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Dear Firaxis, I don't like DLC

Discussion in 'CivBE - General Discussions' started by Greasy Dave, Aug 29, 2014.

  1. The Naug

    The Naug Chieftain

    Joined:
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    As DLC comes and goes I think Firaxis has handled it quite well. I'm of the opinion that DLC works best in games with a high replay value, like Civ V. If I buy a new civilization, it affects my game every match that I either play that civ or it is played by one of the AIs. It feels like I get value for my money.

    I contrast, action adventure games(e.g. Mass Effect) I tend to play only once for that one grand experience. I don't want to return to them, play through the story that I've already seen to find that one extra mission crammed in in the middle of the story. For games like that, I don't feel like I get any value out of my money when I look at the DLC.
     
  2. JokerJace

    JokerJace Prince

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    Thank you. Athough I must say he sounds very biased. Especially when he defends a day 1 DLC character like Javik from Mass Effect. Every part of the game, every possible group composition for every single mission has dialogue and many other aspects that are unique when playing with him. I can't believe they iterated through all of this after the game's budget has already been reached. Even if their budget estimation is very good and ahead of time. Invite all the voice actors again, just for the lines associated with him and so on... The game was developed with him being a basic character. Then he has been cut for day 1 DLC. All evidence points towards it. And yet the author takes this as a particular example for the opposite. There are just too many examples of how Day 1 DLC content is too tightly integrated in the rest of the game. That's why I'm more than sceptical about him. Besides, he mainly defends the DLC policy from an economic point of view and nobody ever disputed that it is clever in that regard - or even necessary to survive - who knows. Doesn't change the fact that most publishers don't communicate truthfully about it and it feels like a scam sometimes.
     
  3. Esperr

    Esperr King

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    I dont mind dlc if its good. The kind I do mind is stuff like babylon and korea, who are way OP.
     
  4. NASAROG

    NASAROG Prince

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    I do mind being nickel and domed though. Instead of many small DLC packs, I'd prefer something larger. Having said that, I wait until a proper steam sale and pick up what I feel I am missing.
     
  5. Esperr

    Esperr King

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    Yeah but the civ dlc was nice because you could pick which ones you wanted and not bother buying the bad ones.
     
  6. NASAROG

    NASAROG Prince

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    Sure, especially when it was on sale. Those were my favorite.
     
  7. Sherlock

    Sherlock Just one more turn...

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    Hey Firaxis:

    dlc just encourages me to wait until there's a 1/2 off package sometime in the future.
     
  8. ToothedBomb

    ToothedBomb Prince

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    I loved the DLC for Civ V, and would like to see similair things for Beyond Earth. I'll gladly pay for new factions, scenario's and wonders, and later buy the maps at 75% off. I think it's a great way to put fresh new things in a game, without the need for a 'burst' of new content from an expansion. I never felt ripped off because of the work that went into the new leader screens, music and scenario's. The pricing was right, too.

    I do agree that pre-order DLC is dumb. Stop with that.
     
  9. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    Preorder DLC such as special maps are fine.

    I'd be annoyed if a preorder was having an extra civ or special wonders.

    It's either that or a discount for preorders. And then sell that kind of content 3 months down the road for 5$ just to avoid being seen as a day-1 DLC.
     
  10. wgene

    wgene Warlord

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    It isn't Firaxis at fault with the DLC milking it is 2K and other publishers who are pushing the devs to make the DLC so the publisher can milk the gamer. EA are the worst with the Sims follow by Sega with COH2.
     
  11. AriochIV

    AriochIV Colonial Ninja

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    That article really irritated me. There is a huge difference between asking for "free" content and objecting to being gouged. Taking content that is the equivalent of 1% of the total effort that goes into a $60 game and charging $15 (or $10, or $5) for it is gouging, plain and simple.

    And day-one DLC, whether it is fairly priced or not (it never is), leaves a bad taste in people's mouths. No one likes to feel like they are being milked for every nickel and dime.

    And I am very well aware that game programmers and artists are paid substandard wages for very long hours, but that has absolutely nothing to do with the matter.

    Did appreciate this image, though.
     
  12. JokerJace

    JokerJace Prince

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    Very appropriate analogy. Funny how he tried to use it to make the opposite point. Just like with the Mass Effect DLC. I'm really questioning the impartiality of that guy.
     
  13. DarkestOnion

    DarkestOnion Prince

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    OP, thank you for sharing your thoughts on DLC. Lately, I have avoided clicking on Threads with such a theme but something told me yours would be different and I am glad I chose to click. It might help your frustration if you could come to look at DLC as Optional Bonus Content rather than Content Designed to Victimize Consumers.

    Publishers and Developers must not be looked at as Consumer Enemies. Instead please take a moment to consider that Publishers, Developers, and Consumers are all part of the Gaming Industry Economic Equation.

    If you dislike DLC then by all means do not purchase DLC. However, if you make this choice and then offer counterarguments to Pro-DLC folks then you come off as challenging us to change your mind, just as I am doing here in my post. Can we find a middle ground where we all pay only for Quality DLC together?
     
  14. JokerJace

    JokerJace Prince

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    Forcing yourself to be positive about something isn't always the best thing to do. Sometimes that's just avoiding conflict. And often you can't choose how you receive a message in the first place. If you feel cheated then that's what it is. And victimizing consumers is obviously not the goal, but a side effect.

    Completely undisputed and completely not the point.

    That's a good start. :) One of the utopian goals of such threads is the forming of some sort of coordinated consumer behavior.

    I think nobody has a problem to pay for a high quality expansion. It's more about dubious practices like day 1 DLC with content that suggests that it has been cut out off the main game.
     
  15. Catalytic

    Catalytic Chieftain

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    I think games should be a complete, playable unit when they are released. All the core features should be there: major mechanics, art, systems, and various types of replayable content to make the game worth the original investment.

    I'm ok with DLC with a few conditions:
    1) DLC should be entirely optional content
    2) DLC should not remove or reduce major game mechanics that create difficulty (pay-to-win)

    In a TBS game like this, I'm ok with things like map packs, scenarios, UI themes, or optional art being DLC. I'm opposed to things like new factions, new mechanics, new buildings, new wonders, new units, etc.

    A game should stand alone on its own without the DLC, and development should focus on the quality of the game itself to make money. If you need to add significant content that does affect gameplay, either patch it in for free, or release it in an expansion pack, properly tested, and with enough content to justify the cost.

    I get nickle-and-dimed enough elsewhere by banks, hotels, airlines, movie theaters...

    If money's the issue, then price the game accordingly so the consumer actually understands the real cost of producing the content he's buying. With some big-name game studios pumping tens of millions of dollars into a game, its completely understandable they want to see a return on their investment. I'm willing to pay for content if the content is good enough.
     
  16. darkedone02

    darkedone02 The Suggestor

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  17. Aeson

    Aeson orangesoda Retired Moderator

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    The DLC for Civ is still rather reasonable. I spent over $1k on a particular iOS/Android/Facebook game last year alone! Didn't get nearly the amount of playtime that I would with a Civ title either.

    Often apps are selling individual units/monsters/dragons/speed ups for from $2 to $100 a pop. It's amazing what people will pay for ... in my case it's all business expenses, otherwise no way! ;)
     
  18. swordoflight86

    swordoflight86 Warlord

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    I'm fine with DLC under certain conditions. I would personally like all my content in big chunks, expansion packs as it were, but I know that is a forlorn hope.

    Map packs are fine, as long as I'm not paying $4.99 for them. New Civs are fine too, once again, as long as they are reasonably priced.

    Even Day 1 DLC is something I am not averse to, as long as it available after release and is not something ridiculous like the Mass Effect 2/3 Day 1 DLC.

    Civ:BE's preorder bonus strikes me as a nice balance. It is enticing enough to make you want to buy it, but it isn't undowithoutable, and after release it shouldn't cost that much to acquire.
     
  19. Teodosio

    Teodosio Warlord

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    This is what's wrong in your reasoning. You are not paying "extra money", you are paying the price they decide to charge for their product.
    They could do away with DLC and release everything with the base game at the cost of 100€. Would you be happier if this were the case?

    +1 for DLC's
     
  20. killmeplease

    killmeplease Mk Z on Steam

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    dont buy dlcs if you dont like them
    dont play games with dlc if you dont like them
    why to moan at public about how greedy you are? (you want this thing but you dont want to pay. but you want! what a tragedy..)
     

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