Dear Sid

[Skedastic]

The Geforce 4MX series does not meet the recommended requirements. The recommended requirement is a video card with shader 1.0 support (Geforce 3 and 4Ti, but not 4MX). Nonetheless, Jim and others have a valid point that the minimum requirements say T&L and not shader support, but judging by the reports here shader support is actually required.

There are many cards on the market for less than a c-note that offer good performance for any game on the market and are more than enough to run Civ 4, eg:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814102433

 

[CurtSibling]

Wow. Frankly I am disgusted by the remarks of some of the people on these forums.

First, PCs are not like consoles. Not every one is the same. Trying to code a game to work with 100+ motherboards, 15+ MAJOR video cards, 4-5 major operating systems.... It's tough to get it perfect for everyone on the first attempt. I do agree that alot of these bugs should have been killed in the beta testing, but if the beta testers posted bug reports as "detailed" as the ones I am seeing here, no wonder they were never fixed.

If anyone thinks that Sid and his team worked on this game for as long as they did just to neglect the fans after they pay up, you are sadly mistaken. How do you expect them to make sense out of all the bug reports and put together a patch overnight? It doesnt help that people make posts such as "Help, the game crashes, any ideas?". That really narrows it down for the bug-killing team over at Firaxis doesn't it?

The best thing to do at the moment is give detailed bug reports of what is happening, when it is happening, and your complete PC specs. Sid and his team cannot make a patch to fix the bugs until they find them, and though it isn't our job to find them for them, it speeds up the process.

I am currently playing LAN with 2 friends, and our computers vary greatly in stats. I can honestly say that the Leaderhead memory leak is a bug.

Just like all great games (Civ 3), I think this will be a rough start, but trust me in that a patch is on the way. If you want to throw away your $50 CDs just because you can't play the game right away, go ahead. Otherwise, in the meantime, instead of spamming forums and sending out blame in every direction, play something else. Posting threads like this only hinders getting problems solved.

- GIDustin

Good post, Dustin!

At last, a voice of sanity among the screaming furies!

 

[BleckLord]

Pffft!

And what about those gamers who are happily playing without problems?

Just because you have issues, it does not mean the rest of the world
has the same situation. Perhaps if people would check their systems have the
correct technology and that it is updated to the proper level, then we would
have less doomsaying and melodrama such as the 'open letter' above...

Again, I say - Pfft!

What about the gamers who are hapily enjoying the game? They need not endorse the letter; they need not complain on little, teeny-weenie bit. What about the people who have problems that make the game unplayble? Are they not allowed to vent thier feelings on this thread?

James seems to have attempted to get his machine to meet the software requirements to the best of his ability.

Not everyone has the $ to buy a new card, regardless of price. Not everyone has the desire to install a new video card (especially if you paid for an expensive waranty that can be voided for opening your case). These people have a right to their thread just like you have a right to enjoy your problemless game.

I've described my problems in detail, with pictures and logs, on two forums. It still doesn't make the game any more playable then when I started. It doesn't make me feel like what I bought was worth $54.11. Civ 4 is to me, at this time, a lemon.

 

[BleckLord]

Wow. Frankly I am disgusted by the remarks of some of the people on these forums.

First, PCs are not like consoles. Not every one is the same. Trying to code a game to work with 100+ motherboards, 15+ MAJOR video cards, 4-5 major operating systems.... It's tough to get it perfect for everyone on the first attempt. I do agree that alot of these bugs should have been killed in the beta testing, but if the beta testers posted bug reports as "detailed" as the ones I am seeing here, no wonder they were never fixed.

If anyone thinks that Sid and his team worked on this game for as long as they did just to neglect the fans after they pay up, you are sadly mistaken. How do you expect them to make sense out of all the bug reports and put together a patch overnight? It doesnt help that people make posts such as "Help, the game crashes, any ideas?". That really narrows it down for the bug-killing team over at Firaxis doesn't it?

The best thing to do at the moment is give detailed bug reports of what is happening, when it is happening, and your complete PC specs. Sid and his team cannot make a patch to fix the bugs until they find them, and though it isn't our job to find them for them, it speeds up the process.

I am currently playing LAN with 2 friends, and our computers vary greatly in stats. I can honestly say that the Leaderhead memory leak is a bug.

Just like all great games (Civ 3), I think this will be a rough start, but trust me in that a patch is on the way. If you want to throw away your $50 CDs just because you can't play the game right away, go ahead. Otherwise, in the meantime, instead of spamming forums and sending out blame in every direction, play something else. Posting threads like this only hinders getting problems solved.

GIDustin, the proof is in the pudding. When a patch is released then all will be forgiven, I'm sure. Untill such time that the problems are fixed, the Civ 4 software sold to me meets the definition of a 'lemon'.

And how do computers function if creating compatible software is so difficult? Standards. Yes there are hundreds of motherboards and tens of video cards and several operating systems, all of which 'should' be obscured by the DirectX API and the Windows OS. It's Firaxis and 2K's job to make sure that the product they ship will reasonably work with common hardware; furthermore, it is thier job to affect changes to the product should it not function as designed on acceptable hardware. (At least thats what I think)

I'm glad that you and your friends are able to play without issue (beyond the memory leak), and I hope that your copy remains enjoyable. I myself cannot enjoy my copy, and I ask that you indulge me my rants and complaints here. I've posted two very detailed logs of my problems on two different forums, and as yet my problem is unsolved.

Righteous indignation does get problems solved, or atleast motivates action. The fact is that more than one Civ fan has turned away from Firaxis because of a Civ 4 experience. Why do great games need to have rough starts? Shouldn't the perfect game be easy to install and run? and shouldn't all producers/publishers be striving for a perfect game?

 

[GertFroebe]

For me it doesn't matter who's fault it is. But playing the game and reading about other gubs just makes me scream: "PAAAAAAAAATCH!!!!!!!! QUIIICK!!! I PAAAAAYD MONEYYYY FOOOOR THAAAT GAAAAME!"

 

[Megatherion]

I must say I can understand those ppl who are disappointed. I mean, sure, a Computer is not a console, but shouldn't the 'average' user be able to install a software and use it without having to tweak here and there, unpack some artfolders and so on? As far as I see it, there's so many issues about graphics and crashes, that in comparison Microsoft seems to make reliable software.
For me, the game doesn't work, neither. I won't complain, though, since I have not yet tried all of the suggestions around AND only installed the game on my computer in order to see if it works, even though I don't quite meet the requirements (S3 Twister 32MB shared memory...leaving 224MB RAM).
Nevertheless I do hope I can get that game to work on my girlfriend's comp, since this one nearly meets the recommendations (Graphics only 64MB I think).

 

[daelon]

At first I was literally not sure if I had just wasted $50, but after giving the game a chance, I absolutely love it. I only have one major issue and that's with the globe view running extremely slow(like 3 fps). A few things could be better but this game has definately captured my interest again like the other's did long ago.

 

[pajarito79]

I'm another disappointed Civ fan. I more than meet the minimum requirements, and while I can play (Sort of), my FPS is atrocious, and I'm suffering a number of graphic distortions (Unlike any I've seen others complain about in this forum actually, and although none of them make the game unplayable, they're a major hideous distraction). I have a Geforce FX 5200, and it seems like everyone with that card is running laggy, choppy gameplay. This is a common card...how did they manage to miss testing on this? With as many cards as there are that seem to have issues with this game, how did they manage to miss them all?

Like I said, I can sort of play. Until I start getting a multitude of cities and units on the screen, then the lag mucks the game up so much I have to shut it down. I have yet to play a game beyond the BC eras, because I simply can't stand the laggy, choppy, buggy gameplay. I know that's still better than many here are experiencing, and I especially feel for those who can't even run the game at all.

I'm patient, though extremely disappointed. I doubt I'll ever buy another of T2's games on release day. For that matter, I may never buy another PC game on release day.

The only other game that gives me trouble is Pirates, and I don't have the slightest clue what's wrong there, either. I put Pirates on a significantly older machine I have sitting around, and it ran fine there, though a bit slow. I bought that game a week before Civ4 came out, simply because I needed something new to dink around with while I waited.

The last couple weeks of gaming have been really frustrating for me, and doubly so in that the two games I'm having trouble with are Sid Meier games.

I'll be taking my computer to my dad's house today, so that we can try some of the cards he has laying around to see how well they can run these games, if at all. None of his hardware would be an upgrade, and he only has one or two cards that would only amount to a very minor downgrade from my 5200. I'm not expecting workable results, but I'm willing to try anything to play the first 3D Civ, and remain hopeful.

In short, these bugs are widespread enough that it is impossible for the developers to have missed them. This is easily the worst PC game launch I've ever seen (Not counting MMO launches/expansion launches), and with the name "Sid Meier" and the title "Civilization," we expected and deserved a hell of a lot better.

 

[The_Halfmoon]

my take on this?

developers: we should have the game out by november, december at the latest!

distributor: NO! that's not possible... holiday season starts in mid october, we need the game out by then!

[come october]

distributor: so, will the game be ready for the end of the month?
developer: erm... sort of, we still have a lot of issues with directX and compati..

distributor: NO! we need the game out next week! how are we going to do this?
developer: erm... well... I suppose we could release it by next week, but we'd have to do at least 2 weeks worth of patching and debugging
distributor: GOOD!

 

[Old Dood]

What I remember from the Video Review I watched recently is that they said people will not need to go out and upgrade their computers to play Civ 4. To me they LIED!

Yes many can simply upgrade their video cards....allot can't because they have laptops. This is where the DEVs should have been looking. People like poor college students that do not have the CASH to buy a new laptop to play ONE game. The Devs at Arena-Net made one heck of a game with Guild Wars. You can play it with just about any set-up. Turn down the sliders and BINGO you are playing. The graphics are not that bad at that level either.

EDIT: I should add that Arena-Net has a weekly update since the release of Guild Wars. They have really worked overtime to make as many users happy as possible. They see a bug...they are on it. What have we heard from the DEVs of Civ 4?

 

[The_Halfmoon]

again, I really do believe this is a software issue rather than a hardware issue (and by issue I mean the INMENSE lagging which I'm sure most people are experiencing)... I don't think the majority of people with minimum requirements are going to have much of a problem if the directx problems are fixed

 

[WildWeazel]

Since there seems to be some form of sanity here, and Civrules did ask for specific problems, here's mine:

Despite my ATI graphics card, the game has worked fine until now. I've played it about 6 times in the last 2 days, and I haven't had any major problems. But now today the game won't run. When I try to run it, the splash screen comes up for a few seconds, the CD drive fires up, and nothing happens. In the Task Manager window, Civilization4.exe disappears a few seconds after the splash. It doesn't even get to the progress bar. I rebooted my computer multiple times, undid the changes I had made (hiding art0.fpk and changing the ini settings to windowed mode), and removed and replaced the CD. It just won't boot. There is nothing in the ThemeParseLog. I'm going to try reinstalling soon if I can't get it to run.

 

[opticaljim]

Pffft!

And what about those gamers who are happily playing without problems?

Just because you have issues, it does not mean the rest of the world
has the same situation. Perhaps if people would check their systems have the
correct technology and that it is updated to the proper level, then we would
have less doomsaying and melodrama such as the 'open letter' above...

Again, I say - Pfft!

Fair enough, but I would pose these questions:

What percentage of Civ fans do you suppose are having problems with their game?

How were we supposed to know that, despite the minimum and recomended requirements being met, it was obviously necessary to have both a far superior operating computer as well as a very high level of technical knowledge?

I admit that I am not a computer expert and must rely on others to help me with that. The same is true when it comes to having my car fixed.

There are other things that I know about. I have an associate degree in computer programming, although the degree is a little old, Matlab is my specialty, and I have a B.S. in mathematics.

I manufacture optical equipment for low vision customers with glaucoma, diabetes, macular degeneration and cataracts. Sometimes it's just a high perfromance lens for eyeglasses, sometimes it's something a little more involved. I'm good at it.

Please understand this: I would never, and I mean never, release a set of eyewear that was below specifications and not in perfect operating order. Please understand this further: There are thousands of ways to make a pair of glasses wrong and only one way to make it right and when it is wrong it must be remade until it is right before releasing to a client. It's called ethics.

Firaxis knew there were bugs and released it anyway. I'm not "throwing around" blame, I believe I'm pretty much pinpointed it. This is not a "tech support" thread although it ended up here. This is a thread demonstrating my frustration with the series of events that lead to many, many Civ fans being frustrated with the new game.

There are some on this board who have honestly attempted to assist. Thank you.

Yet, there are others on this board who have attempted to defend Firaxis and cast the blame on whatever computer system is being used or even the ignorance of the poster. I would submit that it is they who being counter-productive.

I have been a big fan of Civilization III having stayed up many a night despite the threat of banishment from my loved ones. Yes, there were a few bugs but in no way can that be compared to what has happened with Civ IV. It's a travesty.

I've cooled down a little from the previous night and decided that I'm going back to Civ III for the time being. I will moniter events as they unfold and should Firaxis release a patch that solves all my problems then I will play the game. if not then, well, lesson learned the hard way.

 

[Thunderfall]

Since there seems to be some form of sanity here, and Civrules did ask for specific problems, here's mine:

Despite my ATI graphics card, the game has worked fine until now. I've played it about 6 times in the last 2 days, and I haven't had any major problems. But now today the game won't run. When I try to run it, the splash screen comes up for a few seconds, the CD drive fires up, and nothing happens. In the Task Manager window, Civilization4.exe disappears a few seconds after the splash. It doesn't even get to the progress bar. I rebooted my computer multiple times, undid the changes I had made (hiding art0.fpk and changing the ini settings to windowed mode), and removed and replaced the CD. It just won't boot. There is nothing in the ThemeParseLog. I'm going to try reinstalling soon if I can't get it to run.

This sounds like a cache problem. Try deleting the cache folder.

You can find the instruction here:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=3235451&postcount=185

 

[Thunderfall]

Hi opticaljim,

I fully understand why you are frustrated with the problem. I am sure Firaxis is busy working on a patch to address the problems.

I do suggest you intall graphics card yourself in the future, to get the most out of your money. Graphics card is one of the easiest computer upgrades you can perform. No wires to plug in most cases: you just open the case, pull the old card out, and push the new card into the slot. The only thing you need to be careful with is buy the correct card type: AGP, PCI, or PCI-Express.

http://www.newegg.com/ and http://www.zipzoomfly.com/ are two of the most trusted online stores for computer hardwares. Both charge very little for shipping and you pay no tax.

 

[Old Dood]

Hi opticaljim,

I fully understand why you are frustrated with the problem. I am sure Firaxis is busy working on a patch to address the problems.

I do suggest you intall graphics card yourself in the future, to get the most out of your money. Graphics card is one of the easiest computer upgrades you can perform. No wires to plug in most cases: you just open the case, pull the old card out, and push the new card into the slot. The only thing you need to be careful with is buy the correct card type: AGP, PCI, or PCI-Express.

http://www.newegg.com/ and http://www.zipzoomfly.com/ are two of the most trusted online stores for computer hardwares. Both charge very little for shipping and you pay no tax.

Yes good points on the buying of a video card. People need to make sure they understand the difference....especially with PCIe and Regular PCI.

As for the: "I am sure Firaxis is busy working on a patch to address the problems." How do we really know that? Do they have a Customer Service person posting on the boards? On this board? When Guild Wars came out they had a Customer Service person (Gail Grey) post on the guildwarsguru.com site. This was very helpfull. This showed us that they were on top of ALL the problems. Has Firaxis contacted you all there on this site? I am NOT flaming you by any means...just asking a valid question.

To me it the Proof is in the Pudding. It would be in their's (and our's)best interest to show their face and explain what is going on.

 

[Thunderfall]

As for the: "I am sure Firaxis is busy working on a patch to address the problems." How do we really know that? Do they have a Customer Service person posting on the boards? On this board? When Guild Wars came out they had a Customer Service person (Gail Grey) post on the guildwarsguru.com site. This was very helpfull. This showed us that they were on top of ALL the problems. Has Firaxis contacted you all there on this site? I am NOT flaming you by any means...just asking a valid question.

To me it the Proof is in the Pudding. It would be in their's (and our's)best interest to show their face and explain what is going on.

Firaxians browse the forums here alot, so they are fully aware of the problems some people are having. They do post here, although not very often.

 

[Henry Ford]

you should play some more civ, find something constructive to do with your time

 

[Thorek]

Firaxians browse the forums here alot, so they are fully aware of the problems some people are having. They do post here, although not very often.

Well if so, i think id would be a good idea for them to at least say something, let us know they are aware of the problems. Its not much, but any sign is good, gives people the feeling someone is actually listening.

 

[Old Dood]

That is good to know. What nicks do they go by? They should be well known then. I have lurked here for years. This is a great Civ site. You guys/gals have done a wonderful job. Still the Game makers should be approachable to us all. They should start a thread. Let people truly know what is going to be done. Admit to us what is wrong and how long it will take to fix. (with in reason of course)

Allot of people bought this game at it's premium set price. $50.00. When they could have waited a bit until some of these unknown problems could have been fixed. Also then saved some money when the game drops to $40.00...then...$30.00.

This is a unique type game. This game crosses many age groups. It is not some Shooter that mostly goes with the younger crowd. I am what my nick says I am...OLD DOOD. There are many of us older people that play this game along with the younger ones. I can speak for my age group when I say we do vote with our pocket books. We have long memories (no leak there either ) when we buy a product of any kind.

Firaxis owes us an explaination to all concerns to this game series. This is the one and only game series that I have stayed with over the last 15 years. I even feel Sid himself should take time out of HIS day and write us here on HIS really nice computer set-up that I am sure he owns.

Once again I am not flaming....just being direct. I am a Old Dood that has spent way too much money on games and computers over the years and I am serious about the game Developers getting involved to answer for their sins. Mistakes are acceptable, we are all human. Running from them and not answering for them is a Sin.