Democratic Succesion Game

[dutchfire]

May non-players post?

Sure, and it's never to late to become a player

If yes,consider move the settler 1 west, loses 1 turn
but gets +1 grass/hills and the cows.
Best regards,

It also loses access to the sea, meaning the city won't be able to build a lighthouse (making the lake tile 3 2) and a harbor.
I would prefer to let another city take the cow. (I also have good hopes for some seafood in the sea near the cow, making it a nice specialist farm).

On the main question, wonders:
Pyramids, always nice, but expensive.
Great Wall, cheap, but I don't really like the Great Spy points it gives. Not really useful if we're going to play peaceful.
Stonehenge, cheap culture, great prophet points are always nice.
Great Library, later, so we'll have plenty of workers to chop, and it's possibly the best wonder in the game. I've also found it easy to get since most AIs delay Aesthetics.

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

Asoka of India!

Okay, so we're Spiritual and Organized, our UU is the Fast Worker, and our UB is the Maussoleum, a improved jail. We start with Mysticism and Mining.

Organized with it's cheap lighthouses and courthouses screams for REXing, especially in BtS were rapid expansion is a viable, if not superior alternative to early war.

Our starting position is also typically BtS, with some many forests. The real question is, which wonder will we try to get?

By the way, should we settle in place? I think we won't be on the river, so we won't be able to build a levee 5000 years from now. Then again, I usually settle in place because the map generator usually gives you the best spot.


Starting techs, I'm thinking of Agriculture (obviously) - Bronze Working.
Starting build, a (fast ) worker to get our farm up quickly?


I'll try to play the first couple of turns tomorrow, around 5-10 PM GMT.

View attachment 171520

Tough call, may want to consider plains hill for first city or see what warrior finds when he moves onto the cow...

 

[Joe Harker]

Settle where you are, we have sea access, fresh water and you can build a canal from one side to the other, using the lake and a fort on the forest plain 2S 1W of the settlers positions.

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

Settle where you are, we have sea access, fresh water and you can build a canal from one side to the other, using the lake and a fort on the forest plain 2S 1W of the settlers positions.

I totally missed that aspect, lol. I guess I don't get that far in my games...I lose interest in the Late Industrial, as the outcome becomes "obvious"...However, you're absolutely right, we should settle right where we are for this obvious eventual advantage!

 

[Methos]

Settle where you are, we have sea access, fresh water and you can build a canal from one side to the other, using the lake and a fort on the forest plain 2S 1W of the settlers positions.

Good call.

I hate losing the cow, but hopefully there's a great potential second city there.

 

[Conroe]

lurker's comment: You can still build the canal if you move 1W. As for losing a 3F lake tile by moving, you gain a 4F/2H tile by moving. You also gain a 4th grassland hill, in a city that has the food to work all of them.

But, I would suggest putting the Warrior up on the hill before deciding. You may be able to get a better feel for any potential 2nd site that could use the cow tile. And more importantly, you may get a feel for what sort of map you have. First impressions are an archipelago ... in which case, you'd definitely want your capital to be coastal.

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

So, how did the turn go? Any results?

More thoughts on start: We're clearly in the South, and the land gets worse to our SE (Tundra to ice). I would move warrior to the hill and then follow coast North

 

[dutchfire]

I played until the discovery of Agriculture (9 turns), since we have to decide what to research next.

I decided to settle in place. First of all, moving west would lose 1 on the lake tile, for ever. Settling in place does not lose the cows, they can easily be picked up by another city. Looking at the map, I think I made the right decision.

Turn 0: Warrior moves to the cow, settle in place, start agriculture & worker
Turn 1: Warrior pops a map of the sea from a goodie hut. That helped a lot
Turn 5: Delhi's borders expand, popping a hut and giving us a free 34 gold I move the warrior to another goodie hut and he pops the Wheel .
Turn 9: Agriculture finished, start Bronze Working as a placeholder, we can still decide what to do. I moved the warrior on a plains forest hill since he is facing a bear. Let's hope he survives.
End of Session

It looks like we're on a snakey continent (no other civs contacted yet), with a lot of plains near us . I'm happy I picked up the extra food in the capital, we'll need every piece of bread we can get. How about the Great Lighthouse (+Collosus?) as the destination for our forests? We'll probably have a lot of seaside cities.

I think that spot is the best place for our next city.
City tile: +2
Cow: +2
Farmed corn: +2 (irrigated IIRC, so initially +1)
------------------
+5/6

2 scientists -4
1/2 grassland mines -1/-2
------------------
food neutral

That's a pretty decent city

I think our next build should be a warrior, to let the city grow a bit and for scouting purposes. Research should probably be bronze working.

Next up: Joe Harker

View attachment demogame 3 BC-3640.CivBeyondSwordSave

 

[Joe Harker]

I am planning to play about 1900 GMT tomorrow. (i checked if i could open the starting save yesterday and it worked! )

BTW i agree with the position of our second city. The only other place is 2S 3E of our captial, to get both beavers and the deer although it is squashed in by the capital and has a few tundra tiles. Bronze Working would also be my prefered next tech.

Possible later city is 7N 4W, get both cows and gold, although i will scout the region tomorrow.

 

[Conroe]

I decided to settle in place. First of all, moving west would lose 1 on the lake tile, for ever. Settling in place does not lose the cows, they can easily be picked up by another city. Looking at the map, I think I made the right decision.

I'm sorry if my comments offended you. I agree that you did make the right decision. That was the point that I was trying to make ... try and get a feel for the map before deciding. I guess I could have phrased it better.

How about the Great Lighthouse (+Collosus?) as the destination for our forests?

I really like the GLH. With the changes they made in BTS to foreign trade routes, this wonder on this map could be really huge. Especially once Harbors start getting built.

 

[dutchfire]

I am planning to play about 1900 GMT tomorrow. (i checked if i could open the starting save yesterday and it worked! )

BTW i agree with the position of our second city. The only other place is 2S 3E of our captial, to get both beavers and the deer although it is squashed in by the capital and has a few tundra tiles. Bronze Working would also be my prefered next tech.

Possible later city is 7N 4W, get both cows and gold, although i will scout the region tomorrow.

Could you play until we finish BW? That'd put us at another decision point.
I think our first warrior should go to the grassland hill E of the deer, to see if there's any seafood there. I also think 3S 3E is better than 2S 3E, as it changes a grassland flatland for a grassland hill. But we can only be sure once we see the rest of the land there.

I'm sorry if my comments offended you. I agree that you did make the right decision. That was the point that I was trying to make ... try and get a feel for the map before deciding. I guess I could have phrased it better.

I really like the GLH. With the changes they made in BTS to foreign trade routes, this wonder on this map could be really huge. Especially once Harbors start getting built.

No problem at all, I didn't find your comments offensive. I just wanted to give the reasons for my decision. We're here to learn after all, and solid discussion is the best way to achieve that.

About trade routes, the custom house will further boost trade route income later in the game.



6000th post, I'm getting old...

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

We're looking great so far!

I agree with bronze working. Hopefully, we can time it so our first worker can chop another worker ASAP, then gun for Animal Husbandry and Ship Building for the GLH.

 

[Joe Harker]

Could you play until we finish BW? That'd put us at another decision point.

Sure.

I think our first warrior should go to the grassland hill E of the deer, to see if there's any seafood there. I also think 3S 3E is better than 2S 3E, as it changes a grassland flatland for a grassland hill. But we can only be sure once we see the rest of the land there.

If there isn't any sea food, or other resource, settle 2S 3E?

 

[dutchfire]

We're looking great so far!

I agree with bronze working. Hopefully, we can time it so our first worker can chop another worker ASAP, then gun for Animal Husbandry and Ship Building for the GLH.

I'd say:

Builds: Worker (current) - Warrior (grow city) 2x - Settler
Techs: Bronze Working - Hunting (for deer) - Animal Husbandry (for cows) - Fishing - Sailing

We don't really need a second worker yet.

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

I see 3 possible city sweet spots based on what we know of the map already:

1) The spot highlighted already
2) Either 3S 3E or 2S 3E based on possible sea food.
3) 6N 4W -> this one has mega production potential, but will grow slow initially and for a long time, unless there is another food resource near there.

 

[Joe Harker]

Played last night.

Turn 1) Warrior loses to bear (5N3W).

Turn 7) Worker produced farm corn (1E). Delhi now producing warrior (15 turns)

Turn 11) Worker finished farm and builds road (2 turns) (1E), Bronze Working in two turns.

Turn 13) Bronze Working finished, placed pottery as a preminary tech, worker finishes road (1E), needs new orders.

(All coordinates from capital)

Next!

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

I will play tonight!

FYI: I am a strong proponent of cottage spamming. Any one strongly opposed? Should I play through pottery or through hunting?

Do we want to chop a settler next or a worker or a barracks?

I love to chop...I think that we should put a cottage at 2E and at 1S 2E. Thoughts?

My own recent thoughts...
Move worker to mine GLFH (Grassland Forested Hill) at 1N
Build order: Warrior continued until size hits 3, then switch to Settler, using the chop from the mining to pop the settler a little earlier, then finish Warrior, send settler to city plot 1N3W, build another warrior, send first to explore the SE, send second warrior exploring to the NNW
Future worker moves would be to create a cottage on the GLFH 1S1E, then additional cottages at 1S2E and 2E.

 

[Methos]

I find it odd that we're spiritual, yet didn't go for an early religion. We should have been able to grab at least one of them fairly easily. Note that Christianity has already been founded, so there is at least one other spiritual civ in the game.

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

Methos raises a great point. Personally, I have started drifting away from founding religions in my SP games, but I don't play spiritual civs that much anymore. I believe that the approach we have taken, though benefits early expansion at the expense of future monetary gains from an early religion.

However, what does the team want me to do at this point when I play the turns? Should I keep on the path of Pottery->Hunting->Animal Husbandry->Fishing->Sailing and then switch to a religion or switch to attempt to get to Monotheism first, which would involve dropping Pottery and going with Polytheism->Masonry->Monotheism?

 

[Methos]

Going for one of the early religions now wouldn't be very wise. Christianity has already been founded and since we've checked 'Pick your religion' (I like that by the way), we don't know which tech was learned. If we went for one of them now it would be a major gamble, as we could research the wrong tech.

My point was mainly that it was something we missed at the beginning. I missed it too.

At this point I'd probably continue on with our current plan and grab a religion with CoL. Granted I typically don't play spiritual civs, so I have very little experience with them. Hopefully someone else here (player or lurker) has more experience with spiritual.