing defensive, and playing offensive to get XP just get's you into wars in the end anyway. If only gold; culture or maybe even diplomatic resource could be used to spend on XP on the right 3 sections.

I presume you've tried just farming hostile IPs for XP early and then befriending them? Perhaps this doesn't give enough XP? Or do you just try to avoid all combat?

I like the suggestions of having them gain XP if stationed on specific buildings.

 

[JNR13]

When I'm aiming for a peaceful playthrough, I just get my Commanders a single level by fighting independents and put it into the +5% yields, then station them in a city.

 

[Jeppetto]

It would be interesting to have a "peaceful" section with a different way of gaining points.

Maybe have Commanders start with free Promotion, taking the first Promo from one of the trees which specializes them in that direction and that first Promo determines from what they gain alternative XP.

 

[King of Prussia]

Having commanders start with free promotions in later era would be nice, or at least if they were recruited in cities with the eras barracks. Ive been using the end of ancient era to build/buy mine, and not bother with making them later. Having them earlier saves more troops, and more likely to make use of them. Naval/Air commanders are an exception in later eras, but they are also very cheap comparatively.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Having commanders start with free promotions in later era would be nice, or at least if they were recruited in cities with the eras barracks. Ive been using the end of ancient era to build/buy mine, and not bother with making them later. Having them earlier saves more troops, and more likely to make use of them. Naval/Air commanders are an exception in later eras, but they are also very cheap comparatively.

Hiring commanders with promotions in later ages already would undermine the idea you've expressed in the next sentence - to hire commanders earlier.

I think it's ok - even green commanders are useful to gather troops and they get their promotions really quickly, when get near real fight.

 

[King of Prussia]

Hiring commanders with promotions in later ages already would undermine the idea you've expressed in the next sentence - to hire commanders earlier.

I think it's ok - even green commanders are useful to gather troops and they get their promotions really quickly, when get near real fight.

i dont think having new commanders in the modern era having 1-2 promotions in cities with a "barracks" would make recruiting ones earlier worse off.(or 1 point in explo, and 2 in modern) You keep more troops over era changes, and the ones from earlier eras may already have that and more promotion wise, unless you have played a very peaceful game.

Should they add a way to get more passive xp, then this would further make earlier commanders better. This would make new commanders have a bit better start. Air commanders currently start with a free promotion, tho idk why.

 

[Vincent_lacruz]

i dont think having new commanders in the modern era having 1-2 promotions in cities with a "barracks" would make recruiting ones earlier worse off.(or 1 point in explo, and 2 in modern) You keep more troops over era changes, and the ones from earlier eras may already have that and more promotion wise, unless you have played a very peaceful game.

Should they add a way to get more passive xp, then this would further make earlier commanders better. This would make new commanders have a bit better start. Air commanders currently start with a free promotion, tho idk why.

Having such boosts at recruiting would undermine some of the more militarist civs that gets a bonus on commanders (such as Persia that gets the "initiative" upgrade for free with its Hazarapatis).

And, overall, a commander level up quite fast, and only need two upgrade (initiative and movement) to be efficient (the other upgrades are definitively usefull, but less crucial than those two). Just position it near a hostile IP, or just an angry neighbour, and stay defensive (two melee and two range are enough), and in e fews turn they will gain enough levels.

 

[King of Prussia]

Having such boosts at recruiting would undermine some of the more militarist civs that gets a bonus on commanders (such as Persia that gets the "initiative" upgrade for free with its Hazarapatis).

And, overall, a commander level up quite fast, and only need two upgrade (initiative and movement) to be efficient (the other upgrades are definitively usefull, but less crucial than those two). Just position it near a hostile IP, or just an angry neighbour, and stay defensive (two melee and two range are enough), and in e fews turn they will gain enough levels.

Personally i dont think it would make the militarist civs worse off. They would still get the free promotion/commendation regardless, on top of the above. It would probably be a buff for them tbh. You will want to build more commanders, and rush the "barracks" for production.

Hostile IPs are only a thing in the first era. The other 2 they just die in a few turns, as the AI has nothing better to do than march their armies over and kill them in the first 5-10 turns. They probably shouldnt start hostile in later eras tbh. At least not in a full campaign. I havent tried the later start settings. Maybe if you are lucky, youll have a commander near them when they spawn, and can block the AI off.

Farming xp from neighbors is doable, but if the first promotions are so easy to get, i dont see why giving a free point for new commanders after building a "barracks" in later eras is a negative against that.


On the topic of promotions, i would not be surprised if they move initiative deeper in the assault tree. Its just that good. Maybe they move it down to be like the logistics branch, and the +2 ranged and +2 melee are the first 2 options that go into initiative. They said in their stream that they are tracking this data, so i would assume they would change things up. The +1 movement is also very good, but i wouldnt consider it as strong as initative.

 

[MasterPaw]

Having commanders start with free promotions in later era would be nice, or at least if they were recruited in cities with the eras barracks. Ive been using the end of ancient era to build/buy mine, and not bother with making them later. Having them earlier saves more troops, and more likely to make use of them. Naval/Air commanders are an exception in later eras, but they are also very cheap comparatively.

There is a barrack building that does that in era 3