Design: Heroes

[woodelf]

I might double its movement penalty, so it can get mobility upgrades but they will only be half as effective for it. Does that sound fair?

Yeah, that would work.

Better make sure if it attacks a city and kills the last defender that it doesn't autoraze when entering that tile!

 

[Chalid]

Yeah, that would work.

Better make sure if it attacks a city and kills the last defender that it doesn't autoraze when entering that tile!

Maybe not always Autoraze, but reduce population by 3 or 4?

 

[woodelf]

Maybe not always Autoraze, but reduce population by 3 or 4?

and

Very nice idea.

 

[Corlindale]

I thought a bit about a possible change to the Pacify spell for Corlindale, and was inspired a little by the "Forgetfulness" spell from Heroes of Might & Magic III. Perhaps it could be a spell somewhat akin to "Rust", giving a 50% decrease in strength, but only apply when the unit attacked. This would illustrate the pacifistic feelings the spell would cause in at least part of the soldiers. This would obviously prevent the abuse of the spell we discussed earlier. I don't know how the "pacified" condition should be recovered from, perhaps the "returning to barracks" cure could still apply, this time symbolizing military conditioning and renewal of discipline.

 

[woodelf]

Dammit, I want my own Hero! Someone who attracts Wood Nymphs, plays with Satyrs, and generally loafs off all day!

 

[Kael]

I thought a bit about a possible change to the Pacify spell for Corlindale, and was inspired a little by the "Forgetfulness" spell from Heroes of Might & Magic III. Perhaps it could be a spell somewhat akin to "Rust", giving a 50% decrease in strength, but only apply when the unit attacked. This would illustrate the pacifistic feelings the spell would cause in at least part of the soldiers. This would obviously prevent the abuse of the spell we discussed earlier. I don't know how the "pacified" condition should be recovered from, perhaps the "returning to barracks" cure could still apply, this time symbolizing military conditioning and renewal of discipline.

Corlindale will already be able to charm opponents, making them unable to attack. Why would he use a spell that decreased their attack power when they attacked instead?

Along the same lines, should the spell that makes a unit unable to attack and has a 10% chance of wearing off every turn be called "Charm Person", "Pacify" or is another name better?

 

[Kael]

Dammit, I want my own Hero! Someone who attracts Wood Nymphs, plays with Satyrs, and generally loafs off all day!

He sits in the cities and everytime you try to make him do something he says "One minute, just let me reply to this thread first" and never ends up leaving the city.

if you would like to name a hero I have no problem with that, but "Woodelf" isn't a very good name for a hero. We could do "<whatever> the Wood Elf" as the name of the 2nd fellowship hero if you would like.

ps what in the world is your avatar a picture of?

 

[Corlindale]

Why would he use a spell that decreased their attack power when they attacked instead?

I suppose the only reason would be that Charm will eventually break, and it's hard to foresee when that will happen. But you're probably right.

Charm Person should stay Charm Person. It's an old D&D classic, and most people will be able to easily identify it through that name.

I still want a unique spell called Pacify, though. I just need to come up with the right effect.

 

[Kael]

I suppose the only reason would be that Charm will eventually break, and it's hard to foresee when that will happen. But you're probably right.

Charm Person should stay Charm Person. It's an old D&D classic, and most people will be able to easily identify it through that name.

I still want a unique spell called Pacify, though. I just need to come up with the right effect.

Im with you. There isnt much maneuvering room between charm person and the negative buff spells we already have. Ill noodle on it too and see if I can think of anything.

 

[Kael]

Summon Hero?

I was thinking of making the rank 3 metamagic summon produce a permanent hero. The first civ that summons him gets him and after that point the spell is useless. What do you guys think?

 

[Chalid]

That one should be a very special Hero me thinks...
I'd throw the following things in: The Guys Abilities Depend on the Abilities of the Caster. I think with the SDK we can change them Dynamically. So eg. the Caster Has Earth 2 => Hero has Strenght 8 Caster Earth 3 => Hero Strenght 12 and so on. By this means the human Player wont beeline for that Hero too much. We just have to save the changes somewhere...

And I'd like him to look quite magical

 

[woodelf]

He sits in the cities and everytime you try to make him do something he says "One minute, just let me reply to this thread first" and never ends up leaving the city.

if you would like to name a hero I have no problem with that, but "Woodelf" isn't a very good name for a hero. We could do "<whatever> the Wood Elf" as the name of the 2nd fellowship hero if you would like.

ps what in the world is your avatar a picture of?

I can see him very good at persuading others. If someone can come up with a good woodelf name I'd be thrilled. I was always Yvain in other games so that would work.

My avatar is the Pied Piper of Hamelin. Or something close to that.

 

[Corlindale]

If someone can come up with a good woodelf name I'd be thrilled.

My wood elf ranger in Morrowind was named Aldorien Leranthirr. Don't know if it's good, though. It's really just my generic name for elven druid and ranger characters when I play RPGs.

 

[woodelf]

My wood elf ranger in Morrowind was named Aldorien Leranthirr. Don't know if it's good, though. It's really just my generic name for elven druid and ranger characters when I play RPGs.

Either the first or the last name would work with "the Woodelf". Thanks.

 

[loki1232]

Cool, sounds like terrain destruction is it. If the War Machine moves into an enemy tile it will automatically destroy all improvements, routes, jungles, forests and new forests in that tile. The War Machine will get xp for destroying cottages, hamlets, villages and towns.

I think that they should also level hills. Nothing can stand in their way.

 

[loki1232]

That one should be a very special Hero me thinks...
I'd throw the following things in: The Guys Abilities Depend on the Abilities of the Caster. I think with the SDK we can change them Dynamically. So eg. the Caster Has Earth 2 => Hero has Strenght 8 Caster Earth 3 => Hero Strenght 12 and so on. By this means the human Player wont beeline for that Hero too much. We just have to save the changes somewhere...

And I'd like him to look quite magical

I think it would be more balanced if it got once strength for each spell it could cast--12 spells = 12 strength. The summoned hero would get some cool abilities. What if it were a demon for an evil civ and an angel for a good civ. A neutral civ gets a big monkey.

Demon-Higher strength (1.5 points of strength per spell, rounded down), demonic spells. When next to enemy cities can eat its population and summon a lesser demon. Can create entrances to hell. Deals collateral damage.

Angel-All terrain (including water). Some spells. Marksman. Kinda like a holy assasin. High bonus against demons. Starts with command. Gives the city it is in a sheild from all armegeddon spells. High movement and blitz.

Monkey-Not sure. maybe can become a "copy" of any other living hero?

 

[Chalid]

My above chosen Example was not very good i believe..
I thought not only about raw Strength but giving other Abilities to:
Examples:
Caster has Nature Sphere: Hero gains Defense bonus in wood,
Caster has Air Sphere -> Hero gains retreat possibility points,
caster has water Sphere at level 2 -> hero can enter coast tiles,
Caster has Force Spher-> Hero gains collateral Damage
Caster has Body Sphere -> hero gains Additional first strikes
... to be continued

And maybe 5 Raw strength +1 per two spell Sphere promotions of the caster?

 

[Corlindale]

I think that they should also level hills. Nothing can stand in their way.

Wouldn't that be a bit over the top? A hill most likely has rocky foundations, the machine would have to be insanely heavy/powerful to actually level a hill, and the process would most likely produce massive earthquakes in all surrounding tiles as well. Of course realism might not be highest priority in a fantasy mod, but to me it would seem a bit odd to have the machine levelling a hill covering many square miles. .

 

[Kael]

For me it brought out the question, where does the hill go? At which point I considered pushing the hill to the next tile, which although interesting, makes the war machine seem like someone has snuck a bulldozer into FfH. And I didnt want anyone to confuse our awesome death machine with a medieval tonka truck.

 

[loki1232]

For me it brought out the question, where does the hill go?

My idea was that it simply gets pushed into the ground. Just kidding.