[BTS] Deity advice

[noontide]

Hi guys, me again. Trying my hand at Deity yet again. This is my latest attempt. Both Greek and Roman are pleased with me, but I'm a little worried about Germany, who's technically more advanced, has a huge army near my border, and is annoyed with me. Doesn't seem he plans to attack immediately though. I lucked out and popped Liberalism, even though Germany could have. Where do I go from here? Do I shoot for Steel and try to take Germany out? Or science victory maybe?

Save file attached. Any tip would be highly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[Gumbolt]

Romans have the huge army but they won't attack at pleased. 2 vassals which could be a problem.
Germans are 1 tech from rifles making any immediate war with them very tough. They would be your only real land targets right now. To reach any tech to war with here beyond med units would take a while and I fear Germans would just spam units. Germans could easily declare on you or Romans once they get rifles.
If you go full war mode you need to be swift in whatever you do and go all in. Cannons vs rifles? Or both. Germans have got +25% defence bonus too which would be annoying. No city walls/castles yet? Could a rush with phants/pults and xbow work for a brief while? Seems very unlikely i guess.
How would cannons and med units vs rifles work? You are about 20 turns from steel. If Germans don't have rifles by then I would be amazed. They may even have cavalry too. Romans are slightly behind you on techs but you would need to take down their huge stack first.

Why are you in free speech? You have 4 towns vs a +50% commerce bonus in bureau civic? I think Bureau will win that for now.
Are you going culture? You do have quite a few religions but perhaps lack 3 commerce centres. I really don't trust the Germans not to declare on you due to annoyed status.
Org Religion would of really helped with building Unis and other buildings.

Capital has 3 forest covering river tiles that could of been cottaged. Plus one unworked grassland.Shame as it could of had 4 more towns with beureau bonus too.

A city 1w of the iron could of had five 3f3c lake tiles if you built a lighthouse. A better site for Moai.

From what I can see you have spammed buildings.You are paying 18 gold a turn unit upkeep too.

I don't like science victory as you are already behind?

Muskets, phants and catapults and hope Germans skip Rifles? Hmmm.

Not yet had a golden age? These Germans are wonder spamming!! Should make a juicy capital.

 

[noontide]

Romans have the huge army but they won't attack at pleased. 2 vassals which could be a problem.
Germans are 1 tech from rifles making any immediate war with them very tough. They would be your only real land targets right now. To reach any tech to war with here beyond med units would take a while and I fear Germans would just spam units. Germans could easily declare on you or Romans once they get rifles.
If you go full war mode you need to be swift in whatever you do and go all in. Cannons vs rifles? Or both. Germans have got +25% defence bonus too which would be annoying. No city walls/castles yet? Could a rush with phants/pults and xbow work for a brief while? Seems very unlikely i guess.
How would cannons and med units vs rifles work? You are about 20 turns from steel. If Germans don't have rifles by then I would be amazed. They may even have cavalry too. Romans are slightly behind you on techs but you would need to take down their huge stack first.

Why are you in free speech? You have 4 towns vs a +50% commerce bonus in bureau civic? I think Bureau will win that for now.
Are you going culture? You do have quite a few religions but perhaps lack 3 commerce centres. I really don't trust the Germans not to declare on you due to annoyed status.
Org Religion would of really helped with building Unis and other buildings.

Capital has 3 forest covering river tiles that could of been cottaged. Plus one unworked grassland.Shame as it could of had 4 more towns with beureau bonus too.

A city 1w of the iron could of had five 3f3c lake tiles if you built a lighthouse. A better site for Moai.

From what I can see you have spammed buildings.You are paying 18 gold a turn unit upkeep too.

I don't like science victory as you are already behind?

Muskets, phants and catapults and hope Germans skip Rifles? Hmmm.

Not yet had a golden age? These Germans are wonder spamming!! Should make a juicy capital.

thanks, yeah loads of problems with a dim future. Let me replay. Generally when you run out of things to build, do you go for fail gold or just gold if currency is available?

 

[Gumbolt]

With industrious leader if you have 100% bonus with resources fail gold is great. Wealth is better than spamming buildings. Same for units. You have loads and not even in HR. With forge and org religion 200% bonus on hammers if you have marble or stone? Downside is waiting for ai to build wonder. Wonders like moai can be spammed on coastal cities. You could easily get 500 fail gold. Same for chops. 30H becomes 60-90. Sometimes i pre chop forest for fail gold in marginal cities. Fail gold is good. Harder to get on deity.

I wouldn't quit yet. See what others think. Your play was not perfect. Incas should be easiest race to play with ub, uu and financial. Such a great combo early on.

 

[5tephen]

Words of encouragement more than advice but I think you must be doing some things right to have survived until 1000AD and got lib on deity. Both these things are far from assured in my games.

 

[noontide]

Words of encouragement more than advice but I think you must be doing some things right to have survived until 1000AD and got lib on deity. Both these things are far from assured in my games.

Yeah thanks but it’s a bit of cheese, with Inca you can spam 5-6 unit warrior units after the first worker and just rush the nearest AI, which in this case again I lucked out with English as opposed to a protective civ or capital on hill.

 

[Fippy]

Well Freddy should get a crappy gift city.
I edited something out cos it was blunt..but you really need some basics before taking on deity.
Nothing can be done about this game imo.

 

[noontide]

I tried again and this time I think it's a bit better. Ready to pop Liberalism at 860AD, have 9 cities and are on "pleased" term with Greek, Roman and Sitting Bull. Since my army is really weak, should I shoot for science victory? Save file attached. Thanks again.

I've done these things differently:

1. had more workers out doing improvement/chopping in first 50 turns.
2. built the Great Wall and managed to get a good chunk of fail gold to speed up race to get Great Light House in London
3. gave stone to Roman after Pyramid to make him happy
4. prioritize Alphabet (to trade techs) and Currency (so to generate gold when having nothing to build)
5. spent more time to open up map and on diplomacy to keep Roman and Germany happy, gave Germany Paper for free when it dropped to "Cautious"

 

[Gumbolt]

Hmm that isn't an inland lake. How weird.

Still not sure how you plan to win this. Your 2 best cities don't have your religion yet your in pacifism and caste. London could be running 3 food resources and getting plenty of GS. No Pacifism bonus!

You need a bulbing strategy for deity to try and stay ahead. Your capital still looks under developed. Your improving mountain tiles to give windmills when your capital lacks cottages.

What have you against Civil service? On a good game I aim for 1ad for this tech. Bureau is such a strong civic.

Still not sure about your moai city. It only have 5 sea tiles.

If your planning science victory on deity you will struggle to ever win at this level. The Ai get huge bonuses at each new era and will spam massive stacks later on. That plus the fact they have much more land and will out tech you hugely. I wonder if you should of taken advantage of roman's continual wars. They can't fight on 2 fronts. You had ivory too.

I don't get a your great person strategy. 2xGE sitting there. What are they going to do? One has been sat there for many many turns.

When should you run a golden age on deity? I would of thought before now. Maybe someone else can help on this debate.

It looks like you have abused your unique unit here to take out English then just waited for something to happen. You won't be able to do that on other races. In fact with the UU you should not really need great wall. 100% bonus vs archers?

 

[Gumbolt]

One thing i do like about Incas. Early Terraces. +2 culture. Then =4 culture after 1000 years. Which at start is pretty easy to do.

Why is your sheep not connected by road? You have health issues too in your capital.

I count about 5-6 forest around your capital? Why keep it? I guess health but you can build Aqueducts and other buildings to help.

Resources for gold? Germans, Aztec and Romans could give you +20 gpt. You could also trade for resources. 20GPT is a lot of lost gold a turn.

Deity requires a high level of micro and a plan at every stage on how to win. What will be my next war? What is next tech I need? Which techs should I be bulbing? Who do I want as a friend whose land should I be taking? Planning science victory is not showing ambition.

 

[noontide]

Hmm that isn't an inland lake. How weird.

Still not sure how you plan to win this. Your 2 best cities don't have your religion yet your in pacifism and caste. London could be running 3 food resources and getting plenty of GS. No Pacifism bonus!

You need a bulbing strategy for deity to try and stay ahead. Your capital still looks under developed. Your improving mountain tiles to give windmills when your capital lacks cottages.

What have you against Civil service? On a good game I aim for 1ad for this tech. Bureau is such a strong civic.

Still not sure about your moai city. It only have 5 sea tiles.

If your planning science victory on deity you will struggle to ever win at this level. The Ai get huge bonuses at each new era and will spam massive stacks later on. That plus the fact they have much more land and will out tech you hugely. I wonder if you should of taken advantage of roman's continual wars. They can't fight on 2 fronts. You had ivory too.

I don't get a your great person strategy. 2xGE sitting there. What are they going to do? One has been sat there for many many turns.

When should you run a golden age on deity? I would of thought before now. Maybe someone else can help on this debate.

It looks like you have abused your unique unit here to take out English then just waited for something to happen. You won't be able to do that on other races. In fact with the UU you should not really need great wall. 100% bonus vs archers?

Good suggestions, thanks. I'll try again. I know I'm probably at the Deity level yet but I figure that's how I learn, by playing it.

 

[noontide]

I think this is probably a better effort. Germany popped Liberalism at 10AD, which is a bit disheartening. But luckily he did not go the military route. Bad thing is Greek is wiping out Roman and it becomes vassal of Germany. I've massed an army at Roman's border and looks like I have to fight them both. Do I attack now or wait till Rifle? Thanks.

 

[Gumbolt]

Go for it backstab Romans/Germans. Romans have no big stacks. German stack would be on way to Greece anyway. No need for rifles with cannons. You can add rifles once you have them. You have loads of cannons here anyway. Ideally should eb whipping units to support army. At the end of this everyone will hate you. Sooner or later Greeks would of attacked you anyway.

 

[Fippy]

Jumbos are one of the most powerful units, if you get Ivory early you should usually use them (with Cats).
But yup your cannons stack looks good.

Pikes are important, should get some against Knights. Or Eles.

 

[noontide]

Jumbos are one of the most powerful units, if you get Ivory early you should usually use them (with Cats).
But yup your cannons stack looks good.

Pikes are important, should get some against Knights. Or Eles.

What's Jumbo? Elephants?

 

[noontide]

Now I seem to have another problem.

For a while the war was going well. I pushed right and Greek pushed left on Germany. I figure even if I take Berlin it would starve and flip eventually cause I'm not at a point where I can wipe it out, and I don't have the tech to cross ocean yet. So I let Greek take Berlin. But inexplicably Greek accepted a peace offer right after, even though it could have wiped out Germany with sheer number. That got me really worried. Greek was lagging behind me in tech but it has absolute numbers so I cannot fight it. So I had to gift critical techs and cities to placate it. I kept on pushing right and secured that portion of the land, but by now Germany has riflemen, cannon, zepplin and machine gun and I cannot crack it. I tried to ask for peace with Germany. It won't become my vassal, and refuse to give any meaningful tech, but I'm still worried about Greek DoW on me so I accepted. Now with railway online I feel I can soon take on Greek, but I found out Germany became Sitting Bull's vassal. Why does it do that? So maybe I should not give Germany peace, as Sitting Bull is less likely to go to war with me by accepting Germany as vassal? Anyway this really worries me as Germany is way ahead of me in tech, Sitting Bull now has two vassals with vast land, even if I take out Greek Sitting Bull could run away.

So should I keep after war tech and wipe out Greek or should I pull back and race Sitting Bull for tech? Thanks.

 

[Gumbolt]

My initial thoughts are you posted an 1130ad save and now were at 1610ad. Now to fill in the gaps as to what happened? That is a huge number of turns.

You have clearly grabbed quite a few cities. Should you of headed to Berlin to start with? Take out the biggest cities first. Giving away Berlin feels heart breaking as it had 4 wonders albeit most obsolete.

Did you use nationalism to draft rifles? A stack of 20 for deity seems tiny. Most of your cities have happiness issues too due to emancipation and war unhappiness.

Your fighting against machine guns. At this stage I think you needed to beeline infantry or artillery. Machine guns will hold off cannons and rifles. Even with CR2 you had 11% odds. Not great and machine guns don't take collateral? Your tech has barely advanced in 500 years. Machine guns won't win you a war.

I can't see your current stack taking that city. You fight deity wars in stages. Fight a war grab land. Rebuild find a new tech that gives a military advantage and start again.

My view would of been to neutralise the Germans. Then target Greeks in next war as they will lag in tech. You will struggle here.

 

[noontide]

My initial thoughts are you posted an 1130ad save and now were at 1610ad. Now to fill in the gaps as to what happened? That is a huge number of turns.

You have clearly grabbed quite a few cities. Should you of headed to Berlin to start with? Take out the biggest cities first. Giving away Berlin feels heart breaking as it had 4 wonders albeit most obsolete.

Did you use nationalism to draft rifles? A stack of 20 for deity seems tiny. Most of your cities have happiness issues too due to emancipation and war unhappiness.

Your fighting against machine guns. At this stage I think you needed to beeline infantry or artillery. Machine guns will hold off cannons and rifles. Even with CR2 you had 11% odds. Not great and machine guns don't take collateral? Your tech has barely advanced in 500 years. Machine guns won't win you a war.

I can't see your current stack taking that city. You fight deity wars in stages. Fight a war grab land. Rebuild find a new tech that gives a military advantage and start again.

My view would of been to neutralise the Germans. Then target Greeks in next war as they will lag in tech. You will struggle here.

Yes, drafting would be a good idea, I forgot that. Also my tech path is all over the place once the war started cause I'm not good at multi-tasking. Let me follow your advice and replay. Thanks again!