Culture (Unit + Quarter) Speculation Thread

Who will you play first?

  • Assyrians

    Votes: 2 2.9%
  • Babylonians

    Votes: 5 7.2%
  • Egyptians

    Votes: 5 7.2%
  • Harappans

    Votes: 12 17.4%
  • Hittites

    Votes: 2 2.9%
  • Mycenaeans

    Votes: 5 7.2%
  • Nubians

    Votes: 3 4.3%
  • Olmecs

    Votes: 6 8.7%
  • Phoenicians

    Votes: 10 14.5%
  • Zhou

    Votes: 9 13.0%
  • Random

    Votes: 10 14.5%

  • Total voters
    69
Much like Rome in 410 the Goth's have caught me by surprise! While I watch my valuables be carried away I'm left to ponder what happend to the Celts? Both Celts and Gauls have been seemingly removed as candidates and yet we still have that early discussion about the game where an Amplitude dev mentioned a celt civ in reference to an event that would have a unique option if you were playing as the celts.

So has it changed or is a celtic civ still on cards? If so who could it be? I'm starting to think Pict's to be a possibility.
 
Much like Rome in 410 the Goth's have caught me by surprise! While I watch my valuables be carried away I'm left to ponder what happend to the Celts? Both Celts and Gauls have been seemingly removed as candidates and yet we still have that early discussion about the game where an Amplitude dev mentioned a celt civ in reference to an event that would have a unique option if you were playing as the celts.

So has it changed or is a celtic civ still on cards? If so who could it be? I'm starting to think Pict's to be a possibility.
Picts would be entirely reasonable and I would be down with seeing them there.
 
Picts would be entirely reasonable and I would be down with seeing them there.

Got nothing against the Picts - in fact, in pursuit of Dark Age miniature gaming, I've painted a bunch of them and done a bunch of research on them, but calling them Classical is a stretch. They are mentioned as successors to the Caledonii by the Romans in Britain very late in the Empire, so they barely show up in time to catch the end of the Classical Era, and the 'height' of the Pictish influence was the 6th to 9th centuries CE, or firmly in the early Medieval Era where they compete with Anglo-Saxons, Proto-Scots (Dal Riada and Scottii from Ireland) and the Irish.

The other 'problem' with them is that, while they have a lot of Celtic influences on them - especially by the 7th century CE or so when they've been in contact with various Celtic groups for a few hundred years - there is some pretty fierce academic debate on whether they were Celtic to start with, or a Pre-Celtic North Briton group.

So, as a Classical replacement for Celts, not so much. As an intriguing Medieval Faction with potentially lots of Celtic elements - Bring 'em On!
 
Interesting and pleased to see the Goths included!

I wonder too if and how a Celtic culture will be portrayed. Alphabetically, it’s too late for many of the obvious choices (Arverni, Belgae, Brigantes, Britons, Catuvellauni, Eburones, Gauls, Gaels...)

We’ve still got Iceni, Helvetians, Senones, and Picts...

I agree with Boris that Picts (and Gaels) are more medieval era cultures. Senones would seem to be another militaristic culture which seems unlikely. Helvetians would possibly be the best remaining candidate, but honestly I’m surprised they didn’t go with Gauls (especially with a French development team!)

Maybe the rumours were wrong/mistaken all along...
 
Yeah I'm thinking that either Iceni or Helvetii could be solid choices, and maybe even Iceni might have a better chance because it can be a starting point for a british culture tree. (besides, Amplitude seem to have a thing for war cart emblematic units.)

Honestly Celts as an overall term might be better for DLC down the road, with Celts in ancient, and a number of variations down the road all the way to Ireland.
 
If they did, we'll really have to wonder what it is about beginning with "G" that makes it difficult to alphabetize correctly.

How's this for Straw-Clutching:
They got confused in the correct alphabetizing of 'G' because 'G' comes before 'D' in the original Phoenician, ancient and modern Greek and Russian Cyrillic alphabets. Since Greeks and Phoenicians are both in the game, the conversion to Roman alphabet was too much for them . . .

Or, since they are based in Paris, they're going with the Parisi Celtic tribe that lived in the area - it's all about geographical continuity.
 
I'd be surpised if it was a specific Celtic tribe seeing as they have gone with Goths rather than Ostrogoths or Visigoths but then who knows? Theres no rules although I'm still hoping they will be Agrarian still.
 
Which classical civ could be good for agrarian besides a Celtic one though? For Greece, Rome, Persia and the Mayans, something more fitting comes to mind. Ptolemaic Egypt? Maurya?
 
I am surprised a French company would leave out Les Gaulois. Oh well, I'm sure they'll come in DLC.

As we now know 7 classical cultures (Aksumites, Carthaginians, Goths, Greeks, Mayans, Persians, Romans), I'm guessing the last three are Magadhan (i.e. Maurya and/or Gupta), Tiwanaku (fingers crossed!) or Moche, and yes... the Han (the picture of two men playing go.)
 
Which classical civ could be good for agrarian besides a Celtic one though? For Greece, Rome, Persia and the Mayans, something more fitting comes to mind. Ptolemaic Egypt? Maurya?

That's something that's puzzled me too.
 
Perhaps you're right with Maurya as a direct successor to Harrapans. Theres gotta be a celtic civ though unless their plans changed at some point or the developer was just using them as an example.
 
I am surprised a French company would leave out Les Gaulois. Oh well, I'm sure they'll come in DLC.

As we now know 7 classical cultures (Aksumites, Carthaginians, Goths, Greeks, Mayans, Persians, Romans), I'm guessing the last three are Magadhan (i.e. Maurya and/or Gupta), Tiwanaku (fingers crossed!) or Moche, and yes... the Han (the picture of two men playing go.)

The 7 known cover, geographically, the Mediterranean like a blanket (Rome, Greece, Carthage), central America (Mayan), Middle East (Persia), eastern Europe (Goths), Horn of Africa (Aksumites). Some of them are also 'natural' extensions of the Ancient/Bronze Era Factions:
Nubian - Aksumite
Phoenician - Carthaginian
Mycenean - Greek
Babylonian - Persian

So, what's left Uncovered in Classical: East Asia, South Asia, central Asia, Northern Europe.
South and North America are real Long Shots: I don't think a South American Faction is an impossibility, especially if they follow up in Medieval or Renaissance with Inca, but any North American Faction would be a stretch: Cahokia? Puebla/Anasazi? and there's little or no 'follow up' Faction possible.

In East Asia, as stated, the Han leap to mind: long-lasting, could be Militarist or Expansionist or even Agrarian, so could fit a number of empty 'slots'.
In South Asia, it's really a bit early for anybody from the southeast, so the Mauryan or Guptan Indian Factions make sense - and also provide a Follow On to the Harappans, and could be, again, Agrarian, or Expansionist or even Aesthete with a little cutting and bending at the corners.
Central Asia cries out for Something. This was the Era (1000 - 800 BCE to 500 CE) when the first of the great Mounted Pastorals appear: Scythians, Xiong-Nu, Huns, Sarmatians, and if they are not going to have a specifically Nomad Faction for us, at least to cover the area geographically would, I would think, be a consideration.

And we still have that enigmatic 'Hun Horde' spotted on one of the Amplitude boards that has not been explained. IF it's not a Special Mechanism or Minor Faction, it's got to be associated with a Central Asian Faction of some kind, and if it's an early Code or Cover Word, it doesn't even have to specifically mean Huns.

Northern Europe. IF it's not Celts, there's not much else left. The Germanic tribes were numerous, but totally without cities in the Classical Era - and almost as 'nomadic' as the mounted groups further east. Britons all the way up in the islands have so much Celtic influence already that it would be a chore separating them: you'd be far better off going with the established and fairly well-known Celtic Gauls of Vercingetorix, Dumnorix, Asterix and Getafix. Shucks, between Druids and Nematons Oppidum and Menhirs half the graphic and Emblematic work is already done for you!
 
Got nothing against the Picts - in fact, in pursuit of Dark Age miniature gaming, I've painted a bunch of them and done a bunch of research on them, but calling them Classical is a stretch. They are mentioned as successors to the Caledonii by the Romans in Britain very late in the Empire, so they barely show up in time to catch the end of the Classical Era, and the 'height' of the Pictish influence was the 6th to 9th centuries CE, or firmly in the early Medieval Era where they compete with Anglo-Saxons, Proto-Scots (Dal Riada and Scottii from Ireland) and the Irish.

The other 'problem' with them is that, while they have a lot of Celtic influences on them - especially by the 7th century CE or so when they've been in contact with various Celtic groups for a few hundred years - there is some pretty fierce academic debate on whether they were Celtic to start with, or a Pre-Celtic North Briton group.

So, as a Classical replacement for Celts, not so much. As an intriguing Medieval Faction with potentially lots of Celtic elements - Bring 'em On!
Thanks for that analysis! I didn't realize how much of a stretch my brain was making.

I blame Civ V Celts with their spearman-replacing Icenii queen Pictish Warriors for my oversight :P
 
I am surprised a French company would leave out Les Gaulois. Oh well, I'm sure they'll come in DLC.

As we now know 7 classical cultures (Aksumites, Carthaginians, Goths, Greeks, Mayans, Persians, Romans), I'm guessing the last three are Magadhan (i.e. Maurya and/or Gupta), Tiwanaku (fingers crossed!) or Moche, and yes... the Han (the picture of two men playing go.)

I sincerely hope you are right, and that article mentioning only Zhou, Ming, and PRC is wrong (or seems incomplete due to info at the time). It seems almost criminal to not include Han.

About the Gaul point...yeah I imagine a celtic tree with a strong emphasis on Gaul would be a great DLC, however I think Amplitude will reserve the French market appeal for well....France, we can already see it with the revolutionary flag carrying lady on the promotional art.

The 7 known cover, geographically, the Mediterranean like a blanket (Rome, Greece, Carthage), central America (Mayan), Middle East (Persia), eastern Europe (Goths), Horn of Africa (Aksumites). Some of them are also 'natural' extensions of the Ancient/Bronze Era Factions:
Nubian - Aksumite
Phoenician - Carthaginian
Mycenean - Greek
Babylonian - Persian

So, what's left Uncovered in Classical: East Asia, South Asia, central Asia, Northern Europe.
South and North America are real Long Shots: I don't think a South American Faction is an impossibility, especially if they follow up in Medieval or Renaissance with Inca, but any North American Faction would be a stretch: Cahokia? Puebla/Anasazi? and there's little or no 'follow up' Faction possible.

Olmecs are in bronze, I would imagine if we were to have a more fleshed out Andean tree, Norte chico would have made it to bronze. I'm a bit pessimistic here, I think that on release we'll only get Inca, which honestly isn't that bad, Olmec, Maya, Aztec, Inca, is already more than civ does on release. (tho I have fingers crossed Tiwanaku or Moche make it to classical)

In East Asia, as stated, the Han leap to mind: long-lasting, could be Militarist or Expansionist or even Agrarian, so could fit a number of empty 'slots'.
In South Asia, it's really a bit early for anybody from the southeast, so the Mauryan or Guptan Indian Factions make sense - and also provide a Follow On to the Harappans, and could be, again, Agrarian, or Expansionist or even Aesthete with a little cutting and bending at the corners.
Central Asia cries out for Something. This was the Era (1000 - 800 BCE to 500 CE) when the first of the great Mounted Pastorals appear: Scythians, Xiong-Nu, Huns, Sarmatians, and if they are not going to have a specifically Nomad Faction for us, at least to cover the area geographically would, I would think, be a consideration.

I'm just going by that article, I want the Han in so badly, I'm leaning more and more into the camp that the art card is probably more evidence that they are in than the article. why spent so much effort on the ilustration if the Han isn't in? (might have to take out Macedon out of the list and put Han on a leap of faith here).

And we still have that enigmatic 'Hun Horde' spotted on one of the Amplitude boards that has not been explained. IF it's not a Special Mechanism or Minor Faction, it's got to be associated with a Central Asian Faction of some kind, and if it's an early Code or Cover Word, it doesn't even have to specifically mean Huns.

I've given up on playable nomads on vanilla, they will probably be in through minor factions, or events, how exactly we don't know yet.

Northern Europe. IF it's not Celts, there's not much else left. The Germanic tribes were numerous, but totally without cities in the Classical Era - and almost as 'nomadic' as the mounted groups further east. Britons all the way up in the islands have so much Celtic influence already that it would be a chore separating them: you'd be far better off going with the established and fairly well-known Celtic Gauls of Vercingetorix, Dumnorix, Asterix and Getafix. Shucks, between Druids and Nematons Oppidum and Menhirs half the graphic and Emblematic work is already done for you!

To me the overal umbrella term of Celts should have been reserved for a bronze age civ, and then branch them off into different cultures on classical, I'm becoming a bit pessimistic on the Celts or Gauls, etc, making it to vanilla.
 
Back to some speculation on some cultures and their quarters:

I'm interested to see where they take the Franks. I spotted what LOOKS like the Capetian Knight as their unit in the Medieval era from that Dev Diary video, so I'm pretty sure that's accurate. But what would be a good Frankish quarter for the middle ages? A tourney ground?
 
Back to some speculation on some cultures and their quarters:

I'm interested to see where they take the Franks. I spotted what LOOKS like the Capetian Knight as their unit in the Medieval era from that Dev Diary video, so I'm pretty sure that's accurate. But what would be a good Frankish quarter for the middle ages? A tourney ground?
I‘d like to have a Kaiserpfalz.
 
ok...time for an updated list, I'm considering a couple of factors, we all were surprised by the Celts not being in, and if we had at least some concept art or seen anything on screens...I'd still hold on that maybe they are going for a specific tribe, but we don't.

And following that same idea, the Han, an article mentioned only 3 Chinese cultures, Zhou, Ming and PRC, but unlike the Celts we have an illustration that very clearly points to Han

Spoiler :
10.png


So far all concept art with a vertical ratio has been only for playable cultures, I think It's safe to assume the Han are actually in despite the info on the article. (or at least I'm hoping for it).

Macedon taken out, just because the mediterranean seems kinda crowded, and tbh...I'd have no problem with a Macedon and Hellenistic cultures DLC, I'd rather they cover the most of the world as a priority.

so new list...

  1. Aksum - Merchant
  2. Carthage - Merchant
  3. Goths - Militaristic
  4. Greece - Scientific
  5. Han - Agrarian
  6. Maurya - Aesthete
  7. Mayan - Scientific
  8. Persia - Expansionist
  9. Rome - Militaristic
  10. Tiwanaku - Builder
That's...I think it, I'll hold to my guns see how many make it. I think those provide a nice springing board for the medieval era cultures, Franks, Byzantines, Nara Japan, Aztecs, etc.
 
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