Daimyo of State elections
- Thread starter remake20
- Start date
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
Thanks Memphus 
I accept the Nomination.
Anyone want to run against me and make a race of it?
I accept the Nomination.
Anyone want to run against me and make a race of it?
Karhu
Devil's Advocate
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2006
- Messages
- 651
I would appreciate hearing the candidates' philosophy regarding the position at stake. Just a few lines would be fine; How they view the position's role and how they would facilitate that. No need for a full strategy guide. 
Obviously the team's directives must be followed, but the Daimyos will still play an important role in shaping our choices.
Obviously the team's directives must be followed, but the Daimyos will still play an important role in shaping our choices.
Ronnie1
Deity
I would also like to hear more on philosophy!
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
General_W for Daimyo of State!
Namaste' My Fellow Ninjas!
I have come to speak to you today, and tell you of the glorious vision I have had. It is a vision of a shining future, in which the holy TaoSAN guides the course of the whole world. A vision in which the Super Awesome Ninjas and our eternal Shogun rule from the lands of the rising sun in the east to it's nighttime home in the lands of the West. Between us and the accomplishment of this vision lie many difficult tasks and even those who would oppose us.
But we can beat them. We must beat them. We shall be victorious.
Join me in assuring that glorious victory.
My Platform:
- As first Daimyo of State, I will establish protocols and well organized threads to ensure easy access to key information and to facilitate easy discussion involving as many Super Awesome Ninjas as possible.
- Ensure speedy responses in all diplomatic contact to foster working relationships with other teams.
- Advocate a highly polite, cordial, and cooperative tone in dealing with foreign powers.
- Push for making diplomatic deals that are lopsidedly in favor of our opponents – to ensure we remain more valuable as a friend than as a potential target. I will try to keep the incentives always in favor of working with us rather than dog-piling against us.
- Constantly look for options to create diplomatic advantage through trade and being informed of what all our opponents are doing. I believe it's always better to be a part of trade (even at a steep discount) than to be left out of the trading loop.
- Strive to keep SANCTA on a path of international trade and growth until we can assemble sufficient military power to begin crushing our rivals the old fashioned way.
- Always, always, always honor the input of my fellow Ninjas and seek to implement the will of the team to the best of my ability.
Together, we will build a glorious future and show the world the true path of the Super Awesome Ninja.
*paid for the by the committee to elect General_W, Daimyo of State, SANCTA*
.
Geez! General_W, you put up such a perfect platform that I can't find anything to criticise nor any reason to run against you with an alternative platform, since it's all as if it came from my mouth (just written better). 
And besides, you already had me convinced through our diplomatic negotiations in the last game, that you are perfectly capable of wrapping the other nations around your little finger.
And besides, you already had me convinced through our diplomatic negotiations in the last game, that you are perfectly capable of wrapping the other nations around your little finger.
AutomatedTeller
Frequent poster
I shall nominate myself.
My philosophy is best summed up with the following speech (my apologies to Shakespeare, Marc Anthony and English teachers everywhere...)
Friends, Ninjas, countrymen, lend me your ears;
I come to get more votes than General_W, not to praise him.
The evil that men do lives after them;
The good is oft interred with their rhetoric;
So let it be with General_W. The noble Theoden
Hath told you General_W was manipulative:
If it were so, it was a grievous fault,
And grievously hath General_W answer'd it.
Here, under leave of Theoden and the rest -
For Theoden is an honourable man;
So are they all, all honourable men -
Come I to speak in General_W's election.
He was my friend, faithful and just to me:
But Theoden says he was capable of wrapping nations around his finger;
And Theoden is an honourable man.
He hath brought many treaties home to The Inner Sanctum
Whose ransoms did the treasury fill:
Did this in General_W seem manipulative?
When that the workers have been captured by evil enemies, General_W hath wept:
Manipulative should be made of sterner stuff:
Yet Theoden says he was manipulative;
And Theoden is an honourable man.
You all did see that on the Lupercal
I thrice presented him a kingly crown,
Which he did thrice refuse: was this manipulative?
Yet Theoden says he was capable of complete, outright, baldfaced lies - wow, what an opponent - you'd completely believe him;
And, sure, he is an honourable man.
I speak not to disprove what Theoden spoke,
But here I am to speak what I do know.
You all did love him once, (not that there's anything wrong with that!):
What cause withholds you then, to mourn for him?
O judgment! thou art fled to brutish lions, panthers and wolves,
And men have lost their reason. Bear with me;
My heart is in the voting box there with General_W,
And I must pause till it come back to me.
(disclaimer: any indication that the General is anything but completely honorable is meant to be gross exaggeration.
ps - I had to memorize that speech in high school. Boy, was I a dope...
pps - no, I didn't write it from memory. that was a long time ago
ppps - no I'm not actually running for this office. if elected, I shall not serve!!)
My philosophy is best summed up with the following speech (my apologies to Shakespeare, Marc Anthony and English teachers everywhere...)
Friends, Ninjas, countrymen, lend me your ears;
I come to get more votes than General_W, not to praise him.
The evil that men do lives after them;
The good is oft interred with their rhetoric;
So let it be with General_W. The noble Theoden
Hath told you General_W was manipulative:
If it were so, it was a grievous fault,
And grievously hath General_W answer'd it.
Here, under leave of Theoden and the rest -
For Theoden is an honourable man;
So are they all, all honourable men -
Come I to speak in General_W's election.
He was my friend, faithful and just to me:
But Theoden says he was capable of wrapping nations around his finger;
And Theoden is an honourable man.
He hath brought many treaties home to The Inner Sanctum
Whose ransoms did the treasury fill:
Did this in General_W seem manipulative?
When that the workers have been captured by evil enemies, General_W hath wept:
Manipulative should be made of sterner stuff:
Yet Theoden says he was manipulative;
And Theoden is an honourable man.
You all did see that on the Lupercal
I thrice presented him a kingly crown,
Which he did thrice refuse: was this manipulative?
Yet Theoden says he was capable of complete, outright, baldfaced lies - wow, what an opponent - you'd completely believe him;
And, sure, he is an honourable man.
I speak not to disprove what Theoden spoke,
But here I am to speak what I do know.
You all did love him once, (not that there's anything wrong with that!):
What cause withholds you then, to mourn for him?
O judgment! thou art fled to brutish lions, panthers and wolves,
And men have lost their reason. Bear with me;
My heart is in the voting box there with General_W,
And I must pause till it come back to me.
(disclaimer: any indication that the General is anything but completely honorable is meant to be gross exaggeration.
ps - I had to memorize that speech in high school. Boy, was I a dope...
pps - no, I didn't write it from memory. that was a long time ago
ppps - no I'm not actually running for this office. if elected, I shall not serve!!)
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
excellent speech, Sir AutoTeller. It shall make thy defeat all the more sweet.
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
@Karhu - we're not in a hurry - but anytime someone wants to run, we can hold a new election.
For domestics or war there seems to be more vigorous discussion. We don't need to hold elections for them just yet.
But unless there is someone with an alternate view on how best to run State - the sooner we formalize my position, the sooner I'll feel better about diverting the time necessary to set up all the required threads and info. I just don't want to put the time in, only to see someone with an alternate view of how to do it get elected and have all my work go down the toilet. I only have limited hours to devote to Civ.
For domestics or war there seems to be more vigorous discussion. We don't need to hold elections for them just yet.
But unless there is someone with an alternate view on how best to run State - the sooner we formalize my position, the sooner I'll feel better about diverting the time necessary to set up all the required threads and info. I just don't want to put the time in, only to see someone with an alternate view of how to do it get elected and have all my work go down the toilet. I only have limited hours to devote to Civ.
Karhu
Devil's Advocate
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2006
- Messages
- 651
I am not running for this office due to upcoming time restraints. However the activities of this office are of great interest to me and of great importance to the team. Therefore I'm going to half-act as though I was running for an opportunity to blab on about diplomacy and voice my opinion. I'm sure the good General will excel in this office and he is welcome to comment on or steal anything I write. If nothing else, I hope to learn something from the ensuing discussion and for the team to be better prepared when we make our first contact.
Edit: And I'll be sure to drink lots of tea while doing it!
Edit: And I'll be sure to drink lots of tea while doing it!
Karhu
Devil's Advocate
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2006
- Messages
- 651
How important do I feel this position is? Let me be clear; Victory's Tao lies in solid diplomacy. For it is only through diplomacy that one beaker can become two, and two enemies can be destroyed by one war. That said, the DoS's primary responsibility is not to craft diplomatic policy, but to craft diplomatic messages which execute the team's will. I offer a reading of the TaoSAN as evidence, as well as suggestions on how best to implement the TaoSAN in practice.
From the TaoSAN Daimyo of State
I interpret this section of the TaoSAN to mean that the DoS's primary responsibility is to enact the diplomacy will of the team. Secondary is to make readily available the information needed for the team to formulate its will.
From the TaoSAN Embassy Threads
I would propose we break down Embassy Threads into two sections for each opponent: Recored Keeping, in which diplomatic correspondence would be placed; and Discussion, which would be where the team could formulate its will on a regular basis and approve diplomatic messages written by the DoS.
From the TaoSAN the Nexus
The Nexus should be a read-only thread, kept by the DoS to allow for quick reference of active trades and available trade goods (including technologies). Discussion should take place in the appropriate Embassy Discussion Thread.
From the TaoSAN Daimyo of State
Spoiler :
From the TaoSAN Embassy Threads
Spoiler :
From the TaoSAN the Nexus
Spoiler :
Karhu
Devil's Advocate
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2006
- Messages
- 651
Now, before I share my theory/strategy to diplomacy, I would like to offer a disclaimer by Carl Von Clausewitz:
The following is a repost from the Diplomacy Discussion Thread started by Whomp:
The above five points offer a outline for moving forward in the diplomatic arena. I offer them to be improved upon and implemented only if it is SANCTA's will.
What more could I add? Glad you asked.
I would suggest that we use a consistent font, and something with a little style, when crafting our diplomatic messages. This will help add flavor to our correspondence and only enhance what I'm sure is an already excellent writing style of the good General.
What else could their possibly be, you ask? Well, I could post some of my old diplomacy messages, and I would if I was actually running for the office. Or I could write a speech; But I already wrote Krill's, and AutomatedTeller's was supreme, so...
"...rules are not indented for individual cases, and action in the individual case and be determined only by [applying the concepts of] purpose and means."
In other words, studying theory and planing out a strategy is great, but must become subject to truths on the ground before implementation.The following is a repost from the Diplomacy Discussion Thread started by Whomp:
I think this game will largely be decided in the diplomatic arena. Without a solid diplomatic game we will quickly fall behind in tech. So I'm happy to see the out of box thinking taking place in this thread. Whomp posses excellent questions, many of which I don't think can be answered at this time, but are still good to think about now in preparation for that time.
However, I am not in favor of the drip. If a team is hard to get to open up, they will likely be a poor ally. If we conduct a successful drip we should then act with the utmost caution during iterations with that team. Particularly in cases of war.
He here what I would suggest for a general outline of our diplomatic activity:
Phase One - Extend the peace feelers: Immediately upon contact with each civ send a friendly greeting stating our hope for future collaboration. Continue exchanging messages with any civ that is responsive, even if we have nothing to talk about. Fluff is fine for building relationships.
The point of this phase is to identify which teams we can work with and that might make solid allies down the road. Because of the large world size with few occupants, war is unlikely during this phase.
Phase Two - Quid pro quo: Seek open boarders agreements and tech trades of equal value in order to build relations and keep us on top of the tech race.
Phase Three - Tech alliance: If a solid relation has been formed then two teams can work together by agreeing which techs each will research to avoid duplication of efforts.
Phase Four - Espionage Neutrality: A simple agreement to stop investing valuablein each other. If the current rate is 300 to 256, the lower team would be allowed to invest up to 300, after which neither team would invest further nor conduct missions against the other party. This simple lets us redirect our points to a more valuable opponent, and further strengthens the alliance.
Phase Five - Joint War Planning: We must truly be trusting of our alliance at this point to avoid the dreaded.
The above five points offer a outline for moving forward in the diplomatic arena. I offer them to be improved upon and implemented only if it is SANCTA's will.
What more could I add? Glad you asked.
I would suggest that we use a consistent font, and something with a little style, when crafting our diplomatic messages. This will help add flavor to our correspondence and only enhance what I'm sure is an already excellent writing style of the good General.
What else could their possibly be, you ask? Well, I could post some of my old diplomacy messages, and I would if I was actually running for the office. Or I could write a speech; But I already wrote Krill's, and AutomatedTeller's was supreme, so...
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
Good stuff Karhu. I like most of what you've written here, just a few minor points I'd raise.
On the threads under the auspices of the DoS - I think you and I understand the organization in the same way. Only difference in my vision is that I'd keep the key records in the Nexus, rather than a separate Embassy thread. There will already be quite a lot of reading for anyone wanting to stay on top of diplomacy... let's not compound that by making too many threads. In my experience, it's relatively rare to need to go back further than a couple pages in the Embassy thread for needed info. For those cases where it IS necessary - it's almost always for a treaty - and there's no reason we can't store all those in the Nexus.
Also, I like your 5 point plan in general (which I understand is all it was intended for) - but you've left out what I view as a key component of the game, when we can manage it. And that's the "tech-broker" stage. By staying on top of opportunities where trades might be available between other teams - and then trying to worm our way into those deals by being more agreeable / more persistent/ offering better deals - we can profit from exchanges the other two teams should have been making on their own. Team Epsilon's diplomacy corps (mostly under my control) had great success with this gambit in the early game. Eventually people wise up and it's better to secure an exclusive tech arrangement(or two) - but we shouldn't be in such a hurry to go exclusive that we miss the opportunities to act as broker. This is even more powerful if we can make early contact with multiple teams before they've met each other.
So... when we holding this election?
On the threads under the auspices of the DoS - I think you and I understand the organization in the same way. Only difference in my vision is that I'd keep the key records in the Nexus, rather than a separate Embassy thread. There will already be quite a lot of reading for anyone wanting to stay on top of diplomacy... let's not compound that by making too many threads. In my experience, it's relatively rare to need to go back further than a couple pages in the Embassy thread for needed info. For those cases where it IS necessary - it's almost always for a treaty - and there's no reason we can't store all those in the Nexus.
Also, I like your 5 point plan in general (which I understand is all it was intended for) - but you've left out what I view as a key component of the game, when we can manage it. And that's the "tech-broker" stage. By staying on top of opportunities where trades might be available between other teams - and then trying to worm our way into those deals by being more agreeable / more persistent/ offering better deals - we can profit from exchanges the other two teams should have been making on their own. Team Epsilon's diplomacy corps (mostly under my control) had great success with this gambit in the early game. Eventually people wise up and it's better to secure an exclusive tech arrangement(or two) - but we shouldn't be in such a hurry to go exclusive that we miss the opportunities to act as broker. This is even more powerful if we can make early contact with multiple teams before they've met each other.
So... when we holding this election?
Karhu
Devil's Advocate
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2006
- Messages
- 651
Well, I think it is really helpful to have diplomatic emails sorted by team. But!!! Gmail does this for us automatically if we add a simple filter/label combo. That's plenty good enough for me and cuts down on the number of threads and work for the DoS.
I like the tech-broker bit, and it's doable on large map with few teams; If we undertake a deliberate strategy of sending out scouts to the far reaches of the world at an early stage.
Also, your platform outline, which i never commented on, looks really good. Sorry for not saying so earlier.
I've gotten everything out of my system. Elections can be held anytime as far as i'm concerned.
I like the tech-broker bit, and it's doable on large map with few teams; If we undertake a deliberate strategy of sending out scouts to the far reaches of the world at an early stage.
Also, your platform outline, which i never commented on, looks really good. Sorry for not saying so earlier.
I've gotten everything out of my system. Elections can be held anytime as far as i'm concerned.
Viva_Chingon
Condition 1
Karhu said:
I like the idea of sorting the messages...is it feasible to use gmail for diplomacy? If so, the labels are already created...all we need to do is sort by whomever sends the messages.
