[R&F] Cree UU Okihtcitaw - Any use for it?

[Hammurabbit]

So I just tried out Poundmaker and had quite high hopes that its UU, a scout replacement, would shake up the early game a bit. Right now I would consider it one of the worst UU. it's as strong as a warrior, but faster - on the other hand
- it doesnt get the bonus against anti-cav units (+10!) which the warrior gets. This is a big deal early on, since almost all barb-camps are guarded by a spearman.
- No "Agoge" production bonus make them quite expensive to build
- The promotion path is not great, at least not the first couple of promotions (otoh you get one promotion for free)
- Takes a loooong time to upgrade and then to a pretty useless ranger.

I wash hoping it would be useful as an offensive unit, but it just seem to be a slightly less squishy scout. And I usually only build 1-2 scouts per game so it's pretty irrelevant.

Anyone found a good strategy with the Okihtcitaw ?

 

[Ferocitus]

So I just tried out Poundmaker and had quite high hopes that its UU, a scout replacement, would shake up the early game a bit. Right now I would consider it one of the worst UU. it's as strong as a warrior, but faster - on the other hand
- it doesnt get the bonus against anti-cav units (+10!) which the warrior gets. This is a big deal early on, since almost all barb-camps are guarded by a spearman.
- No "Agoge" production bonus make them quite expensive to build
- The promotion path is not great, at least not the first couple of promotions (otoh you get one promotion for free)
- Takes a loooong time to upgrade and then to a pretty useless ranger.

I wash hoping it would be useful as an offensive unit, but it just seem to be a slightly less squishy scout. And I usually only build 1-2 scouts per game so it's pretty irrelevant.

Anyone found a good strategy with the Okihtcitaw ?

I used them for stealing settlers and builders early. They
have enough strength to take a hit or two and run for it.

 

[Morningcalm]

I use it to quickly capture enemy cities--they are swift and have nice LOS so they are invaluable at picking off weak targets. I used them to clear barbarians and then take enemy cities in multiplayer. Until the Mongols made knights, my Cree armies were all okhitichaw and ranged units (archers and catapults). With sufficient promotions they are basically warriors on horses with more LOS.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

They are, as you say, just a more robust Scout. Use them as you would use a Scout. Hopefully you will collect more tribal villages, meet more civs and city-states, and generate more Era points than you would with a regular Scout.

 

[Amrunril]

One advantage of the Cree UU is that, by being an ancient UU and scouting more effectively, it makes it very easy to get a classical golden age. Otherwise, I would agree that it's a somewhat mediocre UU, useful, but not worth building a military strategy around.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

Just an idea here, but what if survey policy gave recon units +1 sight? Woul that be too much or just enough to make people use it more? Bonus to production would be fine too but I was thinking maybe something more interesting. I think it would make the cree uu more valuable.

 

[Lord Lakely]

Okichitaw upgrade into Rangers, which is a good thing btw. Ranger Corps and Armies are great at crippling the AI during sieges, chipping away at their units and cities, pillaging, raiding and soaking up bombardement fire as you move in with your Artillery. Especially after that +20 strength promotion which the Cree reach must faster than normal.

 

[liv]

I found them weak. Too costly units.
I am not sure if they can be used to increase loyalty by placing them in cities. If that is true then at least there is something they can do after the classical era

 

[Softly]

Recon units should get full or at least double xp from fighting barbarians.

 

[UWHabs]

I did find it was nice to have scouts that could take a little bit of a beating, but yeah, I think they're just not quite strong enough to really be able to either be a primary force of an attack, or to be much more than just a regular scout. At the very least they shouldn't be more expensive than a regular scout.

 

[Benzombie]

I found that they're really good for keeping barbs away on multiple fronts for me personally. Its safer for me to settle and protect new cities.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

I wish the developers wouldn't make unique units cost more than their normal counterparts. Unique districts come with bonuses and cost half price, but unique units often have cost bump ups in line with their strength increases. Very odd design choice.

I've played a number of games as the Cree, and find the Okihtcitaw really slowed my opening down. Unlike a Warrior, they can't take out a barbarian camp on their own (or at least I can't do this with them), so they're no use for farming barb camps. Relative to Scouts, they take longer to produce, which slows down early exploration/expansion compared to any other civ.

I went into the games thinking, "unique scouts, let's try a scout opening". After a couple of tries, I decided, "nope, play the Cree when you want to delay exploration". So now my thinking with the Cree is, explore exclusively with your starting Warrior (and later Slingers/Archers) while you start Builder, Settler. Switch to a Slinger if you're discovered by barbs your Warrior can't eliminate quickly. Hold on to your free Trader until you find a route it can traverse safely or you can build a Slinger to patrol the trading route. Wait on building your first Okihtchitaw until you need the era score or you're close to being able to upgrade to Explorers; by that point, their extra cost won't impact your build times in a material way, and you'll still be on the path to the stronger Rangers.

Mind, a free recon unit from a tribal village is a bonus for the Cree compared to other civs (unless it messes up your era score planning).

 

[CPWimmer]

At the very least they shouldn't be more expensive than a regular scout.

I think that's where the big disappointment is. If they had been priced the same as a normal scout (or maybe a slinger), instead of a warrior, I think that they would have been perfect.

In addition, it is a shame that you have to hard build your first one, instead of getting one free as a replacement to the Warrior as your first unit. They might have done that to trigger the Era Score Historic Moment, how do the Aztec handle that?

 

[Morningcalm]

Do the Cree get extra era score from building multiple Okhitichaw?

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

Do the Cree get extra era score from building multiple Okhitichaw?

Nope. +4 for the first one, only.

Edit: +4, not +3. My memory's useless.

 

[Morningcalm]

Nope. +3 for the first one, only.

Yeah, makes sense. I spammed them in my multiplayer game and didn't get a Golden Age. Did help me wipe out my neighbor's nearby cities though. And I razed a citystate my Mongolian neighbor was allied with.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

Yeah, makes sense. I spammed them in my multiplayer game and didn't get a Golden Age. Did help me wipe out my neighbor's nearby cities though. And I razed a citystate my Mongolian neighbor was allied with.

Interesting. They're not strong enough (in my hands) to take out AI cities without Slinger/Archer support. Maybe that's because of AI combat bonuses (or my own tactical inefficiencies). I haven't tried them on their own against a City State. And against humans, I suppose their extra movement could make for a faster rush. I find it hard to imagine getting enough of them built fast enough to take someone down unless they've completed ignored building a defence force, but I haven't played multiplayer, so not sure what the standard opening gambits are.

 

[Eliminator_Sr]

how do the Aztec handle that?

Aztec get the +4 era points immediately - you don't have to hard build.

 

[Pietato]

They are not too bad. They at least have a use, unlike rubbish like the Samurai and Berserker. If they were given a bonus against barbarians they would be great.

 

[Lily_Lancer]

Not really a negative one. It can provide 4 era score when you find yourself 1~4 points short to a golden age. Unlike Aztec Eagle Warriors or Roman Legions, this UU does not have other usages and do not happen to appear on an upgrade line or so, so if you already have enough points you can save this 4 points for the next era or so. It also does not cost much. So you can consider it a very flexible 4 era points. (In Contrary, Samurais, Berserkers, etc's era points are costly.)