Custom Game Engine?

Hydromancerx

C2C Modder
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Feb 27, 2008
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So one of the big limits of Civ4 is that it only allows for one core support even if you have 2 or more. I have been told before by those on the team that know these things that its hard-coded and cannot be changed. And that the makers of Civ4 will never release their code for that.

However what if a new "Custom Game Engine" was made that could run Civ4 games on it? One that could have multi-core support? Rather than modding from the end we are on now mod from the other side. I guess you could call it a "Civ4 Emulator"?

In short for those with advanced programing skills, could this even be considered let alone done?
 
You can use more than one core at least in the dll, Koshling and AiAndy already did that for the Spawns, the PropertySolver and the City Production evaluations..... But after all it's alot of time and know-how needed. Also you can't do this everywhere and at some places you have not much or none speed improvement because of the overhead.

But a new Custom Game Engine is a totally different thing something like (alot of time and know-how needed)*10. But there might be some open-source engines around.
 
That's basically what Koshling was discussing doing that led to us forming another forum and everything but it's kinda on hold. For me it's so I can FINISH what I've started here before moving on to a new game engine entirely. At some point I want to learn to build from the ground up and once we're pretty much polished with C2C I feel it will be time to try. However, for me, this probably means I'll need to start with something a little less overall complex than something intended for a game of this scope - I've got some simpler concepts I'd LOVE to see manifested into an actual computed game at some point. I'd be more than happy to invite anyone here to join those projects too.

But I've given it a lot of thought and unless we have a top notch set of very advanced programmers working on the project, for now it must wait.
 
From what I've witnessed in may other projects, switching from mod to standalone (usually to overcome the base game's limitation) is an idea that always come at some point in popular mods, yet rarely succeeds (and often means the end of the mod).

One of the most obvious example I know is the MagnaMundi mod for Europa Universalis 3: a huge mod that brought in a lot of new features, by far the most popular EU3 mod. The team came to the idea of developing it as a standalone to implement features that weren't moddable and to improve performance.
Paradox (EU's editor) had not so long before started to actively support developers willing to create games based on their own engines: they even provided (under NDA) the source code of their games to developers and I'm pretty sure they also provided funds/resources to projects. MagnaMundi was a perfect subject: there was already a team of motivated modders which had a good knowledge of the game and they had demonstrated they were able to deliver.
Yet, it was a failure. After several release postponements from the modders, Paradox (which followed the development closely) announced that they did not see the game being able to reach a stable state in the foreseeable future and the game was cancelled.
For other examples, another "standalone mod" under development called East vs. West based on Paradox' Heart of Irons 3 engine met a similar fate, though it was developed by a team which had successfully released a (less ambitious) standalone mod for HOI2. Although I can't say I follow very closely the development of this game, I've also heard that DayZ' standalone version was not going too well.

I don't know why this doesn't look to work out, but I'd guess it can be linked to the need for different skills than modding (project management comes to mind, not to mention much more advanced programming skills), underestimation of the time and efforts required to build the engine (how much time did it take for Firaxis to program CIV4?), demotivation from lack of "visible" results over a prolonged period, resources issues (it's not the same to help a mod and be able to leave anytime as to have to be sure you'll stay during the whole development), etc.

The worst thing is, as the most active people from a mod are leaving to develop the standalone, the mod stops being developed.

Bottom-line is, my advice: don't try to develop a dedicated engine for C2C, or I'd bet this would mean the end of C2C. There are surely limitations to the current engine, but resist the temptation to think that restarting from scratch will be worth the effort - "Le mieux est l'ennemi du bien". There's still much one can do in C2C to further improve it without the need for a new engine - for instance, if speed issues are the main reason to go down this road, wouldn't the years it would take to do that be more efficiently used in just optimizing the current code?
 
From what I've witnessed in may other projects, switching from mod to standalone (usually to overcome the base game's limitation) is an idea that always come at some point in popular mods, yet rarely succeeds (and often means the end of the mod).There's still much one can do in C2C to further improve it without the need for a new engine - for instance, if speed issues are the main reason to go down this road, wouldn't the years it would take to do that be more efficiently used in just optimizing the current code?

Good explanation and I agree 100%

You would need at a minimum of

8 Koshlings
6 AIAndy's
5 Dancing Hoskuld's
4 Hydromancerx's
4 TB's
4 alberts2
and alot more, and that JUSTs to START.

Oh, and a million dollars wont hurt :p:rolleyes:
 
Yeah I suspected so. But what about open source games like FreeCiv? Could stuff from C2C ever be converted to an open source game like that? Or is it too different?

Perhaps you could but it would be no more proprietary at that point than our efforts here. So then the only benefit would be to potentially release ourselves from some restrictions for a hell of a lot of work ahead of us just to catch up to where we are here now with no more ultimate potential for our efforts to reward.
 
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