Countering crime in the early eras

[Zanteogo]

The disorder reduction role is taken over by the "police" building line after the armory. Every unhappiness source can be reduced by four different buildings. For crime, the buildings are thus Barracks -> Armory -> Constabulary -> Police Station.

Plus defensive buildings... (Wall, castle ect...)

The whole happyness system is actually crazy complex in CPP. Sometimes I will be in a unhappyness hole I just can't find a way out (it usually occurs when your population grows faster than your tech and production). Often it will take one of the happyness social policies to give my the boost to get out of it. I will even sometimes have my happyness change mid turn for some reason, or be different after a save, exit and reload, though I imagine this is more bug related.

Part of the problem is the more unhappy your civ is, the harder it is to do things to make your civ happy. Thankfully being unhappy seems to be overall less painful in CPP, but making an unhappy slump into happyness is much harder.

 

[Gazebo]

Plus defensive buildings... (Wall, castle ect...)

The whole happyness system is actually crazy complex in CPP. Sometimes I will be in a unhappyness hole I just can't find a way out (it usually occurs when your population grows faster than your tech and production). Often it will take one of the happyness social policies to give my the boost to get out of it. I will even sometimes have my happyness change mid turn for some reason, or be different after a save, exit and reload, though I imagine this is more bug related.

Part of the problem is the more unhappy your civ is, the harder it is to do things to make your civ happy. Thankfully being unhappy seems to be overall less painful in CPP, but making an unhappy slump into happyness is much harder.

Being unhappy does not affect city yields (except growth), only 'national' yields, so it doesn't slow you down production-wise.

G

 

[Zanteogo]

Being unhappy does not affect city yields (except growth), only 'national' yields, so it doesn't slow you down production-wise.

G

It's the gold and science hit that makes it harder. Keeping your civ up to date for it's population size seems to be the key to staying out of the unhappiness hole. If you're behind in your tech or don't have gold to rush key buildings you can actually get to a point where you are going one step forward and two steps back. This is not exactly a problem, it just means you need to do some good early planing. Certainly makes it difficult to be a war civ however.

As I said before, and it's just my own personal feeling of course, I don't like the fact that once cities become a certain size you pretty much need them to become "general" type cities or else they become massive downward happiness sinks. I know you still have to decide what order everything is built in. (for example, if its a city that's likely to be attacked, building walls sooner it a good idea) I just wish I could "focus" cities better late game.

 

[ExpiredReign]

The disorder reduction role is taken over by the "police" building line after the armory. Every unhappiness source can be reduced by four different buildings. For crime, the buildings are thus Barracks -> Armory -> Constabulary -> Police Station.

If that's true then it needs to be made clear somehow to the user. Whilst I can see there being 'some' logic in this change, not enough logic I'm afraid for a new player to leap to that conclusion.

 

[Funak]

If that's true then it needs to be made clear somehow to the user. Whilst I can see there being 'some' logic in this change, not enough logic I'm afraid for a new player to leap to that conclusion.

It is clear, it is written right there in the building description.

 

[Gamewizard]

Plus defensive buildings... (Wall, castle ect...)

The whole happyness system is actually crazy complex in CPP. Sometimes I will be in a unhappyness hole I just can't find a way out (it usually occurs when your population grows faster than your tech and production). Often it will take one of the happyness social policies to give my the boost to get out of it. I will even sometimes have my happyness change mid turn for some reason, or be different after a save, exit and reload, though I imagine this is more bug related.

Part of the problem is the more unhappy your civ is, the harder it is to do things to make your civ happy. Thankfully being unhappy seems to be overall less painful in CPP, but making an unhappy slump into happyness is much harder.

But defensive buildings don't decrease the crime threshold like barracks or constabularies, they only increase a city's defense.

 

[Zanteogo]

But defensive buildings don't decrease the crime threshold like barracks or constabularies, they only increase a city's defense.

Don't they?

Is the crime rating not based of the defence rating of a city by its population? Buildings like barracks lower the number by a certain %.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

 

[ExpiredReign]

I'm pretty sure they do, but hell, what do I know? After all this is all supposed to be straight-forward and logical to users.

Last sentence is intentionally sarcastic and to be taken in jest and not as a snipe at the mod.

 

[Zanteogo]

My understanding was boredom and illiterate was the same way (using culture and science), crime used defence.

Again, I may be wrong.

 

[Gamewizard]

Don't they?

Is the crime rating not based of the defence rating of a city by its population? Buildings like barracks lower the number by a certain %.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

Exactly, barracks and constabularies decrease the amount of city defense needed to remain happy, walls and castles increase city defense.

 

[BenchBreaker]

Basically you can think of each type of unhappiness as a progress bar, in order to be completely happy, all the progress bars for the various yields needs to be filled.

Now the higher the city's population, the larger the bars that needs to be filled. ( i.e. higher cap or total yields required)

There are two ways to make the bar 'more filled' and thus reduce happiness:

1) Increase the yields: - e.g. walls, castles, specialists etc
2) Reduce the cap: - e.g. barracks, constabularies

Some buildings do both: - e.g. libraries both increase yield and reduce the cap required.

Some examples (note the numbers are not accurate, they are just for hypothetical illustration purposes)

Say you 10 pop city need 20 to be happy, but your city only have 10 , so the progress bar look like

10/20 -> resulting in 5 unhappiness from crime

now you build a wall which increse the by 4 so now the progress bar look like:

14/20 -> resulting in 3 unhappiness from crime

now you build a barracks which reduce the cap required by 10% thus the progress bar looks like:

14/18 - > now only 2 unhappiness from crime

now your city grows to 11 pop and the cap increased by 2 (reduced by 10% to 1.8 through barracks) and now progress bar looks like

14/19.8


I dont know if it is possible but it might be a good idea to show these kinds of progress bars for each type of unhappiness in the UI, I think it will be much more transparent and easier to understand in relations to what effects the various buildings have

 

[Gazebo]

Basically you can think of each type of unhappiness as a progress bar, in order to be completely happy, all the progress bars for the various yields needs to be filled.

Now the higher the city's population, the larger the bars that needs to be filled. ( i.e. higher cap or total yields required)

There are two ways to make the bar 'more filled' and thus reduce happiness:

1) Increase the yields: - e.g. walls, castles, specialists etc
2) Reduce the cap: - e.g. barracks, constabularies

Some buildings do both: - e.g. libraries both increase yield and reduce the cap required.

Some examples (note the numbers are not accurate, they are just for hypothetical illustration purposes)

Say you 10 pop city need 20 to be happy, but your city only have 10 , so the progress bar look like

10/20 -> resulting in 5 unhappiness from crime

now you build a wall which increse the by 4 so now the progress bar look like:

14/20 -> resulting in 3 unhappiness from crime

now you build a barracks which reduce the cap required by 10% thus the progress bar looks like:

14/18 - > now only 2 unhappiness from crime

now your city grows to 11 pop and the cap increased by 2 (reduced by 10% to 1.8 through barracks) and now progress bar looks like

14/19.8


I dont know if it is possible but it might be a good idea to show these kinds of progress bars for each type of unhappiness in the UI, I think it will be much more transparent and easier to understand in relations to what effects the various buildings have

These already exist for building tooltips if the building has a need reduction modifier.

 

[BenchBreaker]

I am aware of the tooltip in buildings reducing needs, but the wording is rather unclear. also might be a good idea to highlight the total yield deficient for the city instead of the per requirements because decisions are rarely made based on per citizen values and it all becomes rather confusing

Currently it shows the deficient values (which is the most important value) below the produces 1.xx per needs 2.xx per stuff which obscures it. It should be easy to see this value, it should be easy to glance that a city need 4 to combat poverty so the player will simply respond by running run a merchant specialist

Might also be a good idea to add the actual deficient values next to the number of unhappy citizens in each in each category when you hover over the city bar on the overmap

 

[Gazebo]

I am aware of the tooltip in buildings reducing needs, but the wording is rather unclear. also might be a good idea to highlight the total yield deficient for the city instead of the per requirements because decisions are rarely made based on per citizen values and it all becomes rather confusing

Currently it shows the deficient values (which is the most important value) below the produces 1.xx per needs 2.xx per stuff which obscures it. It should be easy to see this value, it should be easy to glance that a city need 4 to combat poverty so the player will simply respond by running run a merchant specialist

Might also be a good idea to add the actual deficient values next to the number of unhappy citizens in each in each category when you hover over the city bar on the overmap

It already has this (the total yield) in the tooltips.

Not adding more data to banners, as they're already very expensive lua-wise and getting too busy.

G

 

[Nataris]

Barracks has to say "reduce crime" because they don't add city defense. With the walls there is no need to say "reduces crime", because walls adds city defense. That's just what they do. And the lack of city defense is just what crime is.

As a new CP player, I don't agree with this.

The way it represented itself was almost that specific buildings reduce unhappiness while others dont.
I understand this is simply a misunderstanding on my part,but having it say for all buildings isn't a terrible idea.